ECT Faulty covenant?

[Nang]

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

28 And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.

Nag's SOF: "Land" does not mean "land," you see, uh, urrr...

These verses prophesy about regeneration, experienced by all saved souls when they are brought from death to new life, by the resurrection power of the Holy Spirit. Read John 3:1-21
where Jesus Himself teaches and explains the words and promises of the prophets.

 

[northwye]

Also, the Old Covenant dealt with that which is physical, a physical bloodline from Abraham, physical circumcision of the males, a physical temple to worship God in, physical animal sacrifice for sin, etc. Being all in the physical, how did the multitude in the Old Covenant ever become born again spiritually? Yet there was in the Old Covenant a Remnant who were spiritual, and in fact the prophets were.

 

[Nang]

Also, the Old Covenant dealt with that which is physical, a physical bloodline from Abraham, physical circumcision of the males, a physical temple to worship God in, physical animal sacrifice for sin, etc. Being all in the physical, how did the multitude in the Old Covenant ever become born again spiritually? Yet there was in the Old Covenant a Remnant who were spiritual, and in fact the prophets were.

Agreed. The prophets testified to the miracle of grace and Spirit they realized in their own changed hearts and souls.

(This Truth examples the importance of learning "Remnant Theology.")

 

[john w]

These verses prophesy about regeneration, experienced by all saved souls when they are brought from death to new life, by the resurrection power of the Holy Spirit. Read John 3:1-21
where Jesus Himself teaches and explains the words and promises of the prophets.

Made up-it is one of the blessings of the New Covenant, promised to the believing remnant of Israel, not you, where they will keep the law, you deceiver:

And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.


Read it, Calvinist deceiver:

ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.


That does not depict today's BOC..

Jer. 31 KJV
31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


Read it, humanist:

And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother,


Of course, deceiver Nag craftily dismisses....

28 And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.


____
Romans 9:4 KJV Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;

 

[andyc]

Ez 11 KJV

16 Therefore say, Thus saith the Lord God; Although I have cast them far off among the heathen, and although I have scattered them among the countries, yet will I be to them as a little sanctuary in the countries where they shall come.

17 Therefore say, Thus saith the Lord God; I will even gather you from the people, and assemble you out of the countries where ye have been scattered, and I will give you the land of Israel.

18 And they shall come thither, and they shall take away all the detestable things thereof and all the abominations thereof from thence.

19 And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:

20 That they may walk in my statutes, and keep mine ordinances, and do them: and they shall be my people, and I will be their God.

Ez. 36 KJV
24 For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land.

25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

28 And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.

Romans 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? Certainly not! On the contrary, we establish the law.

Instead of walking in the flesh condemned by the law, we uphold the moral law by walking in the Spirit.

 

[Danoh]

Your "God causes them to obey", is totally made up, and ridiculous. But it made me laugh, so you get a point for that..

There you go, STP; the result of your constant OVER simplifications.

Simple stuff...over-simplified.

Try keeping in mind that you are not "speaking to the choir" when speaking to them.

In which case, the needed communication is "not the same."

 

[Nang]

Made up-it is one of the blessings of the New Covenant, promised to the believing remnant of Israel, not you, where they will keep the law, you deceiver:

And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.


Read it, Calvinist deceiver:

ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.


That does not depict today's BOC..

Jer. 31 KJV
31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


Read it, humanist:

And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother,


Of course, deceiver Nag craftily dismisses....

28 And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.


____
Romans 9:4 KJV Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises;

Only those born from above are given understanding of these promises of divine regeneration, that produces changed hearts, ears to hear, and eyes to see the Gospel of God. I Corinthians 2:9-16

 

[Danoh]

The old covenant was weak through the flesh, because the commandments aroused the sin nature.
STP has invented some kind of way in which people obeyed the commandments either without their flesh being aroused, or they were no longer human.

So stupid!

That was NOT what he'd MEANT.

 

[andyc]

That was NOT what he'd MEANT.

You don't say!

 

[User Name]

Hebrews 8:7 KJV
(7) For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.



What exactly do you think was faulty of the old covenant?

Cf. Hebrews 10:1, Hebrews 9:9, Hebrews 10:4 and Hebrews 9:12.

 

[Danoh]

You don't say!

Welcome back, by the way.

 

[DAN P]

Here's an interesting little question for the maddies to chew over.

What covenant did the Israelites delight in, that was preached by Jesus?

Hi and we only eat SOLID FOOD !~

As Acts 15:10 reveals , the LAW of MOSES was a YOKE that Israel could not bear !!

All those WITHOUT DISPENSATIONAL knowledge are INFANTS as 1 Cot 3:1 and 2 reveals and are still tied to MOTHER as they can not yet CHEW but drink MILK !!

dan p

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

See what happens when the likes of andy and Nang try to apply new covenant results to their own life?
They cannot, without rationalization, because it is not about them. They know good and well that God is not causing them to walk in his statutes...today.

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

So stupid!

What happened to sweet andy who always has his flesh under submission?

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

Only those born from above are given understanding of these promises of divine regeneration,

:chuckle:

It's 6th Grade English.
You just don't believe it.

 

[SaulToPaul 2]

Ez 11 KJV

16 Therefore say, Thus saith the Lord God; Although I have cast them far off among the heathen, and although I have scattered them among the countries, yet will I be to them as a little sanctuary in the countries where they shall come.

17 Therefore say, Thus saith the Lord God; I will even gather you from the people, and assemble you out of the countries where ye have been scattered, and I will give you the land of Israel.

18 And they shall come thither, and they shall take away all the detestable things thereof and all the abominations thereof from thence.

19 And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:

20 That they may walk in my statutes, and keep mine ordinances, and do them: and they shall be my people, and I will be their God.

Ez. 36 KJV
24 For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land.

25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

28 And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.

I believe it, saint john.

 

[Interplanner]

Hebrews 8:7 KJV
(7) For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.



What exactly do you think was faulty of the old covenant?

The human party! The 2nd was with Christ the perfect man, representative man.

That is why the 2P2P response about the new covenant is nonsense. it is not with Israel. It is with the "Israel" that is in Christ, whether Jew or Gentile.

Lurking behind everything the apostles teach is the belief that the "Israel" God always wanted was the mission effort to the nations, and it has finally arrived, empowered by the Spirit who was the promised gift to those with the faith of Abraham.

The land/monarchy promise is absolutely crushed and flattened by this view. As Mt 21:44 said, when the 'vineyard' of Isaiah 5 was turned over to those who have faith, regardless of race.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

That is why the 2P2P response about the new covenant is nonsense. it is not with Israel. It is with the "Israel" that is in Christ, whether Jew or Gentile.

You believe that the New Covenant is not with Israel? Well,you believe wrong. In the following passage we can see that this prophecy about the New Covenant has not yet been fulfilled and it is made with Israel:

"Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD: But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more" (Jer.31:31-34).​

We can see that the "fathers" of those who will belong to the house of Israel and the house of Judah in the future are those who broke the LORD's covenant. It was the physical descendants of Israel who did that. Therefore, since their fathers are the physical descendants of Israel then all those of both houses will also be the physical descendants of Israel.

And all of them, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, will have their sins forgiven and be saved. Since this has never happened in the past we know for a fact that the fulfillment of this prophecy remains in the future.

Of course these facts are way above your head and you will continue to teach that this prophecy has already been fulfilled and that it has nothing at all to do with the physical descendants of Israel.

 

[northwye]

"See what happens when the likes of andy and Nang try to apply new covenant results to their own life?
They cannot, without rationalization, because it is not about them. They know good and well that God is not causing them to walk in his statutes...today. "

Does anyone know of a statement by any of the early dispensationalists - John Darby, C.I. Scofield, Lewis S. Chafer, J. Dwight Pentecost or Charles C. Ryrie - saying that the New Covenant does not apply to Gentile Christians or to anyone during the period of the New Covenant? I have never read such a statement by an earlier dispensationalist or Christian Zionist. I would think they would have avoided making such a doctrine because the existence of the New Covenant is clearly implied all over the NT,, and stated to be in effect clearly in Hebrews. II Corinthians 3: 7-11 is about the two covenants, saying the Old Covenant was the ministration of death and ministration of condemnation, while the New Covenant is the ministration of the Spirit and of righteousness. Galatians 4: 24-26 is also about the two covenants, and Paul is not unclear in saying which is he better covenant.

Maybe the early dispensationalists knew that claiming the New Covenant was not in effect, or not in effect for believing non-Jews would discredit them and their whole system would be put in risk of being tossed out in the churches whose congregations had some memory of Reformation doctrines.

Remember that William Tyndale was not a Calvinist, and though Calvinism, especially under Beza, had problems, much of its doctrine was Biblical and not nearly as much of a revolt against Biblical doctrine and Christ's Gospel as dispensationalism is.

 

[Danoh]

You believe that Jeremiah 31 has already been fulfilled? Well,you believe wrong. In the following passage we can seethat this prophecy has not yet been fulfilled:

"Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD: But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more" (Jer.31:31-34).​

We can see that the "fathers" of those who will belong to the house of Israel and the house of Judah in the future are those who broke the LORD's covenant. It was the physical descendants of Israel who did that. Therefore, since their fathers are the physical descendants of Israel then all those of both houses will also be the physical descendants of Israel.

And all of them, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, will have their sins forgiven and be saved. Since this has never happened in the past we know for a fact that the fulfillment of this prophecy remains in the future.

Of course these facts are way above your head and you will continue to teach that this prophecy has already been fulfilled.

My understanding is that those passages are basically asserting His plan and purpose to make one nation under God out of Israel's BELIEVING Remnant.