Jesus is God !

glorydaz

Well-known member
Nope, its not. It speaking of the logos IN Jesus, the logos is a created form of God. It was sent to dwell on the body prepared for IT. HEB 10:5. It spoke through Jesus to bring us light.

If you bothered to read the context, you might be able to see past your private interpretations. :idunno:


You refuse to read what is written......just exactly what God's Untruth does, which is how she comes up with her own batch of private interpretations that do not comport with God's word.

Read the Scripture..... and you dare to deny this speaks of Christ's humility. :nono:

Phil 2:2 Fulfil ye my joy, that ye be likeminded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind. 3 Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves. 4 Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others. 5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:​

Let this "mind" be in you.....context, Keypurr, should be your best friend.

Ephesians 4:2
With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love;

Colossians 3:12 Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;​
 

glorydaz

Well-known member
Glorydaz, there is so much more to the Christ than most learn in church.

Save it. I didn't learn what I know about the Lord in any church.

You use the term God-man alot, that is not quite correct.

I can't recall ever using that term. These blanket statements do not speak well for you.



This may sound silly to you but Jesus was just a sinless man who became possessed by the logos.

Of course it sounds silly. It is silly. You have it upside down and backwards.

The Logos became flesh and dwelt among us. Jesus, being conceived of the Holy Spirit in the womb of Mary is not being "possessed". That's almost "demonic" to even say such a thing.



In fact, just reading your ungodly words makes my flesh crawl. You're in grave error, Keypurr. :sigh:
 

Lon

Well-known member
Your Jehovah Witness roots are still well entrenched. :nono:

Got to be honest with you friend, I never was or could be a JW as they do not think like me. I believe in the Sabbath and I also do not think Christ is the Angel Michael.
Hardly enough to distance from them. They meet on Saturdays and see Michael exactly the way you see Jesus, as God's representative. The rest? You've been STRONGLY influenced, more than you know.

If they are somewhat right thats not a bad thing then.
They use to come to my home once a month to discuss why I thought they were wrong on some subjects. Me against six or seven of them. Finely they gave up trying to convert me. But some of them stop by to see how I am doing. Most a nice folks. JW's are not Sabbath keepers, I am.
I have been debating with JW's for over forty years... I had six of them in my living room...
Christ is the FIRST creation. God created all through him, even time. That would mean that both the Father and the Son can be considered as "Alpha and Omega"
Agreeing with the JW Kingdomrose about the 'creation of the Lord Jesus.'
Amen friend, I could not have said it better.
God... sent his spirit son, the express image, to dwell as a human in Jesus who was the body prepared for the spirit son. Heb 10:5
...Jesus was elevated to Lord of all creation by his God AFTER he rose into heaven. He is Lord, his God and our God tells us that. But he is still not the most high God. He is "a" god, a form of God, he is the exact image of his Father, a creation, a creature. Not God.
Doesn't matter where you disagree, you have been 1) influence greatly by JW's and 2) as far as doctrine are in ESSENTIAL agreement with them. They do worship on Saturdays.
Your Jehovah Witness roots are still well entrenched. :nono:

Yep, he can deny it all he likes. By his own admission, these are really the only ones he's fellowshipped with for the past 40 years. :plain:
40 years of arguing? Makes sense why he's still at it on TOL. Arguing is in his blood now :(
 

keypurr

Well-known member
Keypurr, is your mind (ie thought processes) in you? Does that make you two entities or one?

Keypurr. Read the following verse:

Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, - Philippians 2:5 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Philippians2:5&version=NKJV

Now, look at the verse again, in Greek:

e40323692b93343770af49c19a3968d7.jpg


Notice the word φρονεῖτε (phroneite), a verb that means to entertain a thought, or to be of the same mindset.

0fdb3e205bf8d376e9333787d6f80fb0.jpg


Nothing in that definition means to be indwelt by another entity, or to be taken over by another spirit.

The root word of phroneite, φρονέω (phroneo), means the feelings (or sensitive nature; by extension (also in the plural) the mind or cognitive faculties):—understanding.

The usage of φρονέω (phroneō) (the base word of phroneite) is:
  1. to have understanding, to be wise
  2. to feel, to think
    • to have an opinion of one's self, think of one's self, to be modest, not let one's opinion (though just) of himself exceed the bounds of modesty
    • to think or judge what one's opinion is
    • to be of the same mind i.e. agreed together, cherish the same views, be harmonious
  3. to direct one's mind to a thing, to seek, to strive for
    • to seek one's interest or advantage
    • to be of one's party, side with him (in public affairs)

The word used in Philippians 2:5 is the same word used in Matthew 16:23, Mark 8:33, Acts 28:22, Romans 8:5, 12:3,16, 14:6, 15:5, 1 Corinthians 4:6, 13:11, 2 Corinthians 13:11, Galatians 5:10, Philippians 1:7, 2:2, 3:15,16,19, 4:2,10, and Colossians 3:2.

Not one of those verses which contain the same word/phrase as Philippians 2:5 mean to have another entity living in your body. They all mean to be like-minded, or to have the same mindset, or to think like someone else.

Interesting point JR, but I see both sides of the coin. The big stumbling block to your post is Heb 10:5.
Why was a body provided for the logos?

I will ponder over it for awhile.
 

keypurr

Well-known member
If you bothered to read the context, you might be able to see past your private interpretations. :idunno:


You refuse to read what is written......just exactly what God's Untruth does, which is how she comes up with her own batch of private interpretations that do not comport with God's word.

Read the Scripture..... and you dare to deny this speaks of Christ's humility. :nono:

Phil 2:2 Fulfil ye my joy, that ye be likeminded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind. 3 Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves. 4 Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others. 5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:​

Let this "mind" be in you.....context, Keypurr, should be your best friend.

Ephesians 4:2
With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love;

Colossians 3:12 Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;​

I know your point friend but I think that more truth is in that verse that most see.

Ask yourself, Why was a body needed for Christ in Heb 10:5?

There is a very log story behind that.
 

Tambora

Get your armor ready!
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Keypurr, is your mind (ie thought processes) in you? Does that make you two entities or one?

Keypurr. Read the following verse:

Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, - Philippians 2:5 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Philippians2:5&version=NKJV

Now, look at the verse again, in Greek:

e40323692b93343770af49c19a3968d7.jpg


Notice the word φρονεῖτε (phroneite), a verb that means to entertain a thought, or to be of the same mindset.

0fdb3e205bf8d376e9333787d6f80fb0.jpg


Nothing in that definition means to be indwelt by another entity, or to be taken over by another spirit.

The root word of phroneite, φρονέω (phroneo), means the feelings (or sensitive nature; by extension (also in the plural) the mind or cognitive faculties):—understanding.

The usage of φρονέω (phroneō) (the base word of phroneite) is:
  1. to have understanding, to be wise
  2. to feel, to think
    • to have an opinion of one's self, think of one's self, to be modest, not let one's opinion (though just) of himself exceed the bounds of modesty
    • to think or judge what one's opinion is
    • to be of the same mind i.e. agreed together, cherish the same views, be harmonious
  3. to direct one's mind to a thing, to seek, to strive for
    • to seek one's interest or advantage
    • to be of one's party, side with him (in public affairs)

The word used in Philippians 2:5 is the same word used in Matthew 16:23, Mark 8:33, Acts 28:22, Romans 8:5, 12:3,16, 14:6, 15:5, 1 Corinthians 4:6, 13:11, 2 Corinthians 13:11, Galatians 5:10, Philippians 1:7, 2:2, 3:15,16,19, 4:2,10, and Colossians 3:2.

Not one of those verses which contain the same word/phrase as Philippians 2:5 mean to have another entity living in your body. They all mean to be like-minded, or to have the same mindset, or to think like someone else.
7062.gif
 

Tambora

Get your armor ready!
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
The Logos became flesh and dwelt among us. Jesus, being conceived of the Holy Spirit in the womb of Mary is not being "possessed". That's almost "demonic" to even say such a thing.



In fact, just reading your ungodly words makes my flesh crawl. You're in grave error, Keypurr. :sigh:
His theology creeped me out the first time I read read his post about it.
I think he's even made it a little creepier over time.
244.gif
 

glorydaz

Well-known member
I know your point friend but I think that more truth is in that verse that most see.

Ask yourself, Why was a body needed for Christ in Heb 10:5?

There is a very log story behind that.

God needed a body in order dwell among us. As was predicted, He came.

Isaiah 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.

Matthew 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

He needed a body as an offering for sin.

Heb. 10:10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

1 Timothy 1:15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.​
 

keypurr

Well-known member
Hardly enough to distance from them. They meet on Saturdays and see Michael exactly the way you see Jesus, as God's representative. The rest? You've been STRONGLY influenced, more than you know.



Agreeing with the JW Kingdomrose about the 'creation of the Lord Jesus.'


Doesn't matter where you disagree, you have been 1) influence greatly by JW's and 2) as far as doctrine are in ESSENTIAL agreement with them. They do worship on Saturdays.


Yep, he can deny it all he likes. By his own admission, these are really the only ones he's fellowshipped with for the past 40 years. :plain:
40 years of arguing? Makes sense why he's still at it on TOL. Arguing is in his blood now :(

The JWs up here worship just about everyday Lon, they hold no day Holier than another. You can say that most have been influenced by some church.

Hate to burst your bubble but if Jesus is a man, he is a creation, if he was not a man, he died for nothing. Same with the express IMAGE, ALL IMAGES ARE CREATIONS. CAN YOU NAME ONE THAT IS NOT CREATED?

Tell me why you think that Christ needed a BODY prepared for him as written in Heb 10:5?.

What was the logos before IT became flesh?

Did Jesus come down from heaven or was he born to Mary?

Why did he need to grow in wisdom if he is God?

Jesus was man, no man has seen God except the Son of Man that decended from above.

If you follow all the assumptions of the churches it only brings more questions. Like the Trinity doctrine.

I have been given something Lon, I must share it for my Lord and his God.
 

keypurr

Well-known member
His theology creeped me out the first time I read read his post about it.
I think he's even made it a little creepier over time.
244.gif

The logos is not Jesus, its what was given to Jesus at his anointing.

Seek truth, you have a way to go yet before you will find it.
 

keypurr

Well-known member
Save it. I didn't learn what I know about the Lord in any church.



I can't recall ever using that term. These blanket statements do not speak well for you.





Of course it sounds silly. It is silly. You have it upside down and backwards.

The Logos became flesh and dwelt among us. Jesus, being conceived of the Holy Spirit in the womb of Mary is not being "possessed". That's almost "demonic" to even say such a thing.



In fact, just reading your ungodly words makes my flesh crawl. You're in grave error, Keypurr. :sigh:

You should know that I do not see Jesus as the logos. I see the logos IN him.

Proof that you do not understand me or my words.
 

Lon

Well-known member
Hate to burst your bubble
You won't. No worries there :e4e:

but if Jesus is a man, he is a creation
:think: John 1:14 It's like you've never read that before... :think:

if he was not a man, he died for nothing.
At times, I wonder if you are even aware of any of the Creeds :(
...Or John 1:14

Same with the express IMAGE, ALL IMAGES ARE CREATIONS.
:nono: A reflection of what is already there. You are confusing 'image' with 'mirror' (noun).


CAN YOU NAME ONE THAT IS NOT CREATED?
All of them. It is an 'appearing' from what is already there, come together. The river? Already there. Your reflection? Already you. "Expression," already you.
Tell me why you think that Christ needed a BODY prepared for him as written in Heb 10:5?
I noticed you are pondering another's post over this. John 10:10 "I came." John 1:14 'became'

What was the logos before IT became flesh?
I noticed this too you are working on from the other post. John 17:5
Did Jesus come down from heaven or was he born to Mary?
Such can be both. You and I were 'created.' Jesus existed before the world and 'had' the Father's Glory - shared. Read it. It is that clear. John 17:5

Why did he need to grow in wisdom if he is God?
Because God, in a man's brain HAD to Philippians 2:7 Read it: "He" laid it aside and 'took on the nature' of a human.

Jesus was man, no man has seen God except the Son of Man that decended from above.
Great! We agree on this. John 1:18

If you follow all the assumptions of the churches it only brings more questions. Like the Trinity doctrine.
If all you ever see is that somehow Jesus AND the Father are God, you'll be very close to what it means to be "Triune"

I have been given something Lon, I must share it for my Lord and his God.
You've changed since your time on TOL AND have become more orthodox than you were. THAT is a good thing. It means, I believe, that you are correct, you've been given something by me, thus God. The more you receive from Him? The more triune you are going to be. Scriptures are this clear. In Him -Lon
 

Lazy afternoon

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You should know that I do not see Jesus as the logos. I see the logos IN him.

Proof that you do not understand me o}r my words.

Jesus became what He was (john 1:14) through God ministering His word to Him--

2Co 3:18 But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

LA
 

JudgeRightly

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Interesting point JR, but I see both sides of the coin. The big stumbling block to your post is Heb 10:5.
Why was a body provided for the logos?

I will ponder over it for awhile.

Keypurr, in the meantime, could you answer the questions I asked in my post?

As for the rest of your post:

No, Keypurr, it's not a stumbling block.

Let's look at the verse and the surrounding passage:

Spoiler
For the law, having a shadow of the good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with these same sacrifices, which they offer continually year by year, make those who approach perfect.For then would they not have ceased to be offered? For the worshipers, once purified, would have had no more consciousness of sins.But in those sacrifices there is a reminder of sins every year.For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and goats could take away sins.Therefore, when He came into the world, He said: “Sacrifice and offering You did not desire, But a body You have prepared for Me.In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin You had no pleasure.Then I said, ‘Behold, I have come— In the volume of the book it is written of Me— To do Your will, O God.’”Previously saying, “Sacrifice and offering, burnt offerings, and offerings for sin You did not desire, nor had pleasure in them ” (which are offered according to the law),then He said, “Behold, I have come to do Your will, O God.” He takes away the first that He may establish the second.By that will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. - Hebrews 10:1-10 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Hebrews10:1-10&version=NKJV[/QUOTE]

Keypurr, this passage is talking about how animal sacrifices are insufficient for purification, as it says in verse 2, if the ones who offer the sacrifice were made perfect through the sacrifices, then they wouldn't have had the "consciousness of sins," or in other words, their sin would be taken away.

Thus, a different offering had to be made, so that man could be purified. This offering had to be perfect, for only a perfect offering can make one perfect.

Verse 5 clarifies this, when Jesus (yes, Jesus is the one speaking) said, “Sacrifice and offering You did not desire, But a body You have prepared for Me.In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin You had no pleasure.Then I said, ‘Behold, I have come— In the volume of the book it is written of Me— To do Your will, O God.’”

Keypurr, in oder for a spirit to live in a physical universe for an extended period of time, the spirit would need a physical body. Thus, when the Word (John 1:1) came to Earth (John 1:14), he needed a body to live in. So before He came to Earth, the Father prepared a body for Him, by "coming upon" Mary (Luke 1:35), and thus Jesus (the Word, the Holy One, the Son of God) was conceived (became flesh) in Mary's womb. (John 1:1,14, Luke 1:35)

The Word Himself, who is God, is the perfect sacrifice, because the only one who is perfect is God, therefore God Himself had to come to pay for the redemption of mankind. No man could do it, but a Man had to be the sacrifice to save mankind. So God came as a man, the Man, Christ Jesus, and died on the cross to pay for our sins. Any other sacrifice would not have been sufficient to pay for his own sin, let alone the sin of the whole world. Jesus Christ, the Word, God, the Son of God, the Son of Man, is the perfect mediator between God and man, because He is both fully God and fully man.

Therefore the body of Jesus Christ was the offering, that the Word who became flesh might die so that we could live, being sanctified by His offering, "once for all."
 
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