Or as He put it best Himself...not all who cry “Lord! Lord!” but who?...
RELIGION: An Indication of the Absence of Faith
- Thread starter Robert Pate
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Or as He put it best Himself...not all who cry “Lord! Lord!” but who?...
I think that you are referring to Matthew 7:21-23.
"Not everyone that says to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter the kingdom of heaven; but he that does the will of my Father which is in heaven," Matthew 7:21.
The will of the Father is that you believe on his Son Jesus Christ.
"Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in your name? and in your name cast out devils? and in your name done many wonderful works?" Matthew 7:22.
This is why we should not place to much importance on our works or our obedience to the law.
"And then I will say unto them, I never knew you; depart from me you that work iniquity" Matthew 7:23.
Nowhere in the Bible are we encouraged to trust in our works or our obedience to the law.
Nowhere did I say we are encouraged to trust in our works or our obedience to the law...but it remains Revelation 22:12 ... and my reward is with me, to render to every man according to his works...
Even the thief on the cross demonstrated works because he believed...
Seems like work for you to even hear and believe...especially with a belief that compels works of gratitude
Would he be able to come off the cross you would have the thief continue his thieving and life of crime but with thankfulness so it’s ok...LOL
It remains “go and sin no more...” demonstrating a change to works which glorify the Fsther and are less like your prior life you were to sacrifice...and more like Him/His Way...
What work did the thief on the cross demonstrate?
There was no work. All that he said was, "Lord,remember me when you come into your kingdom" Luke 23:42.
That was not a work, that was an act of faith. The thief had faith in Jesus.
Abraham believed God and was justified by his faith, (not his works) Romans 4:2.
"But to him that does NO WORKS, but believes on him that justifies the UNGODLY, his faith (not his works) is counted for righteousness" Romans 4:5.
beloved57
Well-known member
You teach that sinners Christ died for arw still lost.
You are on ignore. Your post is not visible.
“Then one of the criminals who were hanged blasphemed Him, saying, “If You are the Christ, save Yourself and us.”
40 But the other, answering, rebuked him, saying, “Do you not even fear God, seeing you are under the same condemnation? 41 And we indeed justly, for we receive the due reward of our deeds; but this Man has done lnothing wrong.” 42 Then he said 2to Jesus, “Lord, remember me when You come into Your kingdom.”
Understandable you ignore the works
of rebuking a mocker...reminding him of his own need of salvation...acknowledging just condemnation...contrition and acceptance of punishment for wrong deeds past and declaration the innocence of One crucified and recognition and choice to believe that he could be forgiven and be entered into His kingdom...
Not bad for all in a days work...
And had he been able to come of the cross he would have presented even more works to glorify his God and Redeemer...fruits testifying of his death to self and new life IN CHRIST HIM HIS WAY...
unless of course he went by your dogma and just believed giving lip service while still theiving and thugging his criminal lifestyle...
Of course faith is accounted for righteousness is why those who believe wish to work...they are made righteous...their faith is in Him and He has work for them these righteous...righteous work...
Just like if the thief were to come off the cross he would have been made righteous and thus do righteous works...
The thief on the cross did not do any kind of work to save himself. Conversing with the other thief is not a work.
Salvation is a FREE GIFT from God. It cannot be earned, deserved or imposed. It can only be received by faith.
"For by grace (God's goodness) are you saved through faith: and not that of yourselves. (your works or your merit) It is the GIFT OF GOD. Not of works, lest any man should boast" Ephesians 2:8,9.
It is a gift we must accept and after we realize our need of it and who gives it and why and what it means in our lives...given to all... few accept...less are chosen
Shalom.
Today is Chamishi, 11-2.
I am saved by the blood of Jesus. I choose to obey His instruction and keep and teach God's commandments.
Do you obey Paul? He spoke of the commandments? Why do you refuse to answer if you obey Jesus? If you do not you are not a legitimate son of God.
Shalom.
Jacob
What is Chamishi? Paul said, "You observe days and months and times and years. I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labor in vain" Galatians 4:10, 11.
You are very religious. You have NOT entered into his rest, Hebrews 4:10.
Those that are "In Christ" do not strive to become religious by trying to keep the law.
This is why Paul said, "The Just Shall Live By Faith" Romans 1:17.
And NOT by rules, laws or religion.
You are trying to earn your salvation by obedience to a law that has been abolished, Ephesians 2:15, also Colossians 2:14.
Salvation is a free gift from God. It cannot be earned, deserved or imposed, Ephesians 2:8.
If Paul was here he would say to you, "I am afraid of you". You appear to be on the broad road that leads to hell, Matthew 7:13.
Chamishi means fifth. Each day ends with sundown.
You are incorrect. Because these are your own ideas you have formulated against God and Christ.
Shalom.
Jacob
The scriptures condemn you, NOT me. I am just telling you what the scriptures say. You are the one that is rejecting God's word, NOT me. Your Jewish religion is obsolete. You just don't have the courage to accept it.
You reject God's Word calling it Jewish religion to justify from your perspective your doing so.
Shalom.
Jacob
The heart of the Jewish religion was the "Holy of Holies".
While Jesus was dying on the cross God tore the veil that covered the "Holy of Holies" from the top to the bottom, Matthew 27:51. This signified the end of the Old Covenant, the law and the Jewish religion. Without the "Holy of Holies" there cannot be a Jewish religion. Judaism is a religion of law. According to Paul the law has been abolished, Ephesians 2:15. This is why Judaism is obsolete.
The reason that it was abolished is because it was contrary to us, no one could keep it or do it, Colossians 2:14. We now have a New Covenant, Hebrews 8:6. The Old Covenant is forever gone, Hebrews 8:13. Jesus is the New Covenant. Under the New Covenant we are justified by faith in Jesus and not by the law. The law cannot justify.
"Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall be no flesh justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin: Romans 3:20.
That is the purpose of the law now. To convict us of sin and bring us to Christ so that we can be saved. This is what Paul meant when he said that the law is our schoolmaster that brings us to Christ, Galatians 3:24. You need to give up trying to keep the law and trust in Christ alone for your salvation.
Your doctrine reasoning and thoughts aside I have asked you if you obey, keep, observe, teach, God's commandments or I should have asked you if you feel that I have not asked sufficiently to be able to make this that claim.
Here is how you can answer.
1) I obey God.
2) I obey God by obeying His Law.
3) I obey God by obeying Jesus.
4) I obey God by keeping His commandments.
I do all of these.
Here is what I wonder about you.
Do you keep God's commandments but not the commandments of God's Law?
Do you keep God's commandments by keeping Jesus' commandments?
Do you keep God's commandments those that are throughout the New Testament?
Do you obey or keep the commandments of Paul?
Do you obey the commandments of both Jesus and Paul?
I myself do not call Matthew through Revelation the New Testament. However, Jesus' instruction to keep and teach the commandments is found there.
Do you disobey Jesus but obey God or Paul? Do you believe that Jesus' commandments are not for you such that you do not disobey them?
Please answer all questions relevant to you.
Shalom.
Jacob
I am not under your Jewish law. I have no concern about rules or laws. I am led by the Holy Spirit, who is the Spirit of truth, John 16:13.
In the judgment I will be found to be "In Christ".
"There is therefore no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus" Romans 8:1.
But there is condemnation to those who are under the law like yourself.
Do you listen to the teachings of Jesus? Did He not observe and teach the Law? Did He not instruct us to keep and teach the commandments? But you are turned off to this. Do not think about Jewish law. Do not let that be an obstacle to your observance of God's commandments as a Gentile. Read the Scriptures. Listen to Jesus. Observe, Keep, Teach, Do.
Do you accept Matthew through Revelation? Do you call them the New Testament? Do you accept the Gospels? Do you accept the teaching of the Apostles? Do you accept the teaching of Paul?
I am not under condemnation. I am also not under the law.
If you are without the law, let me know.
1 Corinthians 9:21 NKJV 21 to those [who are] without law, as without law (not being without law toward God, but under law toward Christ), that I might win those [who are] without law;
Otherwise we are talking about God's Law being the Law of Moses here. Which Law has not been abolished. However, the enmity has been abolished, that is the law of commandments contained in ordinances. Meaning, there is nothing not even God's Law that separates the Gentile from God in Jesus Christ. And, when a new covenant is referred to, that makes the previous covenant old. Do you believe that it has become obsolete? The new covenant is for the house of Israel and the house of Judah. It is God's law written on minds and hearts. If you were not a part of the old covenant then you are not a part of Israel according to that covenant. The question then is if you can join with Israel according to the terms of the new covenant. Otherwise, the sins of Israel and the sins of the world the sins of the Gentiles have been forgiven you in Jesus Christ which means that your sins have been forgiven you. So don't sin anymore. You know that sin is and was bad for you. Now, obey God. May you be found in obedience to God at the return of Jesus Christ.
Hebrews 8:13 NKJV - In that He says, "A new [covenant]," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.
Discussion should be had about this verse. Comment on this post as you will and please.
Shalom.
Jacob
That which is obsolete is the law of Moses that you worship. It never did accomplish its purpose, Hebrews 8:7.
The New Covenant is Jesus. In Jesus Christ we have been sanctified, justified and redeemed, 1 Corinthians 1:30. Can your law do that.
You have made the law and your Jewish religion your Jesus.
Just conversing with the other thief?...This thief did more to demonstrate the power of his faith than many christians I overhear “conversing”.
Obviously this thief had been watching the proceedings of the crucifiction, He may even have heard of this “king of the jews”...certainly he might have heard Him say “forgive them they know not what they do”
and when it came down to it his faith compelled him to rebuke and silence another who would mock God and demand a favor to get out a tight bind he put himself in...I know many christians who mock Yah with false piety and worship and yet still demand deliverance from a jam they put themselves in.
After silencing the mocking he spoke on the need to fear Yah as they were under condemnation of the law deservedly...yup repentance right there...certainly much more faith in action than Christians I post with...hint hint...
The thief knew he did wrong and accepted his punishment asking to enter into the spiritual kingdom rather than avoid death...the thief was ready to die again unlike many Christians I know who even twist scripture into secret rapture pre tribulation fantasies to avoid persecution and death...
The thief was clear they deserved death but not this Man who was innocent...what a powerful belief and conviction...contrary to everything around him saying otherwise the thief believed He was INNOCENT...was it from what his eyes told him or his heart?...
and then this faith moved him to testify he believed He was not only innocent but had a kingdom...”Your kingdom”...would christians even see that in a man so badly beaten and rejected?
And then the words “remember me when”...he did NOT want to be forgotten...wanted to BE with Him
Did the know Yah remembers?
He remembered Noah...also Abraham...and His covenant?
Did the thief recall Jeremiah 31:20
"Is Ephraim My dear son? Is he a delightful child? Indeed, as often as I have spoken against him, I certainly still remember him; Therefore My heart yearns for him; I will surely have mercy on him," declares the LORD.”
The thief believed He would provide mercy if he just but asked...
Yes this was more than just a conversation with another criminal...but a most profound display of faith and belief in Him His Way...
and again had the thief had a chance to live longer he would have displayed even MORE of his faith in glorious works in gratitude to Him and what He did there right beside him on a similar cross...
The thief then saw and heard and believed openly and adamantly...the gift was given to him his faith for that...it was accepted publically and with conviction...in a word the thief had the faith OF Him...
The faith of the thief was exactly a testimony to the “rather mercy than sacrifice” the sum goal of the OT...and the promise to all of the New Covenant...
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