Thanks Bob

[PKevman]

He lied to you about nearly 800 weapons inspections at some 550 sites throughout Iraq, too. He lied to you about the reasons we went to war, the conditions under which we went to war and the casualties inflicted and sustained by the war.

Will you also read the congressional documents posted, do some research on Iraqi weapons inspections, and consider that as well?

Sure, but to me it's not a particularly important topic and never has been. I still believe Saddam was a wicked man and I've seen tons of evidence for that fact.

It also has nothing to do with the fact that millions of unborn babies are put to death in our country and that this needs to stop.

 

[S†ephen]

Sure, but to me it's not a particularly important topic and never has been.

It also has nothing to do with the fact that millions of unborn babies are put to death in our country and that this needs to stop.

I think his point is that if he's right on this maybe he could be right on some (cough) other things (cough)

 

[sopwith21]

You obviously have no clue how oppressive the Chinese government really is.

Doc I like you, but I honestly think based upon this statement that you take your freedom for granted.

When this stuff happens in China, its a horrid, unthinkable violation of parental rights. When it happens here, 95% of us don't even know it and the other 5% excuse it.

Parents Must Immunize Their Children Or Go To Jail
By Mark Century
Prince Georges County, MD
Nov 16, 2007

1,600 school children and their parents have been ordered to appear in circuit court this Saturday where health workers will immediately force them to receive required shots. Parents who don't bring their children to court for the shots are to be jailed.

"We can do this the easy way or we can do this the hard way, but it's going to have to get done." said State Attorney Glenn Ivey.
​

 

[PKevman]

When this stuff happens in China, its a horrid, unthinkable violation of parental rights. When it happens here, 95% of us don't even know it and the other 5% excuse it.

Parents Must Immunize Their Children Or Go To Jail
By Mark Century
Prince Georges County, MD
Nov 16, 2007

1,600 school children and their parents have been ordered to appear in circuit court this Saturday where health workers will immediately force them to receive required shots. Parents who don't bring their children to court for the shots are to be jailed.

"We can do this the easy way or we can do this the hard way, but it's going to have to get done." said State Attorney Glenn Ivey.
​

Stephen, I've never condoned everything our government does. You know that. I despise the government run public schools and the high taxes we pay.

But I still don't think the Libertarian points of view are the answer. Far from it. You're fighting a straw man!

 

[sopwith21]

Sure, but to me it's not a particularly important topic and never has been.

So the issue was sufficient to justify the deaths of 1.2 million people, but "it's not a particularly important topic and never has been?" How many people must die before the topic becomes important?

1.2 million Iraqis have died in this war (as of September), which is almost identical to the 1.36 million per year that are aborted in America. Why are dead American babies a critical issue while the deaths of innocent Iraqi people are "not a particularly important topic?"

Is it not reasonable to treat them with equal importance? Does God not value the life of the average Iraqi man or woman just as much as an American baby?

 

[sopwith21]

Stephen, I've never condoned everything our government does. You know that. I despise the government run public schools and the high taxes we pay.

But I still don't think the Libertarian points of view are the answer. Far from it. You're fighting a straw man!

What about 3,200 parents in Maryland who are going to prison while their children are forcibly taken from them and shot up with drugs against their parents' wishes? Are they fighting a straw man, too?

 

[PKevman]

So the issue was sufficient to justify the deaths of 1.2 million people, but "it's not a particularly important topic and never has been?" How many people must die before the topic becomes important?

1.2 million Iraqis have died in this war (as of September), which is almost identical to the 1.36 million per year that are aborted in America. Why are dead American babies a critical issue while the deaths of innocent Iraqi people are "not a particularly important topic?"

Is it not reasonable to treat them with equal importance? Does God not value the life of the average Iraqi man or woman just as much as an American baby?

I have seen data that also says the majority of Iraqi people are happier now than when Saddam was in power. I don't believe the inflated casualities reports.

 

[drbrumley]

Sop and Stephen, we will be the ones, along with God of course to comfort the good Pastor when he finds out in heaven what was going on, been told in this life, and he rejected.

 

[PKevman]

Sop and Stephen, we will be the ones, along with God of course to comfort the good Pastor when he finds out in heaven what was going on, been told in this life, and he rejected.

Now come on Doc. That's a silly thing to say. The Bible is the book that I have spent most of my time studying. I love the Word of God and base my life on it. I am completely and totally in tune to what is going on in the world, and believe that God clearly has shown us these answers in His Word.

The answer is that we live in a sinful, broken, and fallent world that has turned its back on its Maker. The world is a wicked place because men and women need a Savior and refuse to turn to Him.

All of the rest of this stuff are a result of that truth! Wars, abortions, murders, wicked politicians, etc.....

I know that my views on politics have not affected my relationship with God in a way that would make me need comfort when God "tells me the truth".

He told us the truth in HIS WORD!

 

[sopwith21]

I have seen data that also says the majority of Iraqi people are happier now than when Saddam was in power.

I would like to see it. Also, please post polling data showing how the Iraqi people feel about the US occupation. I have done a considerable amount of research on this and I don't find the same results as you... I'd like to read your research on the topic.

I don't believe the inflated casualities reports.

So make up any number of casualties you like... what suites you? 500,000? 100,000? No, let's go lower... let's say that only 9 people in all of Iraq have died. Is that low enough for you to believe?

The question still stands.

Why are the reasons for the deaths of those 9 Iraqis "not particularly important" while the death of even a single white American baby is cause for an act of Congress (literally)?

 

[PKevman]

a single white American baby

For the moment, let me just point out to you again that this has nothing to do with white babies only. In fact abortion is affecting the black community far more than the white community. Planned Parenthood has done what it was founded to do.

 

[sopwith21]

For the moment, let me just point out to you again that this has nothing to do with white babies only.

Then it should be quite easy to answer the question...

Why are the reasons for the deaths of those 9 Iraqis "not particularly important" while the death of even a single white American baby is cause for an act of Congress (literally)?

 

[red77]

I'll review and consider the information you gave. :think:

I wouldn't be stunned if Bush lied. He lied about abortion after all.

Heck, I'd be stunned if he told the truth........

 

[drbrumley]

Sop, I have come to the conclusion for some time now, that abortion was done on purpose, the Roe v Wade thing, the Colorado state legalizing it to push it to the feds, and this is a global agenda to wipe us out. Eugenics anyone? And the plan is Chinas policy will be moved worldwide.

 

[PKevman]

I would like to see it. Also, please post polling data showing how the Iraqi people feel about the US occupation.

Now how would you feel if I said, "I'm not your secretary"? That is how you treated me when I asked you for sources. But I won't do that to you. I'll go back and pull up the research that I had on the issue. I won't have much time this weekend, but give me a few days, and I'll be glad to find the info and share it with you.

I have done a considerable amount of research on this and I don't find the same results as you... I'd like to read your research on the topic.

And I'm willing to share it.

So make up any number of casualties you like... what suites you? 500,000? 100,000? No, let's go lower... let's say that only 9 people in all of Iraq have died. Is that low enough for you to believe?

The point was that Saddam was a wicked and brutal tyrant, and should not be condoned. Why do you continue to defend him?

The question still stands.

But it doesn't my dear hardheaded friend. :chuckle:

Why are the reasons for the deaths of those 9 Iraqis "not particularly important" while the death of even a single white American baby is cause for an act of Congress (literally)?

They were the direct result of the thousands who died here in the attack on American soil. Most know that attack as 9-11.

The crazies brought the war to us, and we took the war back to them.

Why oh why do we have to debate this subject? It's never going to change and never has?

There are far more important topics by comparison. People are going to hell around us. Stand up with me and lets reach some folks for Christ here on TOL. I'd love to have you as a witnessing ally here instead of debating Ron Paul for 30 pages with you.

 

[Granite]

Then it should be quite easy to answer the question...

Why are the reasons for the deaths of those 9 Iraqis "not particularly important" while the death of even a single white American baby is cause for an act of Congress (literally)?

Because Iraqis are far away.

 

[S†ephen]

Because Iraqis are far away.

Look away Dixie land... :bannana:

 

[S†ephen]

The point was that Saddam was a wicked and brutal tyrant, and should not be condoned. Why do you continue to defend him?

He's not. His point is that one wicked and brutal tyrant attacking another wicked and brutal tyrant is hypocritical.

They were the direct result of the thousands who died here in the attack on American soil. Most know that attack as 9-11.

The crazies brought the war to us, and we took the war back to them.

Are you sure of that? What if it was your own government? Would you really want to know?

 

[PKevman]

Are you sure of that? What if it was your own government? Would you really want to know?

I stand against our wicked government. I speak against the things that go on. I despise the murder of the innocents that occur in our country. That comes from pandering to liberals and humanists, however. I don't think our government should pander to liberals and humanists, but most of the people who are allowed to get into leadership positions are liberals and humanists.

With all of that being said, I can say categorically, emphatically, 100% without a doubt that every bit of so-called evidence that the US government or George W. Bush plotted or had one thing to do with the attack on 9-11 is bogus and should be rejected. Islamic terrorists working for Osama Bin Laden hated America and have hated America for years due to our pro-Israel stance among other things. They plotted it and carried it out with the idea of striking America. Period. I don't care to debate the subject because it's a worthless dead-end topic. I'm sorry, but you and your dad will never in a million years convince me of that, and your dad has tried before.

 

[S†ephen]

you and your dad will never in a million years convince me

That I'm afraid is the problem. Too many people here are stuck to their own views. I gave Alan Keys a fair chance but the man is completely unconstitutional. He will only solve the abortion problem short term.