Ok, I bring the verses what I am talking about.
Palestine? Palestinians? A 20th Century Creation
- Thread starter beameup
- Start date
Ok, I bring the verses what I am talking about.
Zionism is the basic belief that GOD will restore the nation of Israel in the land GOD gave them, AS GOD PROMISED.
It has nothing to do with them DESERVING it.
It will happen because GOD keeps His oaths.
But there is another movement that uses the zionist tag that believe GOD is restoring Israel AT THIS TIME with the modern state of Israel.
I am of the first group, but not the second.
While I certainly believe GOD will keep His promise to Israel, I do not see what is going on now as prophetic fulfillment.
Just too many details told in scripture are missing at this time with the modern state of Israel.
If prophesy has been taken off hold and is now being fulfilled, then the time of the Gentiles is over and this age of grace for the BOC is over.
Israel - prophesy.
BOC - mystery.
It is my belief that they do not occur at the same time.
But I'm open for opposing discussion about it.
It has nothing to do with them DESERVING it.
It will happen because GOD keeps His oaths.
But there is another movement that uses the zionist tag that believe GOD is restoring Israel AT THIS TIME with the modern state of Israel.
I am of the first group, but not the second.
While I certainly believe GOD will keep His promise to Israel, I do not see what is going on now as prophetic fulfillment.
Just too many details told in scripture are missing at this time with the modern state of Israel.
If prophesy has been taken off hold and is now being fulfilled, then the time of the Gentiles is over and this age of grace for the BOC is over.
Israel - prophesy.
BOC - mystery.
It is my belief that they do not occur at the same time.
But I'm open for opposing discussion about it.
drbrumley
Well-known member
Thank you sister. Since you used this verse, may I expound a bit by including the next verse. Verse 16.
For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities--all things have been created through Him and for Him. (Colossians 1:16)
Obviously your verse 15 describes Jesus, so it is within context to say verse 16 also describes Jesus. For by Him (Jesus) ALL THINGS WERE CREATED!!! Wouldn't it be right to say that?
It seems that God gave Him authority and power to create everything.
that's how I understand. It makes sense to me.
I think it is happening now as God says Jerueselam will be a trap in the end. The whole world is looking at Israel and against them. You have one leader, that happens to be a leader of the strongest country in the world, that is backing Israel. Everything is going down as I see it.
On a side note I have been watching the Philippines. There is crazy **** happening there and I believe it's being prepped for a Chinese takeover. This is gonna be their tribulations.
The world is moving from birth pangs to full labor.
Sent from my iPhone using TOL
Because "firstborn" can mean a numerical first of order (as in 1st, 2nd, 3rd), or it can mean first as in preeminence, status, rank.
David is also called GOD's firstborn, and he was not the 1st born son of his father. (Ps 89:27).
He had preeminence because only through David would the royal king line of Israel be established.
Israel is also called GOD's firstborn. (Ex 4:22)
They had preeminence over the other nations.
Exposing scripture you hold dear is a very difficult thing!
#Respect towards you Sister
here it is:
Proverbs 8:22-31
New International Version (NIV)
22 “The Lord brought me forth as the first of his works,
before his deeds of old;
23 I was formed long ages ago,
at the very beginning, when the world came to be.
24 When there were no watery depths, I was given birth,
when there were no springs overflowing with water;
25 before the mountains were settled in place,
before the hills, I was given birth,
26 before he made the world or its fields
or any of the dust of the earth.
27 I was there when he set the heavens in place,
when he marked out the horizon on the face of the deep,
28 when he established the clouds above
and fixed securely the fountains of the deep,
29 when he gave the sea its boundary
so the waters would not overstep his command,
and when he marked out the foundations of the earth.
30 Then I was constantly[c] at his side.
I was filled with delight day after day,
rejoicing always in his presence,
31 rejoicing in his whole world
and delighting in mankind.
drbrumley
Well-known member
I can respect that. Thank you for this dialogue. But I am curious, what do you do with this chapter in Genesis as it relates to God giving Jesus authority and power to create everything?
In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. (Genesis 1:1)
And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. (Genesis 1:3)
And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so. (Genesis 1:7)
And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good. (Genesis 1:11)
And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also. (Genesis 1:16)
And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good. (Genesis 1:21)
And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good. (Genesis 1:25)
So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. (Genesis 1:27)
And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day. (Genesis 1:31)
These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that Jehovah God made the earth and the heavens, (Genesis 2:4)
You're doing great.
I offer this for ya'lls discussion to help clear up that only GOD is the creator.
Isaiah 40:28 KJV
(28) Hast thou not known? hast thou not heard, that the everlasting God, the LORD, the Creator of the ends of the earth, fainteth not, neither is weary? there is no searching of his understanding.
Just my contextual understanding is that Jesus is the first born of all man kind.
drbrumley
Well-known member
I understand that, but just trying to reconcile that with this
Seems here your understanding is God created Jesus and then Jesus created everything else. Yet in Genesis 1, we definitely see God saying Himself thru His own mouth Let there be this and that.
there is much to consider my sister. I pray we both search the scriptures daily and learn from God's inspired and Holy word.
Good Night for now.
I understand what you are saying. That's the best I can come up with.
I will ask JW how they reconcile these since they believe Jesus is first born of all creation too.
thank you for civil discussion.
good night
Though I don't look to the exact detail like that, the UN politically moving against Israel has impressed me to speak up.
I also agree that labor pains are certainly occurring. We may not see it in our day, but stuff is kicking off on a deep level.
Thank you for taking the time to articulate things you are observing!
Muji guji!