James 1:1 refutes MAD

[john w]

Paul is rebuking the Corinthians.
1 Corinthians 11:17 Now in this that I declare unto you I praise you not, that ye come together not for the better, but for the worse.
1 Corinthians 11:18 For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.
No "might be also heresies among you", there "MUST be..."
1 Corinthians 11:19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.
When they came together it was not to eat the Lord's supper. It is possible though, that this is what they were calling it.
1 Corinthians 11:20 When ye come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lord's supper.
1 Corinthians 11:21 For in eating every one taketh before other his own supper: and one is hungry, and another is drunken.

Here they were eating and drinking in front of the church of God who had nothing (those in the church of God had sold out)! Paul was rebuking them.
1 Corinthians 11:22 What? have ye not houses to eat and to drink in? or despise ye the church of God, and shame them that have not? What shall I say to you? shall I praise you in this? I praise you not.
Paul is going to be recalling the same night in which the Lord was betrayed.
1 Corinthians 11:23 For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread:

Paul is still speaking of that night which the Lord was betrayed. He is NOT instructing the Corinthians to partake of the Lord's supper in remembrance of Him.

1 Corinthians 11:24 And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.
1 Corinthians 11:25 After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me.

Again, Paul is talking of the night the Lord was betrayed. He is not instructing the Corinthians to do it "til He come".

1 Corinthians 11:26 For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord's death till he come.

Here's where you are going to have BIG problems if you are saying the Lord's supper is to the church, the Body of Christ.

1 Corinthians 11:27 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.

So if we eat this bread and drink this cup of the Lord UNWORTHILY we are guilty of the body and blood of the Lord? How could a member of the Body of Christ be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord???!!!IMPOSSIBLE!

1 Corinthians 11:28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup.

Here again, another BIG problem for those who would say the Lord's supper is TO the Body of Christ.

1 Corinthians 11:29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.

If I, a member of the Body of Christ eateth and drinketh unworthily I eateth and drinketh damnation to myself not discerning the Lord's body???!!!IMPOSSIBLE!

1 Corinthians 11:30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.
1 Corinthians 11:31 For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.
1 Corinthians 11:32 But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.

Condemned with the world? Impossible (Romans 8:1 KJV)!

When reading of the same night in which the Lord was betrayed, who was the only one that ate of the bread, drank of the cup, was guilty of the body and blood of the Lord? Who is the one that ate and drank unworthily, ate and drank damnation unto himself, not discerning the Lord's body? There's only one...Judas Iscariot! It's not to us.

Another well thought out argument, your heir-ness! You may have convinced me! I admit that I've not studied this doctrinal dispute much. But do you not agree, that it should not be a divisive issue within the boc, and that those that do observe "the Lord's supper," do not necessarily, by doing so, acknowledge that the NC applies to them? Just a thought...

 

[heir]

Another well thought out argument, your heir-ness! You may have convinced me! I admit that I've not studied this doctrinal dispute much. But do you not agree, that it should not be a divisive issue within the boc, and that those that do observe "the Lord's supper," do not necessarily, by doing so, acknowledge that the NC applies to them? Just a thought...

:up: It should not be a divisive issue within the BoC and not all who partake of some form of it in a church setting believe the NC applies to them. There are plenty of examples within grace circles who have biblical knowledge of, believe and teach that the NC will be with the house of Israel and the house of Judah yet still partake of the traditional ordinance of what they call the Lord's supper. We all do well to study this and other doctrinal issues out that we can all 1 Corinthians 1:10 KJV.

 

[Danoh]

I have to disagree with you on this one heir. Paul is talking about (IMHO) about when they gathered to participate of the Lord's Supper they did not come to do that but they came in as like they simply coming to eat and not really to participate of the Lord's Supper with order for Paul says that

1 Cor. 11:21 For in eating every one taketh before other his own supper: and one is hungry, and another is drunken.
1 Cor. 11:22 What? have ye not houses to eat and to drink in? or despise ye the church of God, and shame them that have not? What shall I say to you? shall I praise you in this? I praise you not.

They were behaving incorrectly when they gathered together to participate of the Lord's Supper, Paul say some were even drunk. Can any one of us if we believe that we are to participate of the Lord's Supper or not come into the gathering drunk? Or get in front of others so that we can get the morsel before anybody else just in case?

I believe in participating of the Lord's Supper others do not and as Paul said, One person considers one day more sacred than another; another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind. (Romans 14:5-9).

For me I can say the same as Paul, One person considers participating of the Lord's Supper more sacred than not participating and others do not believe in participating of the Lord's Supper. Each should be fully convinced in their own mind. However, all should be done in order and not with debauchery as Paul is stating in 1 Corinthians 11.

I do not believe that Paul is stating that we are not to celebrate the Lord's Supper.

Yep.

I've studied that chapter in depth repeatedly and yours is exactly the flow of Paul's thought on that verse.

Even Paul's use of the word "heresies" is defined not only by his use of it there, by what he is saying when he then uses it, but also, by his use also, of the word "divisions" while describing the same thing about them, once more.

Every argument posed against the practice of the Lord's Supper is equally full of holes.

The main hole being a simple failure at the grammar.

But just as some non MADs on TOL have also often proven; until people get better at their grasp of the language, they will not see their error no matter how it is pointed out.

The only solution being the one suggested by the the Lord through the Apostle Paul - the solution of Romans 14:5; easily enabled when Romans 5:6-8 is kept in mind.

Or as He put that elswhere through the Apostle Paul...

2 Corinthians 5:14 For the love of Christ constraineth us; because we thus judge, that if one died for all, then were all dead: 5:15 And that he died for all, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.

To do so is to discern the Lord's Body - for whom He died - that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again via their living for one another in His memory.

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

Paul is rebuking the Corinthians.
1 Corinthians 11:17 Now in this that I declare unto you I praise you not, that ye come together not for the better, but for the worse.
1 Corinthians 11:18 For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it.
No "might be also heresies among you", there "MUST be..."
1 Corinthians 11:19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.
When they came together it was not to eat the Lord's supper. It is possible though, that this is what they were calling it.
1 Corinthians 11:20 When ye come together therefore into one place, this is not to eat the Lord's supper.
1 Corinthians 11:21 For in eating every one taketh before other his own supper: and one is hungry, and another is drunken.

Here they were eating and drinking in front of the church of God who had nothing (those in the church of God had sold out)! Paul was rebuking them.
1 Corinthians 11:22 What? have ye not houses to eat and to drink in? or despise ye the church of God, and shame them that have not? What shall I say to you? shall I praise you in this? I praise you not.
Paul is going to be recalling the same night in which the Lord was betrayed.
1 Corinthians 11:23 For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread:

Paul is still speaking of that night which the Lord was betrayed. He is NOT instructing the Corinthians to partake of the Lord's supper in remembrance of Him.

1 Corinthians 11:24 And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me.
1 Corinthians 11:25 After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me.

Again, Paul is talking of the night the Lord was betrayed. He is not instructing the Corinthians to do it "til He come".

1 Corinthians 11:26 For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord's death till he come.

Here's where you are going to have BIG problems if you are saying the Lord's supper is to the church, the Body of Christ.

1 Corinthians 11:27 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.

So if we eat this bread and drink this cup of the Lord UNWORTHILY we are guilty of the body and blood of the Lord? How could a member of the Body of Christ be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord???!!!IMPOSSIBLE!

1 Corinthians 11:28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup.

Here again, another BIG problem for those who would say the Lord's supper is TO the Body of Christ.

1 Corinthians 11:29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.

If I, a member of the Body of Christ eateth and drinketh unworthily I eateth and drinketh damnation to myself not discerning the Lord's body???!!!IMPOSSIBLE!

1 Corinthians 11:30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.
1 Corinthians 11:31 For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.
1 Corinthians 11:32 But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.

Condemned with the world? Impossible (Romans 8:1 KJV)!

When reading of the same night in which the Lord was betrayed, who was the only one that ate of the bread, drank of the cup, was guilty of the body and blood of the Lord? Who is the one that ate and drank unworthily, ate and drank damnation unto himself, not discerning the Lord's body? There's only one...Judas Iscariot! It's not to us.

I concur. :e4e:

 

[Danoh]

I concur. :e4e:

Given how often you two prove you have poorly handled the flow of Paul's thought as he lays out one thing or another; I'm not in the least bit surprised you concur :chuckle:

Rom. 14:5; 5:6-8.

 

[john w]

Given how often you two prove you have poorly handled the flow of Paul's thought as he lays out one thing or another; I'm not in the least bit surprised you concur :chuckle:

Rom. 14:5; 5:6-8.

You're always right, Danoh. We know.

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

You're always right, Danoh. We know.

Danoh agrees with me and heir 95% of the time, but somehow our study methods and approach are "way off".

 

[Danoh]

Danoh agrees with me and heir 95% of the time, but somehow our study methods and approach are "way off".

Sheesh, bro - you keep insisting I foward you an "owner's manual," only to not see it.

Bad enough you have never said a peep about that lengthy study on Romans and Ephesians I forwarded you the links to some time ago :chuckle:

Anyway - the actual "owner's manual" is one simple principle...

It is nothing more than that thing that differs between when we, non MADs, or not, are on the same page, and when we are not.

Wherever, and when ever we find that we ARE on the same page, even with non MADs, this is because our approach has basically been the SAME in THAT.

In CONTRAST, where ever and when ever we find we are NOT on the same page, even with non MADs, this is because our approach has basically been DIFFERENT in THAT.

You and your pals can call that asserting one thinks one is right all the time, or you can call it something else.

That is on you, and is your loss.

For there is no room for personal animosity, nor for conclusions obviously not fully thought out; when one is actually out to learn a thing objectively.

Rom. 14:5; 5:6-8.

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

Given how often you two prove you have poorly handled the flow of Paul's thought as he lays out one thing or another; I'm not in the least bit surprised you concur :chuckle:

Rom. 14:5; 5:6-8.

 

[john w]

Danoh agrees with me and heir 95% of the time, but somehow our study methods and approach are "way off".

He shore is a mite culiar sometimes, Mayor. I agree with you and heir-ness about 93.7 % of the time, Sam; it's only when you go off on your Breenist hurryist tendencies, and when you "weigh in" on sports topics, that my jaw starts to clench, forcing me to down a few Natty Light's, and "Mr. Cookie Bars," on your sports falsifications. If there is one thing I can't stand, it's falsification. Am I getting through to you, fella? Good, Terry Forster, Jr. Wait...he was 322....

 

[Lazy afternoon]

Mat 26:26 And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed it, and brake it, and gave it to the disciples, and said, Take, eat; this is my body.
Mat 26:27 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it;
Mat 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

And who was Jesus doing this with? (hint, there were no Gentiles around)

There were gentile members of the Body of Christ in Corinth who Paul was instructing concerning eating and drinking unworthily, though I believe in a spiritual manner of partaking of His word and of His Spirit.

1Co 11:26 For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord's death till he come.
1Co 11:27 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.
1Co 11:28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup.
1Co 11:29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.
1Co 11:30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.
1Co 11:31 For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.
1Co 11:32 But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.

So your thought that Jesus was only referring to Jews, or Heirs ideas, are obviously false.

Here is verse for poor John W to ponder--

1Co 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.

LA

 

[Danoh]

And still no answer on those Romans and Ephesians studies I sent you that link to.

Sure, you wanted an "owner's manual" of sorts :chuckle:

As for your above - that is exactly what you do with the flow of thought in various chapters here and there - with Romans 1; with Romans 2; and so on in Romans.

With 1 Corinthians 2; and with other chapters in those two epistles.

And on and on.

When it comes to that, your approach is exactly that of the 28ers, but mixed in with that of the 9ers

JW is a 13er, so there goes his say, though I proved that off, which both he and the other 13er, Jerry, ignored, twice.

Y'all gonna cut fish, or bait - or what ever that expression is :chuckle:

 

[Danoh]

There were gentile members of the Body of Christ in Corinth who Paul was instructing concerning eating and drinking unworthily, though I believe in a spiritual manner of partaking of His word and of His Spirit.

1Co 11:26 For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord's death till he come.
1Co 11:27 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.
1Co 11:28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup.
1Co 11:29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.
1Co 11:30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.
1Co 11:31 For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.
1Co 11:32 But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned with the world.

So your thought that Jesus was only referring to Jews, or Heirs ideas, are obviously false.

Here is verse for poor John W to ponder--

1Co 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.

LA

You raise SOME good points.

And JR's point was off, but not for the reason you assert it was.

And this stuff is all basic Mid-Acts study approach to me - which is both why I differ with them on some of it, agree with you on some of it, and only appear to them that I think I am never wrong :chuckle:

Romans 5:6-8 towards ya, LA.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

Mat 26:26 And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed it, and brake it, and gave it to the disciples, and said, Take, eat; this is my body.
Mat 26:27 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it;
Mat 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

You reject, on record, that the Lord Jesus Christ is God, and again concede that you are not a member of the body of Christ, but a child of the devil. We know. I flushed you out again.

I am not "trying to justify," Damian, my identification/marking of you as a wolf, child of the devil; Nay....I make no apologies for hating minions of satan, wolves, such as yourself, for attempting to "spiritually" molest, plunder, and devour the sheep, and make them "twofold more the child of hell than" you-Matthew 23:15 KJV.

You fail again.

Show the record. You can not. We had another bigmouth here for some time a while back who discovered that I believed that God made Jesus Christ to be God over the new creation.

This after him speaking evil of me so many times.

You judge by your religion rather than be guided by Gods word who you obviously hate along with all of His disciples.

It is true that you are justifying your evil speaking and hatred by claiming I am of the evil one.

It will all come back on you in the end.

Pro 10:11 The mouth of a righteous man is a well of life: but violence covereth the mouth of the wicked.
Pro 10:12 Hatred stirreth up strifes: but love covereth all sins.
Pro 10:13 In the lips of him that hath understanding wisdom is found: but a rod is for the back of him that is void of understanding.
Pro 10:14 Wise men lay up knowledge: but the mouth of the foolish is near destruction.

LA

 

[Danoh]

You fail again.

Show the record. You can not. We had another bigmouth here for some time a while back who discovered that I believed that God made Jesus Christ to be God over the new creation.

This after him speaking evil of me so many times.

You judge by your religion rather than be guided by Gods word who you obviously hate along with all of His disciples.

It is true that you are justifying your evil speaking and hatred by claiming I am of the evil one.

It will all come back on you in the end.

Pro 10:11 The mouth of a righteous man is a well of life: but violence covereth the mouth of the wicked.
Pro 10:12 Hatred stirreth up strifes: but love covereth all sins.
Pro 10:13 In the lips of him that hath understanding wisdom is found: but a rod is for the back of him that is void of understanding.
Pro 10:14 Wise men lay up knowledge: but the mouth of the foolish is near destruction.

LA

What exactly is your understanding of salvation and how it is attained?

I mean, one should know that about another.

Post it privately to me, if you like.

2 Corinthians 5:13 For whether we be beside ourselves, it is to God: or whether we be sober, it is for your cause.

Rom. 5:6-8.

 

[john w]

You fail again.

Show the record. You can not.

You've been shown, for years, in numerous threads, by me/others,for years, Damian the Demon, citing chapter(s), verse(s), in which you can soak your satanic mind, connecting the dots, demonstrating that the LORD Jesus Christ is God, but your daddy the devil just keeps propping you up, pumping you up, encouraging you to deny it, so stuff your devilish lie, learned from the father of all lies.

 

[Epoisses]

Gentiles can't reject the N.C. because they can't accept it. Israel's only. You're not Israel.

LOST!! All non-dispensational Christians accept the new covenant from Protestant to Catholic to Orthodox.

You belong to a cult severed from Christ by your false prophet John Darby.

 

[Epoisses]

Tell us about this "the gospel" that your saint Judas preached. 16th request. You don't know that "the gospel," do you toots?

.She has no idea that Judas preached "the gospel." Ask the fat lady. She hasn't looked, much read, studied the bible, in years. My evidence? The above.

LOST!!! never part of the body of Christ and never will be.

 

[Epoisses]

Anyone who trusts the Lord believing that Christ died for our sins and that He was buried and rose again the third day as the all sufficient work of their salvation is baptized by one Spirit into one Body (1 Corinthians 12:13 KJV) and there's nothing you can say or do to change that (1 Corinthians 1:18 KJV).

All of those afore mentioned items are under the new covenant promise...duh!

 

[john w]

LOST!! All non-dispensational Christians accept the new covenant from Protestant to Catholic to Orthodox.

No, they don't. Fun!

You belong to a cult severed from Christ by your false prophet John Darby.

You belong to a satanic cult, the Roman Catholic Organization, as you follow the pope, as your religious prostitute, "Catholic," and is not Christian, demon.



"All" You couldn't prove that if an angel from heaven allegedly came down and told you. What a f moron, amateur.


Get saved, Simon the S.