ECT PROTESTANT REFORMERS HAD NO LEGITIMATE MISSION FROM GOD TO REFORM THE CHURCH
- Thread starter Cruciform
- Start date
genuineoriginal
New member
The Roman Catholic Magisterium had no legitimate mission from God---or from someone given power by God---to corrupt the teachings of the Church:
Because the Roman Catholic Magisterium corrupted the teachings of the Church, the Protestant reform happened.
oatmeal
Well-known member
With, as you have pointed out, there are 43,000 Christian denominations, there is obviously 43,000 reasons for reformation
Since the RCC doctrine avoids the clear reading of scripture and forbade it by the public clearly, it had and has no interest in promoting scripture, but rather its own agenda.
Those, in history, and today, who have seen its excesses, have plenty of reason to either leave the RCC or reform it.
I wanted objective Biblical truths, not pagan doctrine with a few Bible verses sprinkled on top for appearances sake.
As I have pointed out in other threads, the RCC ignores scripture, some simple examples being Matthew 2:11, the wise men, (scripture does not tell us how many) visited the young child, (not a newborn) and his mother at a house, (not at a stable with the babe lying in a manger),
Since the RCC, which makes a big deal of Christmas, (put the Christ back into Christmas), ignores the clear scriptural record on a matter they consider important, how is anyone to believe anything else they speak of?
Matthew 12:40 is another example, Jesus made it clear and then repeated the time, that he would be in the earth for three days and three nights, evidently, the RCC either cannot count to three or simply chooses to ignore Jesus' own statement and assumes their tradition trumps Jesus' own words. Where is three days and three nights from Friday afternoon to Sunday morning?
Purgatory? Really? Jesus' works was not enough? I John 1:7,9 God says it is, but the RCC does not agree.
Indulgences? Really? Jesus Christ did not pay for all our sins, so people have to pay money to the RCC to get forgiveness?
Motivation by guilt? The RCC loves to preach sin inspite of the fact that " There is therefore no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus. " Romans 8:1
The RCC, as a system, is probably unreformable, it is corrupt and will remain so until Jesus Christ sets things right in the future. The good intentions of well meaning Roman Catholic individuals is evident, but the system continues to ignore the clear teaching of scripture.
Of course, some of the same errors of heart and judgement continue to be practice by Christian denominations as well.
God's love is the true believers motivation to love God in return
Since the RCC doctrine avoids the clear reading of scripture and forbade it by the public clearly, it had and has no interest in promoting scripture, but rather its own agenda.
Those, in history, and today, who have seen its excesses, have plenty of reason to either leave the RCC or reform it.
I wanted objective Biblical truths, not pagan doctrine with a few Bible verses sprinkled on top for appearances sake.
As I have pointed out in other threads, the RCC ignores scripture, some simple examples being Matthew 2:11, the wise men, (scripture does not tell us how many) visited the young child, (not a newborn) and his mother at a house, (not at a stable with the babe lying in a manger),
Since the RCC, which makes a big deal of Christmas, (put the Christ back into Christmas), ignores the clear scriptural record on a matter they consider important, how is anyone to believe anything else they speak of?
Matthew 12:40 is another example, Jesus made it clear and then repeated the time, that he would be in the earth for three days and three nights, evidently, the RCC either cannot count to three or simply chooses to ignore Jesus' own statement and assumes their tradition trumps Jesus' own words. Where is three days and three nights from Friday afternoon to Sunday morning?
Purgatory? Really? Jesus' works was not enough? I John 1:7,9 God says it is, but the RCC does not agree.
Indulgences? Really? Jesus Christ did not pay for all our sins, so people have to pay money to the RCC to get forgiveness?
Motivation by guilt? The RCC loves to preach sin inspite of the fact that " There is therefore no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus. " Romans 8:1
The RCC, as a system, is probably unreformable, it is corrupt and will remain so until Jesus Christ sets things right in the future. The good intentions of well meaning Roman Catholic individuals is evident, but the system continues to ignore the clear teaching of scripture.
Of course, some of the same errors of heart and judgement continue to be practice by Christian denominations as well.
God's love is the true believers motivation to love God in return
Cruciform
New member
The anti-Catholic traditions of men that you have been taught by your chosen recently-invented, man-made non-Catholic sect are noted. They have all been repeatedly answered---and refuted---in previous posts.
Cruciform
New member
By all means. :up:
Cedarbay
New member
Well, thanks. On second thought, I'll start a new thread sometime soon.
HisServant
New member
Since the RCC has at never single point in history ever been Jesus church that he started in the promised land with jewish apostles....which inexorably reveals the RCC to be nothing more that a pagan wannabe.... your initial post is laughable.
brewmama
New member
That is absurd. Do you not consider Peter or Paul legitimate apostles?
The ignorance on this board is astounding.
Cruciform
New member
Your complete inability to provide a rational answer to Post #11---let alone to actually disprove it---is noted. My comments therefore stand exactly as posted.
ok doser
lifeguard at the cement pond
which "Church"?
the one that was corrupt and needed reforming?
when bread is corrupted by mold and worms you don't reform it - you discard it and start again
HisServant
New member
Yes... and Peter never went to Rome, nor did he start a church there... it would have been physically impossible unless he had access to a jet since his travels are well documented. He was also the Apostle sent to Jews only and did not witness to Gentiles intentionally... he went to the ruins of Babylon, where a large amount of Jews fled after the occupation of Israel by Rome.
If you think that Babylon = Rome than you have to deal with some really heavy theological questions and in the end have to come to the conclusion that the Holy Spirit was feeble and powerless to protect the Apostles so he inspired scripture to be written in code.. or an intentional lie. In spite of many scriptures telling the Apostles to be bold and not fear what could kill the body.... you cannot have it both ways.
The RCC has absolutely no legitimate claim to being even apostolic, since there is about a 200 year gap in substantial documentation during the first three centuries.
Then there is the archeological and demographic evidence that proves that a central church in Rome was an impossibility during the first 3 centuries.
The ignorance of Catholics and their support of a 'church' that has no basis in history and has a history of horrible behavior, blood lust, extortion and extravagant spending.
The reality of the RCC is that it is purely an invention of the roman empire.
Totton Linnet,
You are almost right, but is is Catholicism that will be destroyed first, 1Peter 4:16,17, 18. The reason for this, is because God hates false religion, especially those who are only Nominal Christians, even more than infidels, who know nothing about God or His son, as written in the Gospels.
You are almost right, but is is Catholicism that will be destroyed first, 1Peter 4:16,17, 18. The reason for this, is because God hates false religion, especially those who are only Nominal Christians, even more than infidels, who know nothing about God or His son, as written in the Gospels.
oatmeal
Well-known member
Well, Cruciform, you are right, for God doesn't need to reform a "church" that rejects God and His son and His word.
What the RCC needs is first to turn to God's word. Even before that, it needs to want to learn to love God and keep HIS commandments rather than the doctrines and commandments of men.
Your "church" would first have to be formed, before it can be reformed
What the RCC needs is first to turn to God's word. Even before that, it needs to want to learn to love God and keep HIS commandments rather than the doctrines and commandments of men.
Your "church" would first have to be formed, before it can be reformed
Cruciform
New member
That one historic Church founded by Jesus Christ himself in 33 A.D., and against which he declared that the gates of hell would never prevail (Mt. 16:18-19; 1 Tim. 3:15).
Yes, Christ's Church was morally corrupt with reference to some of its clergy, and even some of the bishops. This moral corruption certainly needed to be reformed, and there were many Catholics besides Martin Luther who were working for such reforms. Yet, Luther went beyond mere moral reforms in presuming to "reform" the established formal DOCTRINES of Christ's Church, and it was then that he entered into theological error to the point of categorical heresy.
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
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Cruciform
New member
Come back when you no longer reject the triune God of the Christian faith in favor of a mere idol of your own imagining. Until then, your decidedly non-Christian opinions will be just that.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
What are the gates of hell?
Satan and his angels are not in hell, at the moment.
The RCC had become wicked, selling forgiveness of sins for money to add to all their other sins.