Nontrinitarianism

jamie

jamie

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keypurr said:
I do not see that Jesus live before he was born.
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Jesus said to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was I AM." (John 8:58 NKJV)

Keypurr, why not stick with the scriptures and keep it simple?

Savior existed all through history. He didn't just pop up one day as a baby .

Savior became mortal so there is remission of sin.

For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. (Romans 5:10 (NKJV)
 
Angel4Truth

Angel4Truth

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brinny said:
I accidentally stumbled onto a thread today. Come to find out, it was a debate about the trinity vs anti-trinity.

It got me to thinking.

Does Nontrinitarianism believe that Jesus was created?

Thank you kindly.
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Some yes, not all. Some believe that the Father, Son and Spirit are all one person.
 
meshak

meshak

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jamie said:
Jesus prayed, "I in them and You in Me..." (John 17:23 NKJV)

The Father in the Son and the two of them in us.

The Holy Spirit.
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that's not original quote I am asking about.

Do you know you have been mixed messages that confused me many times and I had to ask you many times?

It was all honest questions. And this one is honest question too.

thanks.
 
keypurr

keypurr

Well-known member
jamie said:
Jesus said to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was I AM." (John 8:58 NKJV)

Keypurr, why not stick with the scriptures and keep it simple?

Savior existed all through history. He didn't just pop up one day as a baby .

Savior became mortal so there is remission of sin.

For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. (Romans 5:10 (NKJV)
Click to expand...

It is my belief that Christ, the express image, SPOKE through Jesus.

Christ existed in the past, not Jesus. Christ was at the creation and was not a man, Jesus was a man. Jesus is the flesh son of God, he is the BODY God prepared for Christ, the spiritual son that HE SENT.

Christ is a special spiritual being, you do not see that. God created an exact copy of his BEING. God is a spirit, this copy is a spirit.

Heb 1:3

(GNB) He reflects the brightness of God's glory and is the exact likeness of God's own being, sustaining the universe with his powerful word. After achieving forgiveness for the sins of all human beings, he sat down in heaven at the right side of God, the Supreme Power.

(GW) His Son is the reflection of God's glory and the exact likeness of God's being. He holds everything together through his powerful words. After he had cleansed people from their sins, he received the highest position, the one next to the Father in heaven.

(ISV) He is the reflection of God's glory and the exact likeness of his being, and he holds everything together by his powerful word. After he had provided a cleansing from sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Highest Majesty

(KJV) Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

(NIrV) The Son is the gleaming brightness of God's glory. He is the exact likeness of God's being. He uses his powerful word to hold all things together. He provided the way for people to be made pure from sin. Then he sat down at the right hand of the King, the Majesty in heaven.

(NIV) The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.
 
G

Grosnick Marowbe

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keypurr said:
I see Jesus as a man. All men are creations.

But the express image is a spirit like God is. Being an image that is a creation also. I see this image as Christ, the spiritual son of God.
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You ought not to call yourself a "Christian." "Other" would be more appropriate!

You don't trust in the Deity of Christ!
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

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keypurr said:
It is my belief that Christ, the express image, SPOKE through Jesus.

Christ existed in the past, not Jesus. Christ was at the creation and was not a man, Jesus was a man. Jesus is the flesh son of God, he is the BODY God prepared for Christ, the spiritual son that HE SENT.

Christ is a special spiritual being, you do not see that. God created an exact copy of his BEING. God is a spirit, this copy is a spirit.

Heb 1:3

(GNB) He reflects the brightness of God's glory and is the exact likeness of God's own being, sustaining the universe with his powerful word. After achieving forgiveness for the sins of all human beings, he sat down in heaven at the right side of God, the Supreme Power.

(GW) His Son is the reflection of God's glory and the exact likeness of God's being. He holds everything together through his powerful words. After he had cleansed people from their sins, he received the highest position, the one next to the Father in heaven.

(ISV) He is the reflection of God's glory and the exact likeness of his being, and he holds everything together by his powerful word. After he had provided a cleansing from sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Highest Majesty

(KJV) Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

(NIrV) The Son is the gleaming brightness of God's glory. He is the exact likeness of God's being. He uses his powerful word to hold all things together. He provided the way for people to be made pure from sin. Then he sat down at the right hand of the King, the Majesty in heaven.

(NIV) The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.
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It is believed by some that Christ was the first created being by Yahwah. Before Christ was born into this world he was called Peniel and Messenger of Yahwah. Or as Pagans have it, (The Angel of The Lord.)
(KJV) Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
 
jamie

jamie

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LIFETIME MEMBER
keypurr said:
Christ is a special spiritual being...
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Christ is a special spiritual being who already existed in the beginning. Was he created? No, scripture does not support that claim.

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. (Genesis 1:1 NKJV)​

Who is the Creator God?

All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. (John 1:3 NKJV)​

Christ was born as a human.

That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon and our hands have handled concerning the Word of life - the life was manifested and we have seen and bear witness and declare to you that eternal life which was with the Father and was manifested to us, that which we have seen and heard we declare to you that you also may have fellowship with us, and truly our fellowship is with the Father and with His Son Jesus Christ. (1 John 1:1-3 NKJV)​

Keypurr, why not believe the scriptures as they are written without adding to them?
 
keypurr

keypurr

Well-known member
jamie said:
Christ is a special spiritual being who already existed in the beginning. Was he created? No, scripture does not support that claim.

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. (Genesis 1:1 NKJV)​

Who is the Creator God?

All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. (John 1:3 NKJV)​

Christ was born as a human.

That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon and our hands have handled concerning the Word of life - the life was manifested and we have seen and bear witness and declare to you that eternal life which was with the Father and was manifested to us, that which we have seen and heard we declare to you that you also may have fellowship with us, and truly our fellowship is with the Father and with His Son Jesus Christ. (1 John 1:1-3 NKJV)​

Keypurr, why not believe the scriptures as they are written without adding to them?
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Your twisting his words jamie.

God the Father is the creator, all things come from the Father who is the only true God.

God created it all through his first creation, the express image, a spirit being copy of The Father.

Scripture fully supports these facts.

I do believe scripture without all the false fairytales that tradition has misled us with.
 
keypurr

keypurr

Well-known member
CherubRam said:
It is believed by some that Christ was the first created being by Yahwah. Before Christ was born into this world he was called Peniel and Messenger of Yahwah. Or as Pagans have it, (The Angel of The Lord.)

(KJV) Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
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Over 1400 posts on my other thread and they still don't see it.
 
G

Grosnick Marowbe

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keypurr said:
That's a giant misstatement, we see the Trinity as a false doctrine because it is. The only why folks today believe in the trinity is because of tradition. Your judgement is flawed.

Jesus is the authority to build your faith on and he tells us that only his Father is the true God in John 17:3.
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You're filled to the brim with 'false doctrine.'
 
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