In Other News Today.....

some other dude

New member
Maybe that's why he wanted to change perception rather than law. Kids don't quit smoking cigarettes because they're illegal, it's because they are educated and realize how dangerous and harmful they are.

Nonsense. Kids quit smoking cigarettes when they realize how expensive they are.
 

annabenedetti

like marbles on glass
No objection from me. Do you think carrying a gun makes that person "cool"? Its not a perception I want people to have. :idunno:

Are you talking a 30-year-old with a legal CCW or a gang member? It's important to know if you draw a distinction that he doesn't.

Sounds good to me.

What "people?" Do you want me to change the way I think about guns, or my neighbor?

Too vague for me to agree with but in context of the entire video, I have no problem with the statement.

"it's wrong to carry a gun," without qualifying it, is indeed vague. What qualifiers would you add?

Good. Guns are not and should not be allowed in schools.

That's not what he said, surely you know that?

Brainwash is a careless phrase to use

But I suspect it was completely accurate.

but given his comparison to cigarette marketing, I understand and agree with his desire to change the perception on guns, especially among young males.

He predominantly uses the term "people."

The illegal carrying of a gun is the commission of a crime,

Agreed, sloppy phrasing on my part.

This was not a part of his message or concern from what I can gather.

This is where we've gathered differently.

He says "especially young males". Inner city male youth are where the problems lie. What are your recommended solutions if you dont like Holder's? That is where this began. I asked for solutions to gun violence and you sarcastically offered Holder's video. What do you offer as a sincere solution?

You sincerely offered more gun control as a solution. I sincerely disagree. The collapse of the family unit is behind inner city violence IMHO, and nothing less than a miracle will change that situation unfortunately, and sadly, for the innocents who have to grow up in such an environment. Strong male role models exemplifying such things as honorable behavior, a strong work ethic, a desire for educational success, etc. are all sociological options.
 

WizardofOz

New member
Are you talking a 30-year-old with a legal CCW or a gang member? It's important to know if you draw a distinction that he doesn't.

I don't carrying a gun is "cool", period. That isn't what carrying a gun should be about. It's a serious thing and not a "hip" or "cool" thing. Guns are for survival or recreation but not to be "cool".

"it's wrong to carry a gun," without qualifying it, is indeed vague. What qualifiers would you add?

It's wrong unless it's being carried legally.

You sincerely offered more gun control as a solution.

This again? Where?

The collapse of the family unit is behind inner city violence IMHO, and nothing less than a miracle will change that situation unfortunately, and sadly, for the innocents who have to grow up in such an environment. Strong male role models exemplifying such things as honorable behavior, a strong work ethic, a desire for educational success, etc. are all sociological options.

Until that miracle happens, perhaps we should discourage them from carrying guns. As SOD said, the problem with inner city culture is that "law-abiding" isn't seen as "cool".
 

some other dude

New member
The collapse of the family unit is behind inner city violence IMHO, and nothing less than a miracle will change that situation unfortunately, and sadly, for the innocents who have to grow up in such an environment. Strong male role models exemplifying such things as honorable behavior, a strong work ethic, a desire for educational success, etc. are all sociological options.


...and totally unnecessary for economic survival as long as there's welfare to be had. :idunno:
 

Dena

New member
It wasn't in the news today but we had a fight in front of our house and one of the neighbors has threatened to kill my husband. One of them (17 year old) was arrested after he busted out the back window of a girls car with his foot. Thank goodness she didn't have children in the backseat. The cops handled the situation very well though, I must give them credit.

But I am sooooo ready to move to the other side of town.
 

WizardofOz

New member
Would you agree that in a free country that others may have a different opinion and 1. they shouldn't be bound to Holder's vocabulary choices and 2. it shouldn't affect their ability to have a legal right to own or to carry a gun? (Which I think the vast majority do with the proper frame of mind and sense of responsibility.) Disclaimer: I'm not talking about myself, this is hypothetical.

Bound by? No one, including Holder said anything about being bound by his vocabulary or affecting ones ability to legally own or carry a gun.

You're reading things into the video that just are not there. He mentioned making commercials with various celebrities :idunno:

But that's the problem. He didn't make that qualification.

Guilt by omission then?
Which rather proves my point. If law-abiding isn't seen as cool, carrying a gun isn't going to be seen as un-cool either. Instituting gun controls on the majority of legal and responsible gun owners in
an attempt to make guns un-cool to inner city gang members isn't going to work. It'll work on the law-abiding all right, but not on the law-breakers. Hence my point.

Your point is countering a nonexistent point no one made about gun control.

Discouraging them from carrying guns is fine

Then you agree with me, and Holder as seen in the video by extension. Thats all he talked about was discouragement.
 

WizardofOz

New member
You know, I'm just going to let this go.

Well, after this:

http://www.therightscoop.com/2001-eric-holder-used-911-to-argue-more-gun-control-laws/

I know that it's not as simple as you think it is, and ultimately, the game is a lot bigger than you think it is.

This is something else altogether. I asked what's wrong with Chicago. You wanted to discuss what's wrong with Eric Holder (there is plenty). I simply didn't see anything very wrong with what he said in the particular video you linked.

"The game", generally speaking, has not been brought up until this last post of yours, which says nothing about how big I think it is. ;)

But I've run out of enthusiasm for trying to argue this particular point. :e4e:
Fair enough :e4e:
 

WizardofOz

New member
Utah governor signs law mandating 72-hour wait for abortion


(Reuters) - Utah's Republican governor signed a law extending a required waiting period for women seeking an abortion to 72 hours on Tuesday, even though a similar requirement in South Dakota has been blocked in court, a spokeswoman said.

The decision by Governor Gary Herbert is expected to meet with approval from social conservatives in the heavily Republican state just four days after he upset some members of his party by vetoing a bill to curb sex education in schools.

"Governor Herbert is an adamant supporter of rights for the unborn," said Ally Isom, a spokeswoman for the governor. "He felt the bill appropriately allows a woman who's facing that decision to fully weigh her options and the implications of that decision."

The state currently requires a 24-hour waiting period before an abortion.



Good law or bad law?
A similar law has been struck down in SD yet Utah currently has a 24-hour required waiting period. What a difference two days makes? :idunno:
 

Stripe

Teenage Adaptive Ninja Turtle
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
Any law that ends with "...and then you can kill the baby" is a bad law.
 

WizardofOz

New member
Virginia poll: 52% oppose ultrasound law


A majority Virginians stand against the state’s new law that requires women seeking an abortion to undergo an ultrasound before the procedure, a new survey shows.

Fifty-two percent of voters said they opposed the law, compared with 41 percent who support it, according to a Quinnipiac University poll released Wednesday.

Further, an overwhelming 72 percent of Virginians said that the government should not make laws aimed at changing the minds of women who are seeking abortions.

Men disapprove more strongly of the non-invasive ultrasound law than women: 56 percent of men are against it and 38 percent back it, while women disapprove 49 percent to 44 percent.

Virginia lawmakers had considered a more drastic bill, requiring invasive ultrasounds, but tabled the legislation after a public outcry.



Surprised at all by the numbers? Should they matter? Do you feel this law would be any less or more effective than the 72 hour wait requirement in Utah?
 

WizardofOz

New member
Supreme Court appears willing to let most of health care law stand


The heart of the health care law championed by President Barack Obama may be in judicial trouble, but the Supreme Court appeared very inclined Wednesday to keep the rest of the sweeping reform legislation intact.

On the final day of its marathon public debate over the 2010 Affordable Care Act, the justices tackled what would happen if they ruled against the constitutionality of the individual mandate, the key funding mechanism of the law.

At issue Wednesday morning was whether the entire law's 450 or so provisions would have to be scrapped if the individual mandate were found unconstitutional.

A separate session is scheduled for Wednesday afternoon on whether states would be "coerced" by the federal government to expand their share of Medicaid costs and administration by the risk of losing that funding if they refuse.

Even though the health care law's "individual mandate"-- requiring most Americans to have health insurance beginning in 2014 or face a financial penalty-- appeared to be on shaky legal ground, few on the court seemed eager to take the drastic step and invalidate the rest of the landmark legislation.



Insurance Mandate


Do you support or oppose Romney/Obama care? Why?
 

WizardofOz

New member
Seven dead in California college shooting


Seven people died and three others were wounded in a shooting at a small California religious college Monday, Oakland police said.

An Asian male in his 40s was detained as a suspect, but he has not yet been charged in the shooting, according to police spokeswoman Johnna Watson said.

"We believe that this is the person," Watson said.

Police would not release the suspect's name or confirm his relationship to his victims or Oikos University in East Oakland, she said.

Several of the victims were students, Watson said.........

.......The college, which caters to the Korean American Christian community, offers degrees in theology, music, nursing and Asian medicine, according to its website.

The suspect was arrested outside a Safeway convenience store in nearby Alameda, California, San Francisco Chronicle reporter Henry Lee told CNN.

 
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