Refuting the Fallacious Doctrine of Believe To Be In Christ

[Samie]

Robert teaches that people are born spiritually dead in sin; totally and completely alienated from God.

The Bible says that God made man UPRIGHT. Eccl 7:29

Since the Bible can not be wrong, and granting that Robert is right, then since God made man UPRIGHT, then as per Robert, the UPRIGHT are born spiritually dead in sin and totally and completely alienated from God.

Because of his belief in what Augustine taught, Robert just came up with a NEW definition of UPRIGHT: one born totally and completely alienated from God.

 

[Samie]

HOGWASH!

People become Christians by hearing and believing the Gospel, Galatians 3:2.

Misuse of Scriptures again.

You are trying to build a doctrine on one scripture.

The one you wanted stricken from the Bible, where Jesus said APART from Me, man can do NOTHING. And replace it with Robert's doctrine: APART from Christ, man can do SOMETHING - believe to be In Christ.

 

[patrick jane]

The brand of gospel popularly preached by most Christian preachers tells people to believe so they can be In Christ. This presupposes that people start out in life NOT In Christ, or APART from Him. And for people to be In Christ or part of His Body, they must first believe. So, unless people believe, they could not be part of the Body of Christ.

But if, prior to believing, people are NOT In Christ or are APART from Him, how could they do the act of believing when Christ Himself said that man can do NOTHING when APART from Him? If Christ said man can do NOTHING when APART from Him, why do preachers contradict Him and instead preach that man can do SOMETHING - believe - to be In Him?

The words of Jesus Himself refute this doctrine of "Believe to be In Christ".

Will anyone who preach "Believe to be In Christ" dare defend this fallacious doctrine? Please refrain from verbal abuse and instead turn to Scriptures in defending your position.

You're a calvinist - join the other calvinist fools here

 

[Samie]

You're a calvinist - join the other calvinist fools here

PJ, did you read this post?

 

[Samie]

You are trying to build a doctrine on one scripture.

The one you wanted stricken from the Bible, where Jesus said APART from Me, man can do NOTHING. And replace it with Robert's doctrine: APART from Christ, man can do SOMETHING - believe to be In Christ.

And how many cornerstones do you want, Robert? I only need one. The One laid by God.

 

[Ben Masada]

I can't force you to be right, Ben.

Have you read this post?

If you call right to be unable to do any thing without Christ, I guess it is okay to be wrong.

 

[Epoisses]

You are a blind follower of Augustine's teaching.

The verses you quoted don't say people are born in sin. They say instead that all have sinned, and so are under sin, and sinning is done AFTER one is born, not DURING, nor BEFORE birth. It's because all have sinned that all became unrighteous; NOT because we were born unrighteous because Scriptures EXPLICITLY say that God made mankind UPRIGHT. Eccl 7:29.

Sin goes much deeper than outward actions, Samie. You're a spiritual infant.

 

[Samie]

Sin goes much deeper than outward actions, Samie. You're a spiritual infant.

Thanks, Epo.

Luke 10:21 In that hour Jesus rejoiced in spirit, and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes: even so, Father; for so it seemed good in thy sight.

Now, can you tell me the four (4) different biblical definitions of sin? Which of the 4 could possibly be done by an infant before or during birth, and your biblical basis for making such claim?

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Why do you, Robert, along with Grossy, believe in what Augustine taught, instead of believing in what Christ said?

I never said listen to Augustine. Are you having delusions or are you just plain "NUTS?" Don't worry if you are, there are plenty of you around TOL.

 

[Samie]

I never said listen to Augustine.

So why did you, Grossy?