"It is Finished and Jesus is Lord"

[marhig]

The Gospel is that work that Jesus did in our name and on our behalf that reconciles us to God.

In our name and on our behalf he fulfilled every jot and tittle of God's holy law, Matthew 5:18.

In our name and on our behalf Jesus atoned for our sins and the sins of the whole world, 1 John 2:2.

Because of the doing and the dying of Jesus we are complete in him, Colossians 2:10.

No the gospel is the word that Jesus peached and himself lived by!

 

[marhig]

Jesus is the end and the fulfillment of the Old Covenant, the law and the Jewish religion.

After Jesus fulfilled the law, he abolished it, Ephesians 2:15. Because of the work of Christ we now stand complete in him, Colossians 2:10.

This means that your religion is worthless.

Jesus fulfilled the law not it's not abolished, once we are born of the Spirit then the law should be written upon our hearts and in our minds and we should then establish the law.

People who live under the law obey it, but those who live by faith live by the law through love to please the the father. If we love God, then we won't be breaking his laws but we will be obeying him because we love him, we won't kill or steal or lie etc. Because those born of God through faith and by the power of the Spirit, should be dying to self and turning away from sin and overcoming their flesh, and in doing so they will be living by the will of God and by his laws. Once we are born of God, and have complete faith in him then obeying him should be first and foremost in our minds

 

[marhig]

Hi and what is does it means " IT IS FINISHED ."

The Greek word FINISHED is in the Greek PERFECT TENSE , PASSIVE and in the INDICATIVE MOOD >

#1 . The INDICATIVE MOOD means that Jesus coming is now FINISHED !!

#2 .The PASSIVE VOICES means that Jesus LAID down His life to redeem man , all men !!

#3 The PERFECT TENSE means that Jesus can NEVER die again for sins , EVER AGAIN !!

#4 This then means Jesus had to die for SINS , PAST , PRESENT and for FUTURE SINS !!

So much for Clavinism and Covenant Theology !!

dan p

When Jesus said "it is finished" he had overcome Satan and the world. It was done. And he had now created a new and living way for us to follow.

 

[marhig]

Beware of any doctrine or any person that places their doctrine or their religion in the same room with the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

The Gospel concerns Jesus and his work of redemption on behalf of fallen man. We had nothing, absolutely nothing to do with what God has accomplished in his Son Jesus Christ. All that is required of us is to believe it.

No we are not only required to believe, we are to be doers of the word and not hearers only.

When Jesus told his apostles and disciples to follow him, they didn't only have to believe, they laid down their lives to do the will of God and truly followed Jesus.

Jesus said that those who are not willing to take up their cross, are not worthy of him.

We are to deny ourselves, take up our cross to truly follow Jesus, add but just say with our mouths"i believe" lip service is no service.

If we truly believe in Jesus then we will live by the will of God as they who do this are those who truly belong to God and are the brothers, sisters and mother (church) of Christ!

 

[daqq]

Hi Daqq

I believe lifted up to mean lifted up in our hearts, as once he is lifted up in us he is glorified through us. Is this what you mean?

Sent from my MotoG3 using Tapatalk

Hi Marhig, I just meant in general that "lifted up" can also mean "exalted" which is akin to "glorified" but perhaps from just a slightly different angle or perspective.

John 3:14
14 And as Moses lifted up [G5312] the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: [G5312]

G5312 ὑψόω hupsoo (hï-pso'-ō) v.
to elevate.
{literally or figuratively}
[from G5311]
KJV: exalt, lift up
Root(s): G5311

G5311 ὕψος hupsos (hï '-psos) n.
1. elevation (high).
2. (abstractly) altitude.
3. (specially) the sky.
4. (figuratively) dignity, stature.
[from a derivative of G5228]
KJV: be exalted, height, (on) high
Root(s): G5228

What is used in John 3:14 can be rendered either way, "lifted up" or "exalted", it just depends on context but the meaning is really the same. Although "glorified" would not be the same word there should be no doubt that it is related to this in the context of John 7:39 and when the Master refers back to John 3:14 again in John 12:23-24, and the context which follows in John 12:25-31, and is followed up with another reference to John 3:14 in John 12:32-33 with the explanation that it certainly concerns his death. But besides that, yes, I do believe the Daystar rises up in our hearts in appointed times.

 

[Truster]

He didn't say "it is finished" He cried out, "It has been paid". Referring to the cost of redemption and that the debt owed had been paid, in full. Amen.

 

[marhig]

Hi Marhig, I just meant in general that "lifted up" can also mean "exalted" which is akin to "glorified" but perhaps from just a slightly different angle or perspective.

John 3:14
14 And as Moses lifted up [G5312] the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: [G5312]

G5312 ὑψόω hupsoo (hï-pso'-ō) v.
to elevate.
{literally or figuratively}
[from G5311]
KJV: exalt, lift up
Root(s): G5311

G5311 ὕψος hupsos (hï '-psos) n.
1. elevation (high).
2. (abstractly) altitude.
3. (specially) the sky.
4. (figuratively) dignity, stature.
[from a derivative of G5228]
KJV: be exalted, height, (on) high
Root(s): G5228

What is used in John 3:14 can be rendered either way, "lifted up" or "exalted", it just depends on context but the meaning is really the same. Although "glorified" would not be the same word there should be no doubt that it is related to this in the context of John 7:39 and when the Master refers back to John 3:14 again in John 12:23-24, and the context which follows in John 12:25-31, and is followed up with another reference to John 3:14 in John 12:32-33 with the explanation that it certainly concerns his death. But besides that, yes, I do believe the Daystar rises up in our hearts in appointed times.

I believe it like this.

When Moses lifted up the brass serpent in the wilderness, those who looked upon it, who were bitten of serpents were healed. Those who Christ is lifted up in, die to self and his life lives through them, then once we are born of God and bare witness to the truth, then those who truly believe in his word through his people and follow him are healed, because if they truly follow Jesus, they will do the will of God. And once they are born of God and walk in the spirit, then Christ within will be casting out our devil's and healing our hearts and we are reconciled to God through him.

I don't believe that Jesus lifted up on the wooden cross heals anyone, that death is not what draws all men to him, he was dead to his flesh before he died in the cross, and he had the full power of the Spirit, he was in the fullness of God bodily, and it's the word of God that draws all men to him by his ministry of reconciliation, which is the gospel he preached and lived by when he bore witness to the truth. And those who follow him and lay down their lives are saved from their old life of sin, and we are to then turn from sin and live by the will of God and truly follow Jesus. We are the earth that Jesus is to be lifted up from. And by him being manifest within our hearts by the power of the Spirit, and by the word of God, those who have faith and believe in the truth are set free from sin and death, if they are willing to lay down their lives to let Christ live through them, so that he through them can reconcile as many to God as possible.

I believe that this is how Jesus saves us. Not by dying on a cross. I don't believe the wooden cross saves anyone. We are saved by his life.

I hope that I've explained what I'm trying to say clearly

 

[marhig]

He didn't say "it is finished" He cried out, "It has been paid". Referring to the cost of redemption and that the debt owed had been paid, in full. Amen.

In my Bible he says, "it is finished" where are you reading that verse from?

Where does it say in the Bible that Jesus paid our debt in full by dying on the cross?

 

[Truster]

I believe it like this.

When Moses lifted up the brass serpent in the wilderness, those who looked upon it, who were bitten of serpents were healed. Those who Christ is lifted up in, die to self and his life lives through them, then once we are born of God and bare witness to the truth, then those who truly believe in his word through his people and follow him are healed, because if they truly follow Jesus, they will do the will of God. And once they are born of God and walk in the spirit, then Christ within will be casting out our devil's and healing our hearts and we are reconciled to God through him.

I don't believe that Jesus lifted up on the wooden cross heals anyone, that death is not what draws all men to him, he was dead to his flesh before he died in the cross, and he had the full power of the Spirit, he was in the fullness of God bodily, and it's the word of God that draws all men to him by his ministry of reconciliation, which is the gospel he preached and lived by when he bore witness to the truth. And those who follow him and lay down their lives are saved from their old life of sin, and we are to then turn from sin and live by the will of God and truly follow Jesus. We are the earth that Jesus is to be lifted up from. And by him being manifest within our hearts by the power of the Spirit, and by the word of God, those who have faith and believe in the truth are set free from sin and death, if they are willing to lay down their lives to let Christ live through them, so that he through them can reconcile as many to God as possible.

I believe that this is how Jesus saves us. Not by dying on a cross. I don't believe the wooden cross saves anyone. We are saved by his life.

I hope that I've explained what I'm trying to say clearly

For the preaching of the stake (cross) is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of Elohim.1 Corinthians 1:18

I hope this verse explains clearly that you are perishing.

 

[Truster]

In my Bible he says, "it is finished" where are you reading that verse from?

Where does it say in the Bible that Jesus paid our debt in full by dying on the cross?

There is only one place it can be found and that is John 19:30. It's the translation that is wrong. Messiah spoke both Hebrew and Aramaic at the stake (cross) and used the term shalam which means complete satisfaction, or a payment for a debt. Unfortunately the translators used the Greek word telios which means finished.

Second question you asked:

"Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification".
To fully comprehend this you would need to understand the difference between redemption (delivered for our offences) and justification.

 

[marhig]

For the preaching of the stake (cross) is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of Elohim.1 Corinthians 1:18

I hope this verse explains clearly that you are perishing.

I see that as this cross that Jesus bore, and it's foolishness to those that perish, because those who perish have no interest in the cross of Christ, They are quite happy living in the flesh saying all as they have to do is say "i believe" and that are saved. We are to deny ourselves, and bare our cross, to truly follow Jesus.

 

[marhig]

There is only one place it can be found and that is John 19:30. It's the translation that is wrong. Messiah spoke both Hebrew and Aramaic at the stake (cross) and used the term shalam which means complete satisfaction, or a payment for a debt. Unfortunately the translators used the Greek word telios which means finished.

Second question you asked:

"Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification".
To fully comprehend this you would need to understand the difference between redemption (delivered for our offences) and justification.

I'm sorry but it doesn't say anywhere in the Bible that our debt is paid in full by Jesus dying on the cross.

We will be judged on all we do, whether it be good or bad. Once we know God, we are to turn from sin, and live by the will of God, and in doing so we are truly following Christ and we become doers of the word.

 

[Truster]

I'm sorry but it doesn't say anywhere in the Bible that our debt is paid in full by Jesus dying on the cross.

We will be judged on all we do, whether it be good or bad. Once we know God, we are to turn from sin, and live by the will of God, and in doing so we are truly following Christ and we become doers of the word.

You are caught in salvation by works and unless you are converted you shall perish. You should be aware that your righteous acts are an abomination at the face of the Eternal. So when evil comes upon you and you wonder why. Be aware that the evil is a judgement for you works.

Proverbs 1:26-33
I also shall laugh at your calamity;
I shall deride when your dread cometh;
when your dread cometh as devastation
and your calamity cometh as a hurricane;
when tribulation and distress
cometh upon you.
Then shall they call upon Me,
but I shall not answer;
they shall seek me early,
but they shall not find me:
for that they hated knowledge,
and did not choose the awe of Yah Veh:
they willed none of my counsel:
they scorned all my reproof.
Therefore shall they eat the fruit of their own way,
and be satiated with their own counsels.
For the apostasy of the gullible
shall slaughter them,
and the serenity of fools shall destroy them.

But whoso hearkeneth unto me
shall tabernacle confidently
and shall relax from dread of evil.

DERIDE LINE 2
express contempt for; ridicule.

synonyms: ridicule, mock, jeer at, scoff at, jibe at, make fun of, poke fun at, laugh at, hold up to ridicule, pillory; disdain, disparage, denigrate, pooh-pooh, dismiss, slight, detract from; sneer at, scorn, pour/heap scorn on, taunt, insult, torment; treat with contempt, vilify; lampoon, satirize; informal knock, take the mickey out of; informal poke mullock at; vulgar slang take the piss out of; archaic contemn, flout at.

 

[Truster]

I'm sorry but it doesn't say anywhere in the Bible that our debt is paid in full by Jesus dying on the cross.

We will be judged on all we do, whether it be good or bad. Once we know God, we are to turn from sin, and live by the will of God, and in doing so we are truly following Christ and we become doers of the word.

I have been judged on the stake in Messiah and am now justified by trust.

" There is now no condemnation for those that are in Messiah"...

To the praise of the glory of His grace. Amen.

 

[marhig]

You are caught in salvation by works and unless you are converted you shall perish. You should be aware that your righteous acts are an abomination at the face of the Eternal. So when evil comes upon you and you wonder why. Be aware that the evil is a judgement for you works.

Proverbs 1:26-33
I also shall laugh at your calamity;
I shall deride when your dread cometh;
when your dread cometh as devastation
and your calamity cometh as a hurricane;
when tribulation and distress
cometh upon you.
Then shall they call upon Me,
but I shall not answer;
they shall seek me early,
but they shall not find me:
for that they hated knowledge,
and did not choose the awe of Yah Veh:
they willed none of my counsel:
they scorned all my reproof.
Therefore shall they eat the fruit of their own way,
and be satiated with their own counsels.
For the apostasy of the gullible
shall slaughter them,
and the serenity of fools shall destroy them.

But whoso hearkeneth unto me
shall tabernacle confidently
and shall relax from dread of evil.

DERIDE LINE 2
express contempt for; ridicule.

synonyms:ridicule, mock, jeer at, scoff at, jibe at, make fun of, poke fun at, laugh at, hold up to ridicule, pillory; disdain, disparage, denigrate, pooh-pooh, dismiss, slight, detract from; sneer at, scorn, pour/heap scorn on, taunt, insult, torment; treat with contempt, vilify; lampoon, satirize; informal knock, take the mickey out of; informal poke mullock at; vulgar slang take the piss out of; archaic contemn, flout at.

It clearly says in the Bible that we are judged on what we do, and you are not my judge to say that you know that i will perish. You don't know my heart and you are not God!

The only way we judge one another is by speaking the word of God. And God will judge those who have heard the truth. We are flesh, and we can't determine anyone's eternal destination. And as you judge, God judges you!

And those that are perishing are those who live by their own will, by the lusts of their flesh, and not by the will of God.

2 Corinthians 5

For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

 

[daqq]

I hope this verse explains clearly that you are perishing.

Yay! another King Judge in the place of God, just what I'm sure everyone was hoping for.

You are caught in salvation by works and unless you are converted you shall perish. You should be aware that your righteous acts are an abomination at the face of the Eternal. So when evil comes upon you and you wonder why. Be aware that the evil is a judgement for you works.

Proverbs 1:26-33
I also shall laugh at your calamity;
I shall deride when your dread cometh;
when your dread cometh as devastation
and your calamity cometh as a hurricane;
when tribulation and distress
cometh upon you.
Then shall they call upon Me,
but I shall not answer;
they shall seek me early,
but they shall not find me:
for that they hated knowledge,
and did not choose the awe of Yah Veh:
they willed none of my counsel:
they scorned all my reproof.
Therefore shall they eat the fruit of their own way,
and be satiated with their own counsels.
For the apostasy of the gullible
shall slaughter them,
and the serenity of fools shall destroy them.

But whoso hearkeneth unto me
shall tabernacle confidently
and shall relax from dread of evil.

DERIDE LINE 2
express contempt for; ridicule.

synonyms: ridicule, mock, jeer at, scoff at, jibe at, make fun of, poke fun at, laugh at, hold up to ridicule, pillory; disdain, disparage, denigrate, pooh-pooh, dismiss, slight, detract from; sneer at, scorn, pour/heap scorn on, taunt, insult, torment; treat with contempt, vilify; lampoon, satirize; informal knock, take the mickey out of; informal poke mullock at; vulgar slang take the piss out of; archaic contemn, flout at.

Yay! the King Judge is just like his image of his God, as should be expected.

I have been judged on the stake in Messiah and am now justified by trust.

" There is now no condemnation for those that are in Messiah"...

To the praise of the glory of His grace. Amen.

Yay! the King Judge cannot be condemned and is free to condemn!
I'm so happy for you, O King Judge in the place of God.
But I am also very glad you are nothing but a fraud.
And surely not God, (Yay! (lol)).
SHALAM!!! :chuckle:

 

[Evil.Eye.<(I)>]

It clearly says in the Bible that we are judged on what we do, and you are not my judge to say that you know that i will perish. You don't know my heart and you are not God!

The only way we judge one another is by speaking the word of God. And God will judge those who have heard the truth. We are flesh, and we can't determine anyone's eternal destination. And as you judge, God judges you!

And those that are perishing are those who live by their own will, by the lusts of their flesh, and not by the will of God.

2 Corinthians 5

For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

Do you know what "propitiation" means and where it's talked about in scripture?

 

[Truster]

Yay! another King Judge in the place of God, just what I'm sure everyone was hoping for.



Yay! the King Judge is just like his image of his God, as should be expected.



Yay! the King Judge cannot be condemned and is free to condemn!
I'm so happy for you, O King Judge in the place of God.
But I am also very glad you are nothing but a fraud.
And surely not God, (Yay! (lol)).
SHALAM!!! :chuckle:

We* are exhorted to judge all spirits and we do so by their teaching.

The Messiah praised the Ephesians for judging false prophets.

Spiritual man will be the judge of all things, but no man judges him.

My case was rested before I started typing, because they are firmly based on truth.

We* the regenerate.

 

[Robert Pate]

I believe it like this.

When Moses lifted up the brass serpent in the wilderness, those who looked upon it, who were bitten of serpents were healed. Those who Christ is lifted up in, die to self and his life lives through them, then once we are born of God and bare witness to the truth, then those who truly believe in his word through his people and follow him are healed, because if they truly follow Jesus, they will do the will of God. And once they are born of God and walk in the spirit, then Christ within will be casting out our devil's and healing our hearts and we are reconciled to God through him.

I don't believe that Jesus lifted up on the wooden cross heals anyone, that death is not what draws all men to him, he was dead to his flesh before he died in the cross, and he had the full power of the Spirit, he was in the fullness of God bodily, and it's the word of God that draws all men to him by his ministry of reconciliation, which is the gospel he preached and lived by when he bore witness to the truth. And those who follow him and lay down their lives are saved from their old life of sin, and we are to then turn from sin and live by the will of God and truly follow Jesus. We are the earth that Jesus is to be lifted up from. And by him being manifest within our hearts by the power of the Spirit, and by the word of God, those who have faith and believe in the truth are set free from sin and death, if they are willing to lay down their lives to let Christ live through them, so that he through them can reconcile as many to God as possible.

I believe that this is how Jesus saves us. Not by dying on a cross. I don't believe the wooden cross saves anyone. We are saved by his life.

I hope that I've explained what I'm trying to say clearly

You don't believe that Jesus dying on the cross saved anyone?

What you have is half of a Gospel, half of a Gospel is a perverted Gospel.

When Jesus died on the cross he put to death the whole human race in himself. This is why Paul said, "I have been crucified with Christ". When Jesus came out of Joseph's new tomb a new humanity came out with him, 2 Corinthians 5:17. We are complete in Christ, Colossians 2:10. His death is just as important as his life.

 

[daqq]

We* are exhorted to judge all spirits and we do so by their teaching.

The Messiah praised the Ephesians for judging false prophets.

Spiritual man will be the judge of all things, but no man judges him.

My case was rested before I started typing, because they are firmly based on truth.

We* the regenerate.

You forgot to judge yourself, O man, and you will die like a man, O god. :chuckle: