ECT Moment of Salvation Compared to Water Baptism

[Cross Reference]

I did address them. I broke them up to focus a little more on what each was saying. Maybe you missed my post #621 and 624.

And I addressed all "objections"; all your "come backs", you have dismissed/ignored. So, you go back and read, not me.. otherwise you have nothing to offer up as a valid disagreement.

 

[Cross Reference]

I agree Jesus but how? Jesus hadn't died, been buried or resurrected offering his blood for our sins.
So how was he saved?

Was anyone saved at that point in time? To where did Jesus descend when He died? Why did He go there? Who came up out the grave with Him upon His resurrection? Would not the thief have been numbered among them? Why not if you don't agree?

These are question you need to answer for yourself before I answer your questions. Get my drift? Ask your Greek lexicons.

I am also looking for where I didn't make myself clear on that last go-around re Baptisms and acknowledgement that you read the passages I submitted you have not replied with agreement otherwise this all pointless.

 

[Cross Reference]

If we can't agree Cornelius was a special conversion, then we probably are wasting our time.
Why does this conversion have a complete long chapter devoted to it and during debates it's mentioned in two other chapters?




Excellent question.
From your perspective, what baptism is this?
Acts 18:8 Crispus, the ruler of the synagogue, believed in the Lord, together with his entire household. And many of the Corinthians hearing Paul believed and were baptized.

In the scheme of things, Does it matter? If i said Holy Spirit, what would your next question be? Likewise if I said water baptism? [minutia, all]

 

[Cross Reference]

Read Post #626

 

[Cross Reference]

How was the thief on the cross saved? More specifically, how were his sins forgiven?

I said (2) baptisms and gave you the scritpure for them you didn't mention in your "come back".. see #624.

 

[turbosixx]

In the scheme of things, Does it matter?

I believe it does matter. It saddens me when I look at "Christianity" today and see all the division because we can't agree on what the same book is telling us.

1 Cor. 1:10 I appeal to you, brothers, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be united in the same mind and the same judgment.

I suggest the more we stick to the words that God gave us the better off we will be.

 

[Right Divider]

I believe it does matter. It saddens me when I look at "Christianity" today and see all the division because we can't agree on what the same book is telling us.

1 Cor. 1:10 I appeal to you, brothers, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be united in the same mind and the same judgment.

I suggest the more we stick to the words that God gave us the better off we will be.

If you really believed that, you would understand the uniqueness of Paul's ministry.

 

[turbosixx]

Read Post #626

Post 626 did not answer my question. My question was in Acts 19 what is being baptized into the name of Jesus. You answered with the laying of hands. These are two different things. Do you see them as two different things? If so, what is being baptized in the name of Jesus?

Acts 19:5 On hearing this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 And when Paul had laid his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they began speaking in tongues and prophesying.

 

[meshak]

I believe it does matter. It saddens me when I look at "Christianity" today and see all the division because we can't agree on what the same book is telling us.

1 Cor. 1:10 I appeal to you, brothers, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be united in the same mind and the same judgment.

I suggest the more we stick to the words that God gave us the better off we will be.

I believe if we just focusing on Jesus' teachings and strive to be like Him, we will not have any problem.

We cannot be saved by having the knowledge.

Jesus says we will be judged according to what we have done. This is simple yet heavy word.

 

[turbosixx]

If you really believed that, you would understand the uniqueness of Paul's ministry.

Talk to the hand

 

[turbosixx]

I said (2) baptisms and gave you the scritpure for them you didn't mention in your "come back".. see #624.

Sorry, you're hard to follow. If I didn't miss anything, you're saying the thief was saved by Jesus' 2 baptism?

 

[turbosixx]

I believe if we just focusing on Jesus' teachings and strive to be like Him, we will not have any problem.

We cannot be saved by having the knowledge.

Jesus says we will be judged according to what we have done. This is simple yet heavy word.

I agree with you 100%. One question. Do you believe the apostles words are Jesus' words?

 

[Cross Reference]

I believe it does matter. It saddens me when I look at "Christianity" today and see all the division because we can't agree on what the same book is telling us.

1 Cor. 1:10 I appeal to you, brothers, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be united in the same mind and the same judgment.

I suggest the more we stick to the words that God gave us the better off we will be.

I am saddened when I read you.


Bye.

 

[Cross Reference]

I agree with you 100%. One question. Do you believe the apostles words are Jesus' words?

20 O Timothy, guard the deposit entrusted to you. Avoid the irreverent babble and contradictions of what is falsely called “knowledge", . . . . . . . 23 Have nothing to do with foolish, ignorant controversies; you know that they breed quarrels. 1 Timothy 6:20; 2 Timothy 2:23 (ESV)

 

[turbosixx]

I am saddened when I read you.


Bye.

Have I said something to offend you?

 

[turbosixx]

20 O Timothy, guard the deposit entrusted to you. Avoid the irreverent babble and contradictions of what is falsely called “knowledge", . . . . . . . foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes."2 Timothy 2:23 (KJV)
1 Timothy 6:20 (ESV)

3 For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, 4 and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths.

You use words and phrases the bible does not.

 

[Right Divider]

Talk to the hand

Yes, that is the way that you "discuss" Bible doctrine.

You claimed to be concerned about division and proper understanding of the Bible. This is clearly a smoke screen that everyone should believe YOUR version.

Could anything be more divisive than water baptism? Even in the denominations that believe in the water ceremony, they don't even agree on the formula or the effect. You have the dunkers VS the sprinklers, you have the infant baptizers VS the adult baptizers, you have the in the name of Jesus VS in the name of Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Many denominations require believers to be re-baptized using their formula, even if the person had already been water baptized somewhere else. The list goes on and on based upon the "clear reading of scripture".

And of course ALL of those denominations reject the ONE baptism of Ephesians 4:5; trying to find a reason why it's not really ONE baptism in the body of Christ.

The ONE baptism is the baptism BY the Spirit INTO the body of Christ without water. 1 Corinthians 12:13

Stick with your denominational confusion if you like; I'll stick with the ONE baptism into the body of Christ.

 

[turbosixx]

Yes, that is the way that you "discuss" Bible doctrine.

You claimed to be concerned about division and proper understanding of the Bible. This is clearly a smoke screen that everyone should believe YOUR version.

Could anything be more divisive than water baptism? Even in the denominations that believe in the water ceremony, they don't even agree on the formula or the effect. You have the dunkers VS the sprinklers, you have the infant baptizers VS the adult baptizers, you have the in the name of Jesus VS in the name of Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Many denominations require believers to be re-baptized using their formula, even if the person had already been water baptized somewhere else. The list goes on and on based upon the "clear reading of scripture".

And of course ALL of those denominations reject the ONE baptism of Ephesians 4:5; trying to find a reason why it's not really ONE baptism in the body of Christ.

The ONE baptism is the baptism BY the Spirit INTO the body of Christ without water. 1 Corinthians 12:13

Stick with your denominational confusion if you like; I'll stick with the ONE baptism into the body of Christ.

Talk to the hand

 

[Right Divider]

Talk to the hand

Just keep saying that. It shows what a great listener you are (NOT).

 

[God's Truth]

Then let the scriptures say what they say when they say this: "Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. And this will we do, if God permit." Hebrews 6:1-3 (KJV) SO, "How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him; God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will? Hebrews 2:3-4 (KJV)? Which is why Paul cautioned Timothy: "Do not be hasty [presumptuous?] in the laying on of hands, . . ." 1 Timothy 5:22 (ESV)

That passage proves we have to repent of our sins to get saved....the REPENTANCE of DEAD WORKS/REPENT OF SINS.

And, it is about how we are to GET WATER BAPTIZED.

These scriptures rebuke faith aloners and those who say we don't have to get water baptized.