Seraphim, Cherubim, Living Creatures ( Beings)

[daqq]

Where are they now? I never see any

The Cherubim have four faces, that is, countenances. Look in the mirror at any given time and you will see one of the four countenances, (perhaps depending on your mood, (hehe, lol)). But two of those countenances must breathe out his last, (die), for the Master has said, "All of you shall be offended in me this night: for it is written, I will smite the Shepherd, and the sheep of the flock shall be scattered", (Mat 26:31) and the Prophet in that section continues, as it is written, "Awake, O sword, against My Shepherd, and against the one that is My fellow, says YHWH Tzabaoth: smite the Shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered; and I will turn My hand upon the little ones. And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, says YHWH, two parts therein shall be cut off and breathe his last, (die), but the third part shall be left therein. And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on My name, and I will hear them, and I will say, It is My people! and they shall say, YHWH is my Elohim!" (Zec 13:7,8,9).

Two faces or countenances must therefore die off along the Way; also, because Solomon made the Cherubim in the Oracle from olive tree or olive wood, (1Kings 6:23), it is necessary for you to become olive tree wood, (see Romans 11, (hehe)), and likewise because Solomon overlaid the Cherubim with fine gold having been tried in the fire, (1Kings 6:28), it is necessary for you to purchase from the Master the gold having been tried in the fire, (Rev 3:18, (hehe, lol)), that is, if you truly desire to enter into the holy most Holy place of the Oracle, (Heb 10:19,20, Heb 4:16, (by the new supernal Way, hehe)). And when the two countenances have died off and breathed out their last along the Way, and the third has been brought through the fire, and refined like silver, and tried as gold, then there will be two countenances left remaining: the face of a young lion, (Messiah who is with you until the consummation of your age), and the face of a man, (the new you, (hehe)), and you will be accounted a pillar in the Sanctuary of Elohim, and you will go no more out, (Rev 3:12, (hehe)). And you will stand between palm trees, indeed, a palm tree between two Cherubim: a Cherub and a palm tree, a Cherub and a palm tree, in the Sanctuary of Elohim, (Eze 41:18,19, (lol)).

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings CherubRam,

Revelation 8:13 As I watched, I heard an eagle that was flying in midair call out in a loud voice: "Woe! Woe! Woe to the inhabitants of the earth, because of the trumpet blasts about to be sounded by the other three messengers!"

What translation has “eagle”. KJV has “angel”. I believe that seraphim and cherubim are symbolic creatures, and the difference between seraphim in Isaiah 6 is that they are depicted in an aspect of judgement. There is also a link with the serpent on the pole that Moses made, and Jesus as explained in John 3:14. Because of this allusion in John 3:14, I also believe the seraphim in Isaiah 6 has a connection with Jesus in his individual role, and some aspects of this this could also be deducted from John 12. I do not believe that they are separate or distinct beings to the Angels, but that the Angels enact the role of Cherubim and Seraphim in some circumstances, for example Genesis 3:24. Other times they are static, as in the Mosaic Ark in the Most Holy.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[CherubRam]

Greetings CherubRam, What translation has “eagle”. KJV has “angel”. I believe that seraphim and cherubim are symbolic creatures, and the difference between seraphim in Isaiah 6 is that they are depicted in an aspect of judgement. There is also a link with the serpent on the pole that Moses made, and Jesus as explained in John 3:14. Because of this allusion in John 3:14, I also believe the seraphim in Isaiah 6 has a connection with Jesus in his individual role, and some aspects of this this could also be deducted from John 12. I do not believe that they are separate or distinct beings to the Angels, but that the Angels enact the role of Cherubim and Seraphim in some circumstances, for example Genesis 3:24. Other times they are static, as in the Mosaic Ark in the Most Holy.

Kind regards
Trevor

[FONT=&quot]Michael is the Eagle.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Ezekiel 1:10[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Their faces looked like this: Each of the four had the face of a human being, and on the right side each had the face of a lion, and on the left the face of an ox; each also had the face of an eagle.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Ezekiel 10:14[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Each of the cherubim had four faces: One face was that of a cherub, the second the face of a human being, the third the face of a lion, and the fourth the face of an eagle.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Revelation 4:7[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The first living creature was like a lion, the second was like an ox, the third had a face like a man, the fourth was like a flying eagle.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Revelation 8:13[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]As I watched, I heard an eagle that was flying in midair call out in a loud voice: “Woe! Woe! Woe to the inhabitants of the earth, because of the trumpet blasts about to be sounded by the other three angels!”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Some bibles say angel, others say eagle.[/FONT][FONT=&quot] https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Revelation 8:13[/FONT]

 

[CherubRam]

Greetings CherubRam, What translation has “eagle”. KJV has “angel”. I believe that seraphim and cherubim are symbolic creatures, and the difference between seraphim in Isaiah 6 is that they are depicted in an aspect of judgement. There is also a link with the serpent on the pole that Moses made, and Jesus as explained in John 3:14. Because of this allusion in John 3:14, I also believe the seraphim in Isaiah 6 has a connection with Jesus in his individual role, and some aspects of this this could also be deducted from John 12. I do not believe that they are separate or distinct beings to the Angels, but that the Angels enact the role of Cherubim and Seraphim in some circumstances, for example Genesis 3:24. Other times they are static, as in the Mosaic Ark in the Most Holy.

Kind regards
Trevor

Yahshua was the "Messenger of the Lord."

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again CherubRam,

Michael is the Eagle.
Some bibles say angel, others say eagle.

I am not sure how you deduct that Michael is the Eagle. My understanding is that the four faces represent different characteristics that are required in the spiritual man. The eagle represents Divine attributes, the lion kingly attributes and note Jesus is described as the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the ox represents service and Jesus is described as Yahweh’s Servant, and Jesus is revealed as a man, in human nature. Ezekiel 1 depicts the four faces on each individual cherubim. I cannot make much sense of Revelation 8:13 being “eagle”, even though many translations support this reading.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[Hawkins]

Cherub is the type of angels/creatures with 2 wings. Seraphim is the type of angels/creatures with 6 wings.

 

[CherubRam]

Greetings again CherubRam, I am not sure how you deduct that Michael is the Eagle. My understanding is that the four faces represent different characteristics that are required in the spiritual man. The eagle represents Divine attributes, the lion kingly attributes and note Jesus is described as the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the ox represents service and Jesus is described as Yahweh’s Servant, and Jesus is revealed as a man, in human nature. Ezekiel 1 depicts the four faces on each individual cherubim. I cannot make much sense of Revelation 8:13 being “eagle”, even though many translations support this reading.

Kind regards
Trevor

Michael comes first before the others.

Revelation 8:13
As I watched, I heard an (eagle / angel / messenger) that was flying in midair call out in a loud voice: “Woe! Woe! Woe to the inhabitants of the earth, because of the trumpet blasts about to be sounded by the other three angels!”

Enoch 40, "This first is Michael, the merciful and long-suffering:"

 

[CherubRam]

[FONT=&quot]The four persons around the throne of God are called Seraphim, Cherubim, and Living Beings or Living Creatures. KJV calls them “Beast.” The four faces of those persons are their attributes. ( Eagle, Ox, Lion, Man.)[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Ezekiel 1:6[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]but each of them had four faces and four wings.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Ezekiel 1:8[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Under their wings on their four sides they had human hands. All four of them had faces and wings,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Ezekiel 10:21[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Each had four faces and four wings, and under their wings was what looked like human hands.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Isaiah 6:2[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Above him were seraphim, each with six wings: With two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they were flying.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Revelation 4:8[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Each of the four living creatures had six wings and was covered with eyes all around, even under its wings. Day and night they never stop saying: “‘Holy, holy, holy is the Lord God Almighty,’ who was, and is, and is to come.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Isaiah 6:3[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]And they were calling to one another: “Holy, holy, holy is the Lord Almighty; the whole earth is full of his glory.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Revelation 4:8[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Each of the four living creatures had six wings and was covered with eyes all around, even under its wings. Day and night they never stop saying: “‘Holy, holy, holy is the Lord God Almighty,’ who was, and is, and is to come.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The Cherubim with four wings on earth[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Ezekiel 10[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]3 Now the cherubim were standing on the south side of the temple when the man went in, and a cloud filled the inner court. 4 Then the glory of the Lord rose from above the cherubim and moved to the threshold of the temple. The cloud filled the temple, and the court was full of the radiance of the glory of the Lord. 5 The sound of the wings of the cherubim could be heard as far away as the outer court, like the voice of God Almighty when he speaks.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Chapter 40 Book of Enoch. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]1 And after that I saw thousands of thousands and ten thousand times ten thousand, I saw a multitude 2 beyond number and reckoning, who stood before the Lord of Spirits. And on the four sides of the Lord of Spirits I saw four presence's, [different from those that sleep not,] ( The difference between those that sleep not, is those that need sleep ) and I learnt their names: for the angel that went with me made known to me their names, and showed me all the hidden things. 3 And I heard the voices of those four presences as they uttered praises before the Lord of glory. 4,5 The first voice blesses the Lord of Spirits forever and ever. And the second voice I heard blessing 6 the Elect One and the elect ones who hang upon the Lord of Spirits. And the third voice I heard pray and intercede for those who dwell on the earth and supplicate in the name of the Lord of Spirits. 7 And I heard the fourth voice fending off the Satan's and forbidding them to come before the Lord 8 of Spirits to accuse them who dwell on the earth. After that I asked the angel of peace who went with me, who showed me everything that is hidden: 'Who are these four presences which I have 9 seen and whose words I have heard and written down?' And he said to me: 'This first is Michael, the merciful and long-suffering: and the second, who is set over all the diseases and all the wounds of the children of men, is Raphael: and the third, who is set over all the powers, is Gabriel: and the fourth, who is set over the repentance unto hope of those who inherit eternal life, is named Phanuel.' 10 And these are the four angels of the Lord of Spirits and the four voices I heard in those days... [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again CherubRam,

Michael comes first before the others.
Revelation 8:13
As I watched, I heard an (eagle / angel / messenger) that was flying in midair call out in a loud voice: “Woe! Woe! Woe to the inhabitants of the earth, because of the trumpet blasts about to be sounded by the other three angels!”
Enoch 40, "This first is Michael, the merciful and long-suffering:"

I do not believe that this "Book of Enoch" is inspired, and here actually this gives a wrong teaching.

The fact that in Ezekiel the cherubim or living creatures had four faces each, and then in Revelation there was four individual living creatures, each one only having one face each, lion, calf, man and eagle is to me evidence that these creatures are symbolic beings, not depictions of real beings. They represent what the faithful will be in character, and centred in Christ who is the fullness of all these Divine characteristics.
Ezekiel 1:5-6 (KJV): 5 Also out of the midst thereof came the likeness of four living creatures. And this was their appearance; they had the likeness of a man. 6 And every one had four faces, and every one had four wings.
Revelation 4:6-8 (KJV): 6 And before the throne there was a sea of glass like unto crystal: and in the midst of the throne, and round about the throne, were four beasts full of eyes before and behind. 7 And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast was like a flying eagle.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[daqq]

Cherub is the type of angels/creatures with 2 wings. Seraphim is the type of angels/creatures with 6 wings.

You probably meant to say four wings because it is obvious from Ezekiel, but anyway, the Cherubim have four wings, not two. And for the same reason sometimes they can be like a leopard with four wings in its curve, (the four quadrants of the four wings of the garment, like the Perushim, especially when the tzitzit are elongated for a public show, hehe, lol).

 

[CherubRam]

Greetings again CherubRam, I do not believe that this "Book of Enoch" is inspired, and here actually this gives a wrong teaching.

The fact that in Ezekiel the cherubim or living creatures had four faces each, and then in Revelation there was four individual living creatures, each one only having one face each, lion, calf, man and eagle is to me evidence that these creatures are symbolic beings, not depictions of real beings. They represent what the faithful will be in character, and centred in Christ who is the fullness of all these Divine characteristics.
Ezekiel 1:5-6 (KJV): 5 Also out of the midst thereof came the likeness of four living creatures. And this was their appearance; they had the likeness of a man. 6 And every one had four faces, and every one had four wings.
Revelation 4:6-8 (KJV): 6 And before the throne there was a sea of glass like unto crystal: and in the midst of the throne, and round about the throne, were four beasts full of eyes before and behind. 7 And the first beast was like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast was like a flying eagle.

Kind regards
Trevor

Enoch was written by an unknown prophet. Enoch is part of the parable and not literally the person Enoch. Enoch is a inspired work, however, it has suffered from Gnostic corruptions entered into that work. The New Testament validates the book of Enoch.

[FONT=&quot]Hebrews 11:5[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]By faith Enoch was transformed so that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had transformed him: for before his transformation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Jude 1:14[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] Enoch Chapter 1: And he took up his parable and said -Enoch a righteous man, whose eyes were opened by God, saw the vision of the Holy One in the heavens, which the angels showed me, and from them I heard everything, and from them I understood as I saw, but not for this generation, but for a remote one which is 3 for to come. Concerning the elect I said, and took up my parable concerning them: [/FONT]

 

[daqq]

Hebrews 11:5
By faith Enoch was transformed so that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had transformed him: for before his transformation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.

Jude 1:14
And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

Enoch Chapter 1: And he took up his parable and said -Enoch a righteous man, whose eyes were opened by God, saw the vision of the Holy One in the heavens, which the angels showed me, and from them I heard everything, and from them I understood as I saw, but not for this generation, but for a remote one which is 3 for to come. Concerning the elect I said, and took up my parable concerning them:

1 Enoch 10:4 (R. H. Charles 1917)
4. And again the Lord said to Raphael: 'Bind Azâzêl hand and foot, and cast him into the darkness: and make an opening in the desert, which is in Dûdâêl, and cast him therein.
http://www.sacred-texts.com/bib/boe/boe013.htm

Matthew 22:13
13 Then the king said to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and cast him out into the outer darkness: there shall be the weeping and the gnashing of teeth.

 

[CherubRam]

Book of Enoch: http://hiddenbible.com/enoch/online.html/

 

[CherubRam]

1 Enoch 10:4 (R. H. Charles 1917)
4. And again the Lord said to Raphael: 'Bind Azâzêl hand and foot, and cast him into the darkness: and make an opening in the desert, which is in Dûdâêl, and cast him therein.
http://www.sacred-texts.com/bib/boe/boe013.htm

Matthew 22:13
13 Then the king said to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and cast him out into the outer darkness: there shall be the weeping and the gnashing of teeth.

Are you making a point?

 

[daqq]

Are you making a point?

It appears to be a direct quote to me, (minus the name).

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again CherubRam,

Enoch was written by an unknown prophet. Enoch is part of the parable and not literally the person Enoch. Enoch is a inspired work, however, it has suffered from Gnostic corruptions entered into that work.

I do not accept that the Book of Enoch is inspired, and I consider that Jude is somehow alluding to a prophecy by the “Enoch” before the flood. How this was passed down and/or available in Jude's time is not known.

The New Testament validates the book of Enoch.
Hebrews 11:5 By faith Enoch was transformed so that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had transformed him: for before his transformation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.

But this is speaking concerning the “Enoch” before the flood. He is not an unknown prophet and Hebrews 11:5 is quoting/alluding to the following:
Genesis 5:21-24 (KJV): 21 And Enoch lived sixty and five years, and begat Methuselahe: 22 And Enoch walked with God after he begat Methuselah three hundred years, and begat sons and daughters: 23 And all the days of Enoch were three hundred sixty and five years: 24 And Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him.

Jude 1:14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

Here again Enoch is before the flood, the seventh from Adam.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[Hawkins]

You probably meant to say four wings because it is obvious from Ezekiel, but anyway, the Cherubim have four wings, not two. And for the same reason sometimes they can be like a leopard with four wings in its curve, (the four quadrants of the four wings of the garment, like the Perushim, especially when the tzitzit are elongated for a public show, hehe, lol).

No, it's from the Ark of covenant that cherubim have 2 wings.

 

[daqq]

No, it's from the Ark of covenant that cherubim have 2 wings.

Perhaps it works the same way as the countenances or faces, (like the Cherubim in the Oracle).

 

[RBBI]

The Cherubim have four faces, that is, countenances. Look in the mirror at any given time and you will see one of the four countenances, (perhaps depending on your mood, (hehe, lol)). But two of those countenances must breathe out his last, (die), for the Master has said, "All of you shall be offended in me this night: for it is written, I will smite the Shepherd, and the sheep of the flock shall be scattered", (Mat 26:31) and the Prophet in that section continues, as it is written, "Awake, O sword, against My Shepherd, and against the one that is My fellow, says YHWH Tzabaoth: smite the Shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered; and I will turn My hand upon the little ones. And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, says YHWH, two parts therein shall be cut off and breathe his last, (die), but the third part shall be left therein. And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on My name, and I will hear them, and I will say, It is My people! and they shall say, YHWH is my Elohim!" (Zec 13:7,8,9).

Two faces or countenances must therefore die off along the Way; also, because Solomon made the Cherubim in the Oracle from olive tree or olive wood, (1Kings 6:23), it is necessary for you to become olive tree wood, (see Romans 11, (hehe)), and likewise because Solomon overlaid the Cherubim with fine gold having been tried in the fire, (1Kings 6:28), it is necessary for you to purchase from the Master the gold having been tried in the fire, (Rev 3:18, (hehe, lol)), that is, if you truly desire to enter into the holy most Holy place of the Oracle, (Heb 10:19,20, Heb 4:16, (by the new supernal Way, hehe)). And when the two countenances have died off and breathed out their last along the Way, and the third has been brought through the fire, and refined like silver, and tried as gold, then there will be two countenances left remaining: the face of a young lion, (Messiah who is with you until the consummation of your age), and the face of a man, (the new you, (hehe)), and you will be accounted a pillar in the Sanctuary of Elohim, and you will go no more out, (Rev 3:12, (hehe)). And you will stand between palm trees, indeed, a palm tree between two Cherubim: a Cherub and a palm tree, a Cherub and a palm tree, in the Sanctuary of Elohim, (Eze 41:18,19, (lol)).

Amen. The Seraphim have 6 wings. The Seraphim are representative of a family, depicted in the menorah, with Christ as the central shaft/head. The branches are 3 pairs of 2, one pair each for the arms of husband, wife, and child. Two of those 4 do indeed have to die off, the kingdom of G-d is like a child, the father (adamic spirit) and mother (harlot soul) have to be replaced with Father and Mother from above, and the child is caught up to be with Christ forevermore, a child bride of an arranged marriage, arranged before the foundation. A candle set on a hill (false coverings of "father" and "mother" removed) is not easily hid.

Until then, the serpent nature (adamic spirit, principality called sin/root) will always bite with the venom of sin (death) through the woman (harlot soul/fruit) who welcomes it with open arms, because her covering is of a like nature, and every TREE bears fruit after it's own kind. Peace

 

[CherubRam]

The Ark of Covenant the Cherubim have 2 wings, there is no relationship to the four on earth, later in heaven.