ECT God does NOT grant eternal life

Bright Raven

Bright Raven

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Matthew 19:29 New King James Version (NKJV)

29 And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or wife[a] or children or lands, for My name’s sake, shall receive a hundredfold, and inherit eternal life.

John 6:54 New King James Version (NKJV)

54 Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 10:28 New King James Version (NKJV)

28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand.

Romans 6:23 New King James Version (NKJV)

23 For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
 
Rosenritter

Rosenritter

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Bright Raven said:
Matthew 19:29 New King James Version (NKJV)

29 And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or wife[a] or children or lands, for My name’s sake, shall receive a hundredfold, and inherit eternal life.

John 6:54 New King James Version (NKJV)

54 Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 10:28 New King James Version (NKJV)

28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand.

Romans 6:23 New King James Version (NKJV)

23 For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
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Unless one disputes that Jesus is God, John 10:28 (posted by Raven above) should be sufficient to prove that this thread title is mistaken, I should think. We've tried Romans 6:23 on Cross Reference multiple times and he seems unfazed however.
 
jamie

jamie

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Rosenritter said:
Did you notice that only those whose names are not written in the book of life are cast into hell fire? When are the names being written?
When is the book of life opened?
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The names are written when a person receives God's Spirit of life.

Romans 8:11: "But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you."

The Book of Life will be opened for most people during the Last Day.

John 7:37-39: "On the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried out, saying, 'If anyone thirsts, let him come to Me and drink. He who believes in Me, as the Scripture has said, out of his heart will flow rivers of living water.' But this He spoke concerning the Spirit whom those believing in Him would receive, for the Holy Spirit was not yet given because Jesus was not yet glorified."

Revelation 20:12: "And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books."

What is written in the Books?

John 12:47-48: "And if anyone hears My words and does not believe, I do not judge him for I did not come to judge the world but to save the world. He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him — the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day."

The Books are the Bible. Unbelievers will be taught God's word.

Isaiah 30:21: "Your ears shall hear a word behind you, saying, 'This is the way, walk in it' whenever you turn to the right hand or whenever you turn to the left."

Revelation 20:12: "And I saw the dead, small and great standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works by the things which were written in the books."

They will need to learn what is written in the Books before they can be judged. The Book 0f Life is opened to them symbolizing salvation by grace through faith. Then they will be judged for what they say and do, the same as us today.
 
Rosenritter

Rosenritter

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jamie said:
The names are written when a person receives God's Spirit of life.

Romans 8:11: "But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you."

The Book of Life will be opened for most people during the Last Day.

John 7:37-39: "On the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried out, saying, 'If anyone thirsts, let him come to Me and drink. He who believes in Me, as the Scripture has said, out of his heart will flow rivers of living water.' But this He spoke concerning the Spirit whom those believing in Him would receive, for the Holy Spirit was not yet given because Jesus was not yet glorified."

Revelation 20:12: "And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books."

What is written in the Books?

John 12:47-48: "And if anyone hears My words and does not believe, I do not judge him for I did not come to judge the world but to save the world. He who rejects Me, and does not receive My words, has that which judges him — the word that I have spoken will judge him in the last day."

The Books are the Bible. Unbelievers will be taught God's word.

Isaiah 30:21: "Your ears shall hear a word behind you, saying, 'This is the way, walk in it' whenever you turn to the right hand or whenever you turn to the left."

Revelation 20:12: "And I saw the dead, small and great standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works by the things which were written in the books."

They will need to learn what is written in the Books before they can be judged. The Book 0f Life is opened to them symbolizing salvation by grace through faith. Then they will be judged for what they say and do, the same as us today.
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Thank you.
 
Bright Raven

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Rosenritter said:
Unless one disputes that Jesus is God, John 10:28 (posted by Raven above) should be sufficient to prove that this thread title is mistaken, I should think. We've tried Romans 6:23 on Cross Reference multiple times and he seems unfazed however.
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Do you believe in the atoning work of Christ on the cross?
 
Bright Raven

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Cross Reference said:
God does grant eternal life to anyone reconciled to Him anymore than He does not grant eternal death to those who die not reconciled to Him. It is what it is. Heaven is the is the only place a reconciled soul can go upon departing his flesh. The soul of man is a completely independent entity apart from the body, desired by God to be in complete union with Him. No flesh can please God. When the soul of a man refuses to grant God His desire, God has no choice but separate Himself from it which leaves it in eternal despair. (cf Gen 3:21 KJV) God is bound by the demand laid upon Him by His own Holiness, i.e., no sin; unreconciled soul, can stand in His Presence (Ex 33:20-23 KJV).

So now the issue becomes, what happens to the 'everliving unreconciled soul of man that when separated from its 'counterpart body' that was joined with it by God’s gifted "breath of Life"; human spirit, which upon the death of the body, is returned to God Who gave it? "Then shall the dust [body] return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it." Ecclesiastes 12:7 (KJV)

Leaving the soul of man that cannot die to be atoned for lest it remain eternally separated from the presence of God to aimlessly ‘drift’ in the blackest darkness downward as being in “bottomless pit” with complete sensation as to what is happening to it. “And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the “bottomless pit”. Revelation 9:1ff (KJV) 

I believe it is bottomless because God has made no place on earth to abide ”falling” man, either in this life or the next. Hence, no contact, no remembrance of them in the new Heaven and Earth. (cf1Sam28:7)

"But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you". Romans 8:9-11 (KJV)

In this is the word death never to be misunderstood to be a biological death where it ends in a sudden fashion but, a spiritual one that cannot ever end because of make up of man’s existence decreed to be in the likeness of God and we know, God cannot die. Therefore, when speaking of death in man it is meant to be understood as a departure away from the presence of God not unlike Lucifer who was cast out of Heaven; away from the Holy presence of God.
Question: Did Lucifer actually die? Did his soul die? Yes. Does he still exist? Again, yes. But for Satan, there will no resurrection but eternal chains.
Same as man. How come because his soul can't die and his body subjected to decay, resides in dust in the earth.

Why not ask yourself the question why God prevented Adam from eating of the tree of Life after he transgressed?

If I said that had he eaten of it would have placed none redeemable chains upon him and all his progeny; chains that could never be removed be God because he would have become as God . . . . but, without Holiness. Who is greater than God? Who could have redeemed him? Now re-read, “If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. Hebrews 6:6 (KJV)


Where could repentance have stemmed when there would have been not even the desire for it? “Vanity”, the law of the flesh, now being their eternal god. Reconciliation with God would have been impossible.


Now, bring this all up to the NT to understand what Jesus was attempting to convey to Nicodemus re new birth, for him to understand in his desire to know to also understand the responsibility that would have been laid upon him in the matter upon receiving it, Paul was attempting the convey in Heb.6:1-6 KJV.
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You do not believe the word of God so why do you post something like this in the exclusively Christian Theology forum. For you there is no God. All you do is show your own ignorance.
 
Rosenritter

Rosenritter

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Bright Raven said:
Do you believe in the atoning work of Christ on the cross?
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Assuming that isn't a trick question, yes. But I also believe that God forgave sin before He was lifted up, that He might draw all men to Him. Else how could any of the saints be counted as righteous when all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God? If I misunderstand the question I won't be offended if you spell it out for me.
 
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Cross Reference

Cross Reference

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TO WHOM TO MAY CONCERN,

I EDITED THE OP FOR WHAT I HOPE WILL CLEAR UP MISTAKES IN TRYING TO CONVEY MY UNDERSTANDING AND/OR, POOR WRITING OF IT. I HOPE I GOT IT ALL . . :)

I ASK FOR MY CHRISTIAN FRIENDS FORGIVENESS FOR ANY CONFUSION IT NO-DOUBT HAS CAUSED. THANK YOU.
 
jamie

jamie

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Cross Reference said:
TO WHOM TO MAY CONCERN,

I EDITED THE OP FOR WHAT I HOPE WILL CLEAR UP MISTAKES IN TRYING TO CONVEY MY UNDERSTANDING AND/OR, POOR WRITING OF IT. I HOPE I GOT IT ALL . . :)

I ASK FOR MY CHRISTIAN FRIENDS FORGIVENESS FOR ANY CONFUSION IT NO-DOUBT HAS CAUSED. THANK YOU.
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Why all caps?
 
TweetyBird

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jamie said:
Is there any possibility that you might be mistaken on this judgment issue?
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No, I am sure of what the Bible says about it.

Death is the only separation from God.
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The second death in the lake of fire is also separation from God - eternal torment. God is not there.

Psalms 139:7-8: "Where can I go from Your Spirit? Or where can I flee from Your presence? If I ascend into heaven, You are there, if I make my bed in hell, behold, You are there."
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The word "hell" in this verse is not hell fire - it's the grave - "sheol" and "hades" - are the place of the dead.

Hell fire is "gehenna" reserved for the devil and unbelievers - the lake of fire.
 
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