beloved57
Well-known member
Don't you teach that sinners Christ died for are still lost?
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SALVATION: A Gift From God
- Thread starter Robert Pate
- Start date
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The Holy Spirit called you to come to Christ and be saved, but you rejected the call and followed after a heretic.
beloved57
Well-known member
You believe that Christ death failed to save sinners He died for, they remain lost!
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Hi eider, sorry for the late reply.
Did you understand what i was saying to you about the words believer , believing , and believe in the NT.
It's important to know what happened in the translation of this Greek word "pisteuo". Where i was taught , it was kind of first day at school information. If we didn't know about this translation , it would take you down a false path. A very crowded false path.
eider
Well-known member
Hello Faither!
Thanks for your post.
I had never heard of the Greek word "pisteuo" in my life.
I was educated at a Church of England Primary School, and from there on to Secondary and Tertiary education.
Our introduction to Christianity was utter madness.
Example:- We had to recite the Lord's Prayer each morning at Assembly. It was chanted like a mantra.
The boy (PG, name never to be forgotten)who stood next to me didn't understand it any better than me, so he chanted what he 'thought' the prayer meant.
Arfava, whose art's in 'eaven.
Hello!.. be thy name.
....... and it went on to the end...
My Pa, the nory and the only ghost....
Our men....
Many years later in life in 94' I decided to read the bible right through in two translations, KJV and New English Translation... that triggered my interest in Jesus. From there on I have been self taught.
Now...... your Greek "pisteuo". Whilst God would know every language fluently I do expect that Jesus spoke and thought in Eastern Aramaic spoken in Galilean Accent. This is even different to Judean Western Aramaic of the time (Mark 14:70 And he denied it again. And a little after, they that stood by said again to Peter, Surely thou art [one] of them: for thou art a Galilaean, and thy speech agreeth [thereto.)
Because most Galilean peasants (there was no middle class) could not write they held on to their histories using oral-tradition. This held the stories of Jesus and his mission until the first Gospel was dictated, probably by the man who had actually been a young follower and witness, the one who tore out of his clothing at the arrest and fled into the darkness, Mark, whose mentor was Cephas. Even in its original language there was that first transliteration out of whatever language Mark spoke. Matthew and Luke copied Mark's gospel, together with other sources.
Now... where does your "pisteuo" key into the faith?
Since this place is flooded by Ariminian rhetoric and accusations against the doctrine of election (Only those chosen by God are saved) and their arrogant assertions that we are twisting scripture and that the doctrine is not found in scripture. The reality is that for them it is a hard saying and cannot hear it John 6:60 I then am going to flood this place with a defense of the doctrine of election as the Spirit will lead.
John 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
There we have the doctrine of election clearly stated by Christ. Only those given to Christ by the Father shall come to Him. Those not given to Christ by the Father will not come to Christ.
John 10:11 I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.
Here we have limited atonement clearly stated by Christ. Only those who come to Him are saved. So atonement is limited to those who are His sheep.
Romans 8:30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
Here we have irresistible Grace clearly stated by Paul. Those predestined are called, justified and glorified. There is no mention of resistance to His will. No mention of any that where predestined who did not reach glory!
Praise God!
John 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
There we have the doctrine of election clearly stated by Christ. Only those given to Christ by the Father shall come to Him. Those not given to Christ by the Father will not come to Christ.
John 10:11 I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.
Here we have limited atonement clearly stated by Christ. Only those who come to Him are saved. So atonement is limited to those who are His sheep.
Romans 8:30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
Here we have irresistible Grace clearly stated by Paul. Those predestined are called, justified and glorified. There is no mention of resistance to His will. No mention of any that where predestined who did not reach glory!
Praise God!
"But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of Elohim: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned".
oatmeal
Well-known member
So you have rejected all the scriptures that Mr. Pate listed for you?
Both Nanja and B57 reject salvation by grace through faith. They want to be predestinated to salvation. That is not the way that people are saved in the New Testament. They are saved by hearing and believing the Gospel. They don't even believe that there is a Gospel.
beloved57
Well-known member
I have no problem with scripture no matter who shows it. Pate believes sinners Christ died for are still lost, no matter how much scripture he shows me. You believe that also dont you ?
beloved57
Well-known member
Dont you believe sinners Christ shed His Blood for are still lost ? Yes or No ?
Jesus is Lord. He has victoriously defeated sin, death and the devil so that... "Whosoever that shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved" Romans 10:13.
beloved57
Well-known member
You keep parroting the same thing over and over. I think that you are trying to convince yourself that what you believe is true.
The Bible plainly teaches that Jesus died for the sins of the whole world, 1 John 2:2.
You have no scripture that says that he didn't. A limited atonement cannot be proven by scripture, but an atonement for the sins of the whole world can.
beloved57
Well-known member
You dont want to face the consequences of your heresy, which is you dont believe that Christ's death saved them He died for, which makes you an unbeliever !
Don't you wish.
Jesus has victoriously atoned for the sins of the whole world and is Lord, Colossians 2:!5.
To not believe that Jesus has atoned for the sins of the whole world makes you an unbeliever and a blasphemer of the Gospel. You will never see the Kingdom of God unless you repent.
beloved57
Well-known member
You don't believe that Christ death alone saved sinners He died for since you believe that sinners Christ died for are lost still.
It is not possible for anyone to believe what you believe about God and his Son Jesus Christ and be saved.
beloved57
Well-known member
You teach that sinners Christ died for are still lost, that is unbelief and denial that Christ is the Saviour!
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You are the devil in disguise.