How the Gospel Works

[Robert Pate]

You make that quite clear. Sad.

You think that it is sad? I think that it is wonderful.

 

[Cross Reference]

You think that it is sad? I think that it is wonderful.

"Dangerous" might be a better word. Sorry. You might want to consider that because if you leave yourself in such a an exclusive relationship you run the risk of being your own "religion", which I sense is the case.

Do you consider yourself born again?.

 

[Robert Pate]

"Dangerous" might be a better word. Sorry. You might want to consider that because if you leave yourself in such a an exclusive relationship you run the risk of being your own "religion", which I sense is the case.

Do you consider yourself born again?.

It appears that you do not understand the Gospel and justification by faith.

At one time I didn't understand it either. I was very religious. You might say that I was the chief of all Pharisees.

In the Gospel Jesus is your substitute and representative. He comes into the world to do for you that which you are not capable of doing for yourself because you are a sinner. In your name and on your behalf he offers to God the Father a life of perfect obedience according to his holy law.

In your name and on your behalf he atones for your sins and the sins of the whole world, 1 john 2:2. When God accepted Jesus back into heaven you were accepted in him. You now sit in heavenly places in Jesus Christ, Ephesians 2:6.

Do you understand?

 

[Cross Reference]

It appears that you do not understand the Gospel and justification by faith.

At one time I didn't understand it either. I was very religious. You might say that I was the chief of all Pharisees.

In the Gospel Jesus is your substitute and representative. He comes into the world to do for you that which you are not capable of doing for yourself because you are a sinner. In your name and on your behalf he offers to God the Father a life of perfect obedience according to his holy law.

In your name and on your behalf he atones for your sins and the sins of the whole world, 1 john 2:2. When God accepted Jesus back into heaven you were accepted in him. You now sit in heavenly places in Jesus Christ, Ephesians 2:6.

Do you understand?

Do you consider yourself, born again???

I know that if I am pursuing God to know Him will all the bases of my life be covered, not before. cf Romans 8:1,2 KJV.

You say: Justification by faith? What is justified by faith, you or your sins?

Do you understand??

 

[Robert Pate]

Do you consider yourself, born again???

I know that if I am pursuing God to know Him will all the bases of my life be covered, not before. cf Romans 8:1,2 KJV.

You say: Justification by faith? What is justified by faith, you or your sins?

Do you understand??

I was born again by the word of God, which is the Gospel, 1 Peter 1:23.

To be justified by faith means that you have been justified by Christ. Jesus is the one that does the justifying, Romans 3:26.

Jesus is the one that justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles us and the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19.

No one will enter heaven that has not been justified by the doing and the dying of Jesus.

 

[Cross Reference]

I was born again by the word of God, which is the Gospel, 1 Peter 1:23.

I believe I asked if your sins were and will continue to be justified?

Check but, what about Vs 22? Are you there yet?

To be justified by faith means that you have been justified by Christ. Jesus is the one that does the justifying, Romans 3:26.

Does that mean you can sin and there be no need for you to repent?

Jesus is the one that justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles us and the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19.

Are you saying you are born again but still remain part of the ungodly?

No one will enter heaven that has not been justified by the doing and the dying of Jesus.

I read where "God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us." Romans 5:8 (KJV)

Does that mean all our sins, past, present, and future have been forgiven us; We can go on living as before and still be saved? If so may I ask if you believe that is what redemption to be all about?

 

[jsanford108]

The purpose of the Bible is to reveal Jesus Christ and his Gospel. It is not a Christian Torah.

I don't live by laws, rules or religion. I am not under the law, nor am I subject to it. This is why Paul wrote, "The Just Shall Live By Faith" Romans 1:17. Living by laws, rules and religion is NOT living by faith. What I just wrote is probably beyond your comprehension because you are in bondage to the law and religion.

I gave simple questions. You couldn't just answer them?

I understand that by answering, you must contradict yourself.

You use Scripture, out of context, in order to develop and defend your doctrine. I would warn against this, as the apostles do, as well.

Christ (who was infinitely superior to Paul) said "He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me." (John 14:21). So Christ says to obey God's law. He also says to "render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's," no doubt talking about state laws (not morality). So yes, according to Christ, you are subject to His Law, and should ethically follow the state laws (as long as they do disagree with God's law).

By following no law or rules, put forth by God, by Christ's own Words, you must not love Him.


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[Cross Reference]

"Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king.

To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world,

that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice." John 18:37 (KJV)

Jesus was speaking of both natures He possessed.

 

[Robert Pate]

I believe I asked if your sins were and will continue to be justified?

Check but, what about Vs 22? Are you there yet?



Does that mean you can sin and there be no need for you to repent?



Are you saying you are born again but still remain part of the ungodly?



I read where "God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us." Romans 5:8 (KJV)

Does that mean all our sins, past, present, and future have been forgiven us; We can go on living as before and still be saved? If so may I ask if you believe that is what redemption to be all about?

There is total and complete freedom in the Gospel. Because we are indwelt with the Holy Spirit we will not deliberately sin. Just as the law was the keeper for the Jews, so the Holy Spirit is the keeper for the Christian. The main thing about the Gospel is that we are "In Christ". We are trusting in the righteousness of Christ and not our own righteousness. The Christian always lives his life before God as a sinner, a saved sinner. This is why Paul referred to himself as "The Chief of Sinners" 1 Timothy 1:15.

 

[Robert Pate]

I gave simple questions. You couldn't just answer them?

I understand that by answering, you must contradict yourself.

You use Scripture, out of context, in order to develop and defend your doctrine. I would warn against this, as the apostles do, as well.

Christ (who was infinitely superior to Paul) said "He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me." (John 14:21). So Christ says to obey God's law. He also says to "render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's," no doubt talking about state laws (not morality). So yes, according to Christ, you are subject to His Law, and should ethically follow the state laws (as long as they do disagree with God's law).

By following no law or rules, put forth by God, by Christ's own Words, you must not love Him.


Sent from my iPhone using TOL

As long as you are in your Adamic body you are a sinner and you need Christ to save you.

You cannot keep the commandments or the law. It is not humanly possible. The law is the very nature and character of God. Are you as righteous as God? Paul says that you are a sinner, Romans 3:10 also Romans 3:23.

 

[Cross Reference]

What sins? God sees me as perfect and complete "In Christ" Colossians 2:10.

That is what I thought. "Cheap grace".:nono:

 

[Cross Reference]

As long as you are in your Adamic body you are a sinner and you need Christ to save you.

You cannot keep the commandments or the law. It is not humanly possible. The law is the very nature and character of God. Are you as righteous as God? Paul says that you are a sinner, Romans 3:10 also Romans 3:23.

Paul sez we, who are born again, are saints of God. Too bad you and dazed don't realise that get out of the grave and learn how to become faithful in Christ that ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom you would shine as lights in the world. Sad you miss that by your shortsighted understanding.

 

[jsanford108]

As long as you are in your Adamic body you are a sinner and you need Christ to save you.

You cannot keep the commandments or the law. It is not humanly possible. The law is the very nature and character of God. Are you as righteous as God? Paul says that you are a sinner, Romans 3:10 also Romans 3:23.

By your own words and logic then, we are all sinners. Thus, there are no saints among us. Therefore, every word you speak is coming from a sinner.

And I agree that we are all sinners.
I am not righteous. But I can keep the commandments. I have not killed anyone. Or stole. Or committed adultery. I haven't made an idol. Etc.

A person can keep the commandments and obey God/Christ. The only way a man, a sinner, can be righteous, is through the grace of God, in Christ. We are all sinners, made righteous only through Christ.

Also, if we are sinners in this life, only saved and made righteous by Christ, that is sanctification made upon death. Aka: a person is not fully sanctified until death. So, no "once saved, always saved."


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[Cross Reference]

By your own words and logic then, we are all sinners. Thus, there are no saints among us. Therefore, every word you speak is coming from a sinner.

And I agree that we are all sinners.

Therefore, none are able to be faithful in Christ.. . . something a saved individual is saved to do; to become.

 

[Robert Pate]

That is what I thought. "Cheap grace".:nono:

Salvation is a free gift from God. It cost us nothing, but it cost Jesus Christ everything.

 

[Robert Pate]

Therefore, none are able to be faithful in Christ.. . . something a saved individual is saved to do; to become.

We are saved for the purpose of becoming witnesses for Christ and his Gospel. You can become faithful to that purpose.

 

[Robert Pate]

By your own words and logic then, we are all sinners. Thus, there are no saints among us. Therefore, every word you speak is coming from a sinner.

And I agree that we are all sinners.
I am not righteous. But I can keep the commandments. I have not killed anyone. Or stole. Or committed adultery. I haven't made an idol. Etc.

A person can keep the commandments and obey God/Christ. The only way a man, a sinner, can be righteous, is through the grace of God, in Christ. We are all sinners, made righteous only through Christ.

Also, if we are sinners in this life, only saved and made righteous by Christ, that is sanctification made upon death. Aka: a person is not fully sanctified until death. So, no "once saved, always saved."


Sent from my iPhone using TOL

The minute that a sinner comes to Christ to be saved by him he receives the Holy Spirit. He is also justified, sanctified and redeemed, 1 Corinthians 1:30. God then places him in Christ and only sees him in Christ, Colossians 3:3.

 

[Cross Reference]

There is total and complete freedom in the Gospel. Because we are indwelt with the Holy Spirit we will not deliberately sin. Just as the law was the keeper for the Jews, so the Holy Spirit is the keeper for the Christian. The main thing about the Gospel is that we are "In Christ". We are trusting in the righteousness of Christ and not our own righteousness. The Christian always lives his life before God as a sinner, a saved sinner. This is why Paul referred to himself as "The Chief of Sinners" 1 Timothy 1:15.

Whose we? . . . . ". . . .God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.[so much for gace being unmerited]
Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you. Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded. Be afflicted, and mourn, and weep: let your laughter be turned to mourning, and your joy to heaviness. Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up. James 4:6-10 (KJV)

Personally, if I were you, I'd read that again, for the first time, and weep or perhaps in your case, learn to.

 

[Robert Pate]

Whose we? . . . . ". . . .God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.[so much for gace being unmerited]
Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you. Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded. Be afflicted, and mourn, and weep: let your laughter be turned to mourning, and your joy to heaviness. Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up. James 4:6-10 (KJV)

Personally, if I were you, I'd read that again, for the first time, and weep or perhaps in your case, learn to.

The book of James was written more for Jews than it was for Gentiles. This is why a lot of religious people such as yourself refer to it.

 

[Cross Reference]

The minute that a sinner comes to Christ to be saved by him he receives the Holy Spirit. He is also justified, sanctified and redeemed, 1 Corinthians 1:30. God then places him in Christ and only sees him in Christ, Colossians 3:3.

Nonsense! You have nothing from scripture that says that.

"IF ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God. Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth. For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God." Colossians 3:1-3 (KJV)


Spoken by Paul to born again Spirit filled, tongues speaking, Gifted, Pentecostal Christians. You, dazed & co. on the otherhand, see no reason to even worship God since you see yourselves as signed, sealed, and delivered to heaven's door.You have no need for Jesus.