One on One: Z Man & Knight

[Nathon Detroit]

It is now clear to me that the only reason you invited me to this thread was so you could make a mockery of my theology and do nothing but nick pick at every little nook and cranny you can find with my beliefs,

Z Man, your "nooks and crannies" are as wide as the Grand Canyon.

Your "nooks and crannies" are the insurmountable problem with your theology which causes you such trouble with such simple topics.

When you're all grown up, maybe we can continue this discussion...

OK, should I attempt to "grow up" as you suggest? Do I have enough control to "grow up"?

Well, do I?

 

[Z Man]

Z Man, your "nooks and crannies" are as wide as the Grand Canyon.

Your "nooks and crannies" are the insurmountable problem with your theology which causes you such trouble with such simple topics.

YOU MAKE UP PROBLEMS! I have no problems with my theology! It's 100% Biblically sound! I'd like to show you, and have made an attempt at it here, but you are absolutely, without a shadow of doubt in my mind, dyslexic.

OK, should I attempt to "grow up" as you suggest? Do I have enough control to "grow up"?

Well, do I?

Obviously not.

I thought this thread was going great. We were getting along just fine until your previous post. I guess you were scheming the whole time to pick something out of my posts to use it against me. Since I have been perfectly clear so far on this topic, it seems that you got frustrated and just made up problems, so you wouldn't have to continue this discussion that clearly proves your assumption wrong about God's control and our responsibility. :down:

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Z Man . . . you assert that . . .

YOU MAKE UP PROBLEMS!

But when I ask if I have any control over my life you say . . .

Obviously not.

So would you agree that I have NO CONTROL to stop "making up problems"?

Asked another way . . .
Is my "making up problems" part of God's perfect plan that He ordained at some point in the past?

 

[Z Man]

Z Man . . . you assert that . . .
But when I ask if I have any control over my life you say . . .So would you agree that I have NO CONTROL to stop "making up problems"?

Asked another way . . .
Is my "making up problems" part of God's perfect plan that He ordained at some point in the past?

You know my answer to that question so why ask? What's your point? Just get to it already...

 

[Nathon Detroit]

You know my answer to that question so why ask? What's your point? Just get to it already...

The point is self evident.

 

[Z Man]

The point is self evident.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Z Man . . . you assert that . . .

YOU MAKE UP PROBLEMS!

But when I ask if I have any control over my life you say . . .

Obviously not.

So would you agree that I have NO CONTROL to stop "making up problems"?

Asked another way . . .
Is my "making up problems" part of God's perfect plan that He ordained at some point in the past?

 

[Z Man]

Is my "making up problems" part of God's perfect plan that He ordained at some point in the past?

Yes.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Yes.

So then who is responsible for my "making up problems"?

Me or God?

re·spon·si·ble
adj.

1. Involving personal accountability or ability to act without guidance or superior authority: a responsible position within the firm.
2. Being a source or cause.
3. Able to make moral or rational decisions on one's own and therefore answerable for one's behavior.

 

[Z Man]

So then who is responsible for my "making up problems"?

Me or God?

re·spon·si·ble
adj.

1. Involving personal accountability or ability to act without guidance or superior authority: a responsible position within the firm.
2. Being a source or cause.
3. Able to make moral or rational decisions on one's own and therefore answerable for one's behavior.

You, because you did the action.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

You, because you did the action.

Wow!

Unreal. :shocked:

So,

1. I have no control whatsoever of the things that I do
2. Therefore I cannot control that I "make up problems"
3. God perfectly planned that I "make up Problems"
4. My "making up problems" is by God's design

Yet, you assert I am personally accountable for making up problems? :kookoo:


Z Man, let's assume now that I do something good. Lets assume that I display the one or all of the following behaviors: love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control.

Am I responsible for displaying these behaviors or is God?

Will you remain consistant with your above assertion about me "making problems" and answer "YES"?

 

[Z Man]

Wow!

Unreal. :shocked:

So,

1. I have no control whatsoever of the things that I do
2. Therefore I cannot control that I "make up problems"
3. God perfectly planned that I "make up Problems"
4. My "making up problems" is by God's design

Yet, you assert I am personally accountable for making up problems? :kookoo:


Z Man, let's assume now that I do something good. Lets assume that I display the one or all of the following behaviors: love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control.

Am I responsible for displaying these behaviors or is God?

Will you remain consistant with your above assertion about me "making problems" and answer "YES"?

Of course.

Knight, your astonishment really shows your absent-mindedness. Your very astonishment over the idea that you are responsible for things God has ordained is the very reason we began this thread. I have presented my argument for this already. I feel like we've just started the beginning of this topic!

You may not believe it, or not even like the idea, but it doesn't matter, because there is Biblical proof to show individuals who were resonsible for the very things God ordained.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Of course.

Knight, your astonishment really shows your absent-mindedness. Your very astonishment over the idea that you are responsible for things God has ordained is the very reason we began this thread. I have presented my argument for this already. I feel like we've just started the beginning of this topic!

You may not believe it, or not even like the idea, but it doesn't matter, because there is Biblical proof to show individuals who were resonsible for the very things God ordained.

Hmmmm interesting . . . . :think:

If I can be responsible for doing "good things" it would only follow that I can be responsible for being smart enough to repent of my sin and choose to accept Christ and the work He did on the corss.

Would you agree then that I am responsible for choosing to be saved?

 

[Z Man]

Hmmmm interesting . . . . :think:

If I can be responsible for doing "good things" it would only follow that I can be responsible for being smart enough to repent of my sin and choose to accept Christ and the work He did on the corss.

Would you agree then that I am responsible for choosing to be saved?

Yes, and only by the grace of God were you able to do so!

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Yes, and only by the grace of God were you able to do so!

Huh? Please explain that, because in the context of this thread your comment doesn't really make much sense.

Are you saying God allows me to make the choice to accept Christ?

If so, we have no disagreement there.

 

[Z Man]

Huh? Please explain that, because in the context of this thread your comment doesn't really make much sense.

Are you saying God allows me to make the choice to accept Christ?

If so, we have no disagreement there.

Yes, we do agree on this. Where we disagree is that I believe He does not allow everyone to choose. Also, those who do not know Christ are not in the state of mind where they genuinely want to believe, and God is being 'mean' and not allowing them to. They truly, in their heart of hearts, reject God and everything He stands for. God simply chooses not to let His grace extend to them. If He did, like He has for me and you, then they'd believe.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

Yes, we do agree on this. Where we disagree is that I believe He does not allow everyone to choose. Also, those who do not know Christ are not in the state of mind where they genuinely want to believe, and God is being 'mean' and not allowing them to. They truly, in their heart of hearts, reject God and everything He stands for. God simply chooses not to let His grace extend to them. If He did, like He has for me and you, then they'd believe.

OK, I really don't want to add anything to what you just stated.

I think it says more about your theology than I could possibly say.

Thanks for the time on this "One on One" it has been enlightening. :up: