Rebuttal of the dreadful doctrine of reprobation

[daqq]

Thanks.

It's this very fact that underlines the sincerity of Paul's offer.

Paul quoting Moses: 'Now what I am commanding you today is not too difficult for you or beyond your reach.'

Calvinist: Unless one is of the elect then faith is beyond your reach - for only the elect will be regenerated from their total depravity in order that faith will occur.

We know Paul speaks authoritatively.

:thumb: Amen, and by speaking from this authority the context also becomes intrinsically related. Paul by way of the context in the Torah passage he quotes clearly speaks of a choice that is to be made, and not something that is beyond the reach of any human being supposed by the Calvinist to be in some sort of a state of preordained or predestinated reprobation, without any capability of repentance and change of heart. The whole idea is preposterous in that if it were true even the words of Messiah, saying Repent!, would be null and void because the call to repentance could never be heard by the supposed predestinated reprobate. Golgotha gives everyone a clean slate, that is, sets us all on an equal level, and that is, all have fallen short. Rebrobation would be unjust and the Father is not unjust but Righteous and Holy.

 

[Sonnet]

:thumb: Amen, and by speaking from this authority the context also becomes intrinsically related. Paul by way of the context in the Torah passage he quotes clearly speaks of a choice that is to be made, and not something that is beyond the reach of any human being supposed by the Calvinist to be in some sort of a state of preordained or predestinated reprobation, without any capability of repentance and change of heart. The whole idea is preposterous in that if it were true even the words of Messiah, saying Repent!, would be null and void because the call to repentance could never be heard by the supposed predestinated reprobate. Golgotha gives everyone a clean slate, that is, sets us all on an equal level, and that is, all have fallen short. Rebrobation would be unjust and the Father is not unjust but Righteous and Holy.

Indeed.

 

[Ask Mr. Religion]

And here is the reality (again):

You are missing the point. You have been responded to. You appear to think we are obliged to then offer responses to your responses, especially when you wave off responses initially given. In fact, your "response" here to the two substantial items I have provided is a few sentences. Until you can substantively respond to my offerings that deal directly with your views on a point-by-point basis, rather than just a few cobbled together sentences, I can just as easily claim you are unresponsive.

AMR

 

[Sonnet]

You are missing the point. You have been responded to. You appear to think we are obliged to then offer responses to your responses, especially when you wave off responses initially given. In fact, your "response" here to the two substantial items I have provided is a few sentences. [FONT=&] Until you can substantively respond to my offerings that deal directly with your views on a point-by-point basis, rather than just a few cobbled together sentences, I can just as easily claim you are unresponsive.
[/FONT]
AMR

You are seriously arguing that a post isn't necessarily worth responding to because it's 'a few sentences'?
If it's lacking substance then it should be easily dismissed shouldn't it?

So regarding #33 (where McMahon affirms 2 Corinthians 5:18-21 as a 'very well defined summation of the Gospel') - do you preach this Gospel to the unsaved?

"We implore you on Christ’s behalf, be reconciled to God. For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him."

What we know for sure AMR is that 1 Cor 15:3-8 is another such summation of the Gospel - but you REFUSE to preach it to the unsaved.

It's a substantial point.

 

[Sonnet]

AMR:
No properly instructed Reformed person would expect to hear a preacher or anyone saying to a specific person that Our Lord died for that specific person. How can we presume to know the secret will of God to make such a statement?

Paul:
Whether, then, it is I or they, this is what we preach, and this is what you believed.

This:
3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, 5 and that He appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve. 6 After that He appeared to more than five hundred brethren at one time, most of whom remain until now, but some have fallen asleep; 7 then He appeared to James, then to all the apostles; 8 and last of all, as to one untimely born, He appeared to me also.

Whom did Paul, in general, preach to:
Romans 15:20
It has always been my ambition to preach the gospel where Christ was not known, so that I would not be building on someone else’s foundation.


For some reason, AMR has decided that he wont do as Paul did.

 

[Ask Mr. Religion]

You are seriously arguing that a post isn't necessarily worth responding to because it's 'a few sentences'?
If it's lacking substance then it should be easily dismissed shouldn't it?.

Indeed. Hence no response to a response lacking in substance. Get it now? So stop calling for a response to this or that of your rejoinders to my responses until you can actually mount a substantial rejoinder worth considering.

AMR

 

[Sonnet]

Indeed. Hence no response to a response lacking in substance. Get it now? So stop calling for a response to this or that of your rejoinders to my responses until you can actually mount a substantial rejoinder worth considering.

AMR

Your refusal to answer a simple question that directly relates to the subject at hand is noted. That you consider it insubstantial is merely your subjective view and would appear to underline the elitism that goes hand in hand with your theology.

You, sir, are unable to deal with the OP.

 

[Sonnet]

John 9:34
To this they replied, “You were steeped in sin at birth; how dare you lecture us!” And they threw him out.

 

[Sonnet]

The Pharisee stood by himself and prayed: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other people—robbers, evildoers, adulterers—or even like this tax collector.'

 

[Sonnet]

1 “Very truly I tell you Pharisees, anyone who does not enter the sheep pen by the gate, but climbs in by some other way, is a thief and a robber. 2 The one who enters by the gate is the shepherd of the sheep. 3 The gatekeeper opens the gate for him, and the sheep listen to his voice. He calls his own sheep by name and leads them out. 4 When he has brought out all his own, he goes on ahead of them, and his sheep follow him because they know his voice. 5 But they will never follow a stranger; in fact, they will run away from him because they do not recognize a stranger’s voice.” 6 Jesus used this figure of speech, but the Pharisees did not understand what he was telling them.

 

[Cross Reference]

It is a good thing imho. People are concerned for you, more than the specifics of the topic. My only other point was that it somewhat relates and I was trying to help you see the tie-ins. -Lon

Just more of the same elitist condescension, Sonnet.

 

[Cross Reference]

Deuteronomy 30:19 LXX Brenton English Translation
19 I call both heaven and earth to witness this day against you, I have set before you life and death, the blessing and the curse: [/COLOR]choose thou life, that thou and thy seed may live;

Exactly!These people had no gift of faith, no indwelling of the Holy Spirt and yet it is given them to make choice. God admonished Adam in the same way and he wasn't fallen!. . . In fact, He did. Now how stupid can the teaching of reprobation in fallen man be the reform crowd would have everyone believe.

Question: How come Adam was cautioned by God? [clue: Romans 8:20 KJV]

 

[Nameless.In.Grace]

Indeed. Hence no response to a response lacking in substance. Get it now? So stop calling for a response to this or that of your rejoinders to my responses until you can actually mount a substantial rejoinder worth considering.

AMR

AMR,

I was humbled by the way Knight, yourself and your friend expounded on matters in that one post. There was open dialogue, void of condemnation.

I'm still working through it.

May I ask you to explain how the doctrine of Reprobation applies to the entire world?

For instance, how it impacts witness and the Calvinist's perspective view of people whose sins are more easy to nail down by carnal judgment.


Sent from my iPad using TOL ~Jesus is the Theology and the Counselor is the Commentary

 

[Nang]

AMR,

I was humbled by the way Knight, yourself and your friend expounded on matters in that one post. There was open dialogue, void of condemnation.

Can you refer me to where Knight entered this discussion. I cannot find his contribution in this thread, and would be interested in what he had to say.

 

[Sonnet]

Just more of the same elitist condescension, Sonnet.

I don't see it from Lon to be honest.

 

[Nang]

[/I][/B]


Question: How come Adam was cautioned by God? [clue: Romans 8:20 KJV]

Adam was not "cautioned" by God, but Adam was commanded by God under the Law to not eat of the tree, and God prophetically warned Adam would die in the day he disobeyed that command. Genesis 2:17 is a prophetic promise!

Adam disobeyed, the guilt of sin was imputed to him and all his progeny, Adam died spiritually which prefigured his eventual physical death, which fear of death caused the corruption of his human nature, heart, mind, and will . . leaving him naked and enslaved to serving sin, death, and the devil.

This is the genesis of the doctrine of Reprobation. Reprobates are born into this world naked and serving sin, death, and the devil because of fear of their own certain death, which is the wages of their condition. These are souls left in the corrupt state they inherited from the first Adam. These are passed over and are found outside of Christ, which is their condemnation and future destruction. This describes unrepentant unbelievers.

Such would be all mankind, except God, according to election and His good will and pleasure, chose a remnant of mankind for redemption in and through the sacrificial work of Jesus Christ. He is their Mediator, alone. He died for these, alone. He bestows saving grace and repentance upon these, alone. These alone will receiving the blessings of Christ's Kingdom and everlasting life, for His righteousness has been imputed to their accounts with God.

The comparison between the reprobate and the chosen is revealed in: Romans 9:22-23

 

[Sonnet]

Indeed. Hence no response to a response lacking in substance. Get it now? So stop calling for a response to this or that of your rejoinders to my responses until you can actually mount a substantial rejoinder worth considering.

AMR

So regarding #33 (where McMahon affirms 2 Corinthians 5:18-21 as a 'very well defined summation of the Gospel') - do you preach this Gospel to the unsaved?

Apparently, this isn't a 'substantial rejoinder worth considering'.
Or is it just a question?

This is shameful AMR.

 

[Sonnet]

Adam was not "cautioned" by God, but Adam was commanded by God under the Law to not eat of the tree, and God prophetically warned Adam would die in the day he disobeyed that command. Genesis 2:17 is a prophetic promise!

Adam disobeyed, the guilt of sin was imputed to him and all his progeny, Adam died spiritually which prefigured his eventual physical death, which fear of death caused the corruption of his human nature, heart, mind, and will . . leaving him naked and enslaved to serving sin, death, and the devil.

This is the genesis of the doctrine of Reprobation. Reprobates are born into this world naked and serving sin, death, and the devil because of fear of their own certain death, which is the wages of their condition. These are souls left in the corrupt state they inherited from the first Adam. These are passed over and are found outside of Christ, which is their condemnation and future destruction. This describes unrepentant unbelievers.

Such would be all mankind, except God, according to election and His good will and pleasure, chose a remnant of mankind for redemption in and through the sacrificial work of Jesus Christ. He is their Mediator, alone. He died for these, alone. He bestows saving grace and repentance upon these, alone. These alone will receiving the blessings of Christ's Kingdom and everlasting life, for His righteousness has been imputed to their accounts with God.

The comparison between the reprobate and the chosen is revealed in: Romans 9:22-23

Scant on evidence. Romans 5:18 reveals that all are prepared for destruction. You'd need to present actual evidence to support your view. The OP speaks plainly that all could exercise faith as enjoined by Paul. We know Paul wasn't disingenuous.

 

[Nang]

Scant on evidence. Romans 5:18 reveals that all are prepared for destruction. You'd need to present actual evidence to support your view. The OP speaks plainly that all could exercise faith as enjoined by Paul. We know Paul wasn't disingenuous.

My post was not addressed to you. I am through wasting time with you, for you are just playing a stupid game. :readthis:

 

[Sonnet]

My post was not addressed to you. I am through wasting time with you, for you are just playing a stupid game. :readthis:

No 'stupid game' identified. Nobody compelled you to join this thread - but having done so, it would be respectful to actually address the OP. I wonder why you continue to post here.

The OP stands.