Matthew 27:53

1Mind1Spirit

1Mind1Spirit

Literal lunatic
daqq said:
In the New Testament "the holy city" refers not to Jerusalem of below but to Jerusalem of above. Jerusalem of below is referred to as Sodom and Hagar-Egypt in the allegory, (Gal 4:24-26, Rev 11:8).
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Are you gonna say that even though that is symbolic that the Romans' crucifying Jesus was actually a physical event?(other than electrical firings in the brain)
 
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daqq

Well-known member
1Mind1Spirit said:
Are you gonna say that even though that is symbolic that the Romans' crucifying Jesus was actually a physical event?
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I do believe the Master was crucified and raised from the dead: why do you suppose Paul had such a dramatic change? There was indeed someone crucified and raised from the dead or we would not today have any of the writings of Paul. However there is also deep symbolism within the event and I believe the passage in Matthew from this thread is part of that symbolism, (and there is much more where that came from, even from Matthew 24).
 
1Mind1Spirit

1Mind1Spirit

Literal lunatic
daqq said:
I do believe the Master was crucified and raised from the dead: why do you suppose Paul had such a dramatic change? There was indeed someone crucified and raised from the dead or we would not today have any of the writings of Paul. However there is also deep symbolism within the event and I believe the passage in Matthew from this thread is part of that symbolism, (and there is much more where that came from, even from Matthew 24).
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Thank you for the honesty.

What a breath of fresh air. Exhale........

I'm in agreement. :)
 
Zeke

Zeke

Well-known member
daqq said:
I do believe the Master was crucified and raised from the dead: why do you suppose Paul had such a dramatic change? There was indeed someone crucified and raised from the dead or we would not today have any of the writings of Paul. However there is also deep symbolism within the event and I believe the passage in Matthew from this thread is part of that symbolism, (and there is much more where that came from, even from Matthew 24).
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The symbolism favors the crucifixion being a spiritual event that happens in the kingdom of God Luke 17:20-21, Golgotha/Skull/Calvary in the Jerusalem that is now Galatians 4:1 the son in bondage to the works of the flesh, symbology Galatians 4:24-25, Rather than being a pagan ritual to appease some Deity that mocks the Father if taken literally. Plus you have nothing to prove these types of revelations only happened after the crucifixion you believe in.
 
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daqq

Well-known member
Zeke said:
The symbolism favors the crucifixion being a spiritual event that happens in the kingdom of God Luke 17:20-21, Golgotha/Skull/Calvary in the Jerusalem that is now Galatians 4:1 the son in bondage to the works of the flesh, symbology Galatians 4:24-25, Rather than being a pagan ritual to appease some Deity that mocks the Father if taken literally. Plus you have nothing to prove these types of revelations only happened after the crucifixion you believe in.
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I agree it is a spiritual event for us all if indeed one is crucified with Messiah. However now you have ventured into the realm of blood atonement and that is also one of the reasons tried to suggest that this should probably be for another thread. There is too much involved in the discussion you wish to pursue. It is surely a thread derailer.
 
patrick jane

patrick jane

BANNED
Banned
daqq said:
I agree it is a spiritual event for us all if indeed one is crucified with Messiah. However now you have ventured into the realm of blood atonement and that is also one of the reasons tried to suggest that this should probably be for another thread. There is too much involved in the discussion you wish to pursue. It is surely a thread derailer.
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No matter, Jonahdog doesn't mind, he's not interested in this thread.
 
Zeke

Zeke

Well-known member
I will add another clue that goes along with Paul's statement in Galatians 4:24, Psalm 78:2, the rest of the PS follows the signs and wonders of the Exodus on to David, Psalm 78:65 goes along with Eph 5:14, the Lord awakens in us after we go through the Exodus/parable as a slave Galatians 4:1, until the Spirit awakens from its slumber in us Eph 5:14! Galatians 3:1-5, portrayal, The story of crucifixion is also Allegory/symbology those dark sayings of old "Divine History" not secular darkness.
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

New member
Jonahdog said:
Is there any evidence other than the Bible of tombs opening and the dead rising upon Christ's death? One would think such an extraordinary occurrence would have caught the eye of some contemporary witness.
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Sorry Jonah, that part is a corruption of text. The resurrection has not taken place yet. Throughout history, Judaism and Christianity have been under attack by Pagans and Gnostic's. That is the reason you see so much arguing.
 
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daqq

Well-known member
CherubRam said:
Sorry Jonah, that part is a corruption of text. The resurrection has not taken place yet. Throughout history, Judaism and Christianity have been under attack by Pagans and Gnostic's. That is the reason you see so much arguing.
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So then you must believe in the "soul-sleep" doctrine which Paul refutes, (and these comments are indeed related to the OP passage in question). :)
 
CherubRam

CherubRam

New member
daqq said:
People are unaware until Elohim calls them forth from the womb of their mother, (Gal 1:15-16). And this all changed at Golgotha, (Mat 27:52-54).
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2 Timothy 2:18
who have departed from the truth. They say that the resurrection has already taken place, and they destroy the faith of some.

Mat 27:52-54 says the resurrection has already taken place.
 
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daqq

Well-known member
CherubRam said:
2 Timothy 2:18
who have departed from the truth. They say that the resurrection has already taken place, and they destroy the faith of some.

Mat 27:52-54 says the resurrection has already taken place.
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daqq said:
Tanach "Body of the Saints" ~ "Body of Moses" (folded into Messiah - Mat 27:51-53)
Brit Chadashah "Body of the Saints" ~ "Body of Messiah"
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.
 
J

Jonahdog

BANNED
Banned
patrick jane said:
Matthew 27:51-54 KJV - [FONT="]And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;[/FONT][/COLOR][COLOR=#000000][FONT="]52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,[/FONT]
[FONT="][FONT=Arial][B]53 [/B][/FONT]And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#000000][FONT="]54 Now when the centurion, and they that were with him, watching Jesus, saw the earthquake, and those things that were done, they feared greatly, saying, Truly this was the Son of God.

Well, how many people do you think were IN the holy city? There was an earthquake and "many" bodies of the saints arose. How many is "many"? And appeared unto many, again how many? Apparently there WERE "contemporary" witnesses.[/FONT]
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But no extra Biblical accounts of this amazing occurrence.
 
C

clefty

New member
Jonahdog said:
Is there any evidence other than the Bible of tombs opening and the dead rising upon Christ's death? One would think such an extraordinary occurrence would have caught the eye of some contemporary witness.
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I hope not. My faith is in that which is not seen...

Ha...Even His disciples didn’t believe He was resurrected...at first

and were extra biblical witnesses...at first

Good question though...wonder why you ask...
 
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