SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
You should memorize Jeremiah 31.
ECT the charade about 'saved' in Rom 11
- Thread starter Interplanner
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You should memorize Jeremiah 31.
Interplanner
Well-known member
The LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS is Jesus. He did something that made it possible for us to recieve the righteousness of God in him.
The NT interp of the OT is the official meaning, sorry for those of you stuck in the neo-Judaism of 2P2P.
He does? Paul went to the Jew first, but they rejected salvation, so he was sent to the gentile instead to make Israel jealous. Are you sure you are talking about Romans 11? Because Romans 11 says why MAD happened. To drive them to jealousy.
beloved57
Well-known member
dan p
Thats the Church,the Body of Christ it shall be saved !
Rom 11:27
[FONT="]For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
That occured when Christ came Jn 1:29
[/FONT][FONT="]The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
Thats when Israels sins were taken away, by the sacrifice of the Lamb of God
Again 1 Jn 3:5
[/FONT][FONT="]And ye know that he was manifested to [/FONT]take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
Our sins here is Israel ! But this Israel is made up of Christ's Body the Church
Thats the Church,the Body of Christ it shall be saved !
Rom 11:27
[FONT="]For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
That occured when Christ came Jn 1:29
[/FONT][FONT="]The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.
Thats when Israels sins were taken away, by the sacrifice of the Lamb of God
Again 1 Jn 3:5
[/FONT][FONT="]And ye know that he was manifested to [/FONT]take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
Our sins here is Israel ! But this Israel is made up of Christ's Body the Church
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Made up, or stolen from one of your 364 dusty books on the subject.
Interplanner
Well-known member
Jerry Shugart
Well-known member
" And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins" (Ro.11:26-27).
When we look at the "covenant" spoken about in this passage we can know what "saved" means:
"Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD: But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more" (Jer.31:31-33).
Here we read that the "fathers" of those in the house of Israel and the house of Judah were the ones who broke the covenant. Those "fathers" were the physical descendants of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob so all those of the two houses will also be physical descendants of Abraham,Isaac and Jacob.
Everyone out of the house will know the Lord and will have their sins forgiven. Also, the Lord will remember their sins no longer. When this prophecy will be fulfilled then all of Israel will be saved.
It is evident to anyone with an open mind that the salvation being spoken of here is the salvation of the soul.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Watch your language, Lamont.
Rondonmonson
New member
All Israel will be Saved means that Israel as a "NATION" turns back to God, just like Malachi 4:5-6 says, Elijah will turn Israel back to God before the Day of the Lord (Gods Wrath). Just as Zechariah 12 especially 12:10 says and just as Zechariah 13:1 says. There were still Righteous men when God turned his back on Israel, but Israel as a Nation had turned its back on God. Likewise, not every JEW will accept Jesus as their Messiah, just like all Gentiles will never accept him, BUT....Israel as a Nation turns back to God, and God turns back to them. Of course this happens after the times of the Gentiles is fulfilled (when the Church is Raptured to Heaven) Israel REPENTS and then when the Abomination of Desolation happens, God protects Israel and feeds them for 1260 Days, when they FLEE Jerusalem, unto the Wilderness.
Israel accepts Jesus as their Messiah, just like Daniels 70 Week Decree says will happen, before the 70th week passes, Israel MUST ATONE FOR THEIR SINS.....BEFORE !! Its obvious.
Nope.
Paul was not sent to the Gentiles because Israel rejected his preaching to them.
Saved after he was concluded in spiritual UNCircumcision with UNBelieving Israel, Paul was then sent to both Jew and Gentile each in their spiritual UNCircumcision.
And it was not because of any rejection on Israel's part.
Rather, in line with said rejection.
Big difference.
11 I say then, have they stumbled that they should fall? Certainly not! But through their fall, to provoke them to jealousy, salvation has come to the Gentiles.
"But now", that means not before.
42 So when the Jews went out of the synagogue, the Gentiles begged that these words might be preached to them the next Sabbath. 43 Now when the congregation had broken up, many of the Jews and devout proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas, who, speaking to them, persuaded them to continue in the grace of God.
44 On the next Sabbath almost the whole city came together to hear the word of God. 45 But when the Jews saw the multitudes, they were filled with envy; and contradicting and blaspheming, they opposed the things spoken by Paul. 46 Then Paul and Barnabas grew bold and said, “It was necessary that the word of God should be spoken to you first; but since you reject it, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, behold, we turn to the Gentiles.
"But now", that means not before.
42 So when the Jews went out of the synagogue, the Gentiles begged that these words might be preached to them the next Sabbath. 43 Now when the congregation had broken up, many of the Jews and devout proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas, who, speaking to them, persuaded them to continue in the grace of God.
44 On the next Sabbath almost the whole city came together to hear the word of God. 45 But when the Jews saw the multitudes, they were filled with envy; and contradicting and blaspheming, they opposed the things spoken by Paul. 46 Then Paul and Barnabas grew bold and said, “It was necessary that the word of God should be spoken to you first; but since you reject it, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, behold, we turn to the Gentiles.
Interplanner
Well-known member
But in 11:30 it is clear that God does not deal with ethnes any more. Everything is done through Christ. The Israel of v26 is all people who believe, and 'saved' in Romans always means justification from sins. It does not mean a restored Davidic theocracy.
You have several other elements that you are locating in the future, but the NT does not do this. They took place in the destruction of Israel in the 6th decade of the 1st century because of Israel's rejection of the mission of the Gospel.
No NT passage about the 2nd coming in judgement has any Judaic details to it, for ex., 2 Pet 3.
Rondonmonson
New member
All Israel means ALL ISRAEL. It has nothing to do with the Church. This is why you guys get confused about the Rapture and everything else. You want to replace Israel with the Church. IT AIN'T HAPPENING.
Interplanner
Well-known member
But there is another Israel, and always was meant to be, so there is no confusion, until you are 2P2P and come to Rom 9 or Galatians in general. Not all Israel is Israel, and the "us" at the end of the chapter is supported by 4 OT passages as being Jew and Gentile.
There is way too little about a 'rapture' to develope a doctrine. it is folly. In one passage, it was meant to be subjective: the delight at hearing the greeting from an old friend. There is, of course, the removal of the Christians from Judea in 69 during the pause in the war on the Romans side.
As far as replacement goes, you have to come to terms with Heb 8 of course, which says so. In the broader picture, it is not a replacement so much as a return to what was there originally in gen 3-12, before the land and law part made it hard to follow.
In addition, Gal 3:17 shows that some people in Paul's time (guess who) were positioning the law to replace and void the Promise. That's what needs to be corrected.