It is there that we learn about the ultimate authority, God and Jesus Christ His Son.
ECT NO, THE BIBLE IS NOT THE CHRISTIAN'S ONLY AUTHORITY
- Thread starter Cruciform
- Start date
Cruciform
New member
Yet another Straw Man Fallacy by CM.
I never claimed that he did. Back to Post #177 above.
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
Cruciform
New member
The assumptions and opinions that you have derived from your recently-invented, man-made non-Catholic sect are noted. Too bad they violate both Scripture itself, as well as the constant belief and teaching of the early Christian Church.
Here Paul teaches that Scripture---that is, the Old Testament---is "profitable" or "useful," NOT that it is in any way numerically sufficient, as you falsely claim above.
John here refers specifically to the book of Revelation itself, not to the Bible as a whole. In any case, the Catholic Church has never "added" to Scripture, since no new inspired Scripture has been produced since the Apostolic Era.
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
Are you going to give us a list of the specific traditions Paul was referring to?
But you are attempting to claim that blessed all future teachings of the RCC that are offered as traditions.
Cruciform
New member
Already did.
Rather, that Paul's reference to "traditions" necessarily includes within it all Traditional teachings of Christ's one historic Church for all time.
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
genuineoriginal
New member
No, you didn't.
You have attempted to claim that the traditions Paul taught include all of the man-made traditions that your sect has stolen from the Pagan religions around them.
You have failed to provide any list of the traditions that Paul actually taught.
Do you really think I am going to take the teachings of the Catholic Church to heart. I don't see the Church here.
2 Timothy 3:16 King James Version (KJV)
16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
Cruciform
New member
If you possessed the will and ability to honestly evaluate your own present Protestant assumptions and opinions, then yes, you might---with God's grace---come to accept the authoritative teachings of Christ's one historic Catholic Church. It's entirely up to you.
And yet the Church is most definitely here.
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
genuineoriginal
New member
The writings of your sect put a lot of emphasis on using the word "church" but never seem to explain that Jesus said He would build His ekklesia (not "church") on a rock.
What is it about the word ekklesia that offends your sect?
So no, you are not. You are just going to declare victory and start posting post number in order to have the last word. You will no doubt do thus as your philosophy background has lead you to believe that if have the last word, you won.
No, they necessarily would not include any teachings or traditions which he does not know. You are attempting to make something true by definition but your definition is fundementally flawed.
PhilipJames
New member
Hello genuine,
church is the English translation of the Latin 'ecclesia'. Latin is the official language of the Church (or Ecclesia if you prefer)
Peace!
PJ
church is the English translation of the Latin 'ecclesia'. Latin is the official language of the Church (or Ecclesia if you prefer)
Peace!
PJ
genuineoriginal
New member
No, 'assembly' is the English translation of the Greek 'ekklesia'
'Church' is a pagan intrusion into Christianity.
_____
Christ's Ekklesia and The Church Compared
If you look in a dictionary, under the word Church, it's defined as "a place of worship of any religion as a Jewish or heathen temple." When the world says "Church," they are thinking of a building or a structure, and this is actually the original meaning of Church, but somehow it transferred over as being the body of Christ.
In Smith's Bible Dictionary from 1884, at page 452,, it says "the derivation of the word 'church' is uncertain. It is found in the Teutonic and Slavonic languages and answers to the derivatives of ekklesia, which are naturally found in the romance languages and by foreign importation elsewhere. The word is generally said to be derived from the Greek kyriakos, meaning the lord's house. But the derivation has been too hastily assumed. It is probably associated with the Scottish kirk, the Latin circus/circulous, the Greek klukos, because the congregations were gathered in circles."
And if you go into congregations that were gathered in circles, that's what the pagans did, they gathered in prayer circles, that's all pagan religions. After reading that comment, you might see why that word "Church" was adopted, because so many of the people that were being brought into the Church were of pagan origins, and they accommodated those pagans.
_____
Christ's Ekklesia and The Church Compared
If you look in a dictionary, under the word Church, it's defined as "a place of worship of any religion as a Jewish or heathen temple." When the world says "Church," they are thinking of a building or a structure, and this is actually the original meaning of Church, but somehow it transferred over as being the body of Christ.
In Smith's Bible Dictionary from 1884, at page 452,, it says "the derivation of the word 'church' is uncertain. It is found in the Teutonic and Slavonic languages and answers to the derivatives of ekklesia, which are naturally found in the romance languages and by foreign importation elsewhere. The word is generally said to be derived from the Greek kyriakos, meaning the lord's house. But the derivation has been too hastily assumed. It is probably associated with the Scottish kirk, the Latin circus/circulous, the Greek klukos, because the congregations were gathered in circles."
And if you go into congregations that were gathered in circles, that's what the pagans did, they gathered in prayer circles, that's all pagan religions. After reading that comment, you might see why that word "Church" was adopted, because so many of the people that were being brought into the Church were of pagan origins, and they accommodated those pagans.
_____
Cruciform
New member
Post #186.
Already answered---and corrected---in a previous post.
Gaudium de veritate,
Cruciform
+T+
PhilipJames
New member
definition of church:
1
: a building for public and especially Christian worship
2
: the clergy or officialdom of a religious body
3
often capitalized : a body or organization of religious believers: as
a : the whole body of Christians
b : denomination <the Presbyterian church>
c : congregation
4
: a public divine worship <goes to church every Sunday>
5
: the clerical profession <considered the church as a possible career>
taken from here: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/church
Latin- English translation:
We have found the following english words and translations for "ecclesia":
Latin
ecclesia
English
church
taken from here: http://www.translate-latin.com/en/dictionary-latin-english/ecclesia
And regardless of the origin of the word 'church'.. English as a living language is constantly morphing and changing... what some barbarian did or didn't use that word (or something similar to it) for has no bearing on the current usage of 'Church' referring to a Christian community.
But if that particular word causes you to stumble... I will try to remember to use Ecclesia in any future conversations with you (please feel to remind me if I forget
)Peace!
PJ
csuguy
Well-known member
Its not the only source, but its the most reliable. Written word is more resilient than the spoken word overtime. Also alternate sources of tradition - like councils and creeds - are usually themselves based upon an interpretation of the scriptures. Thus the merit of such traditions can be judged by studying the underlying source material.
You realy got ripped off in college. Your logic us pathetic.
dreadknought
New member
Wow. Sounds good. Too bad there is no Trust in your compassion.
genuineoriginal
New member
When Jesus (the barbarian you are referring to) spoke of an assembly, the word He used did not have all the distortions that the word church has now.
Unfortunately, the distortions that have been created by the mistranslation of "ekklesia" (assembly) into "church" (building) has caused much confusion in the body of Christ.
WonderfulLordJesus
New member
This is a prime example of Catholic irrationality. The Bible faith is the most ancient, fundamental faith, the Christianity of the first century church. It predates all the perversions of the Roman cult. A simple root of much of the problem with Catholicism are all these deceptive and twisted arguments that don't even reach a level of common sense.
1 Timothy 4:1-3 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron; Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.