Faith Without Works Is Dead

[Squeaky]

You obviously cannot even understand what the Lord Jesus said at John 5:24.

And instead of believing you when you say that no one is saved apart from works I will believe the words of Paul and those with him when he answered in the following way:

"And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house" (Acts 16:30-31).

I said
Do you have a comprehension problem? I never said one is not saved. I said faith is dead without works. If you want salvation you will have to have works. Saved and salvation are different.

Phil 2:12-13
12 Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling;
13 for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure.
(NKJ)

 

[clefty]

Faith Without Works Is Dead.
Luke 24:25
25 Then He said to them, "O foolish ones, and slow of heart to believe in all that the prophets have spoken!
1 Pet 2:15
15 For this is the will of God, that by doing good you may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men--
James 2:20
20 But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead?
James 2:26
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
1 Cor 1:20-21
20 Where is the wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the disputer of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?
21 For since, in the wisdom of God, the world through wisdom did not know God, it pleased God through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.
1 Cor 1:26-27
26 For you see your calling, brethren, that not many wise according to the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called.
27 But God has chosen the foolish things of the world to put to shame the wise, and God has chosen the weak things of the world to put to shame the things which are mighty;
2 Tim 2:23-24
23 But avoid foolish and ignorant disputes, knowing that they generate strife.
24 And a servant of the Lord must not quarrel but be gentle to all, able to teach, patient,
Titus 3:9
9 But avoid foolish disputes, genealogies, contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and useless.
Titus 3:3-6
3 For we ourselves were also once foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving various lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful and hating one another.
4 But when the kindness and the love of God our Savior toward man appeared,
5 not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit,
6 whom He poured out on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
Matt 7:24-27
24 "Therefore whoever hears these sayings of Mine, and does them, I will liken him to a wise man who built his house on the rock:
25 "and the rain descended, the floods came, and the winds blew and beat on that house; and it did not fall, for it was founded on the rock.
26 "Now everyone who hears these sayings of Mine, and does not do them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand:
27 "and the rain descended, the floods came, and the winds blew and beat on that house; and it fell. And great was its fall."
(NKJ)
xxx Faith without works is dead. Works prove your faith. True faith desires to prove it. Faith without works are the 5 virgins with empty lamps.

Hey what? Which works how when? Whose works?

Hey I know, how about you just choose whatever you want to do...as long as you are convinced in your own heart about it...

Take fruit to the altar instead of a lamb why don't ya?

Make a golden calf and claim it is the One who brought you out of bondage...

Choose to eat human flesh as long as you give thanks to God for it...

 

[Squeaky]

Hey what? Which works how when? Whose works?

Hey I know, how about you just choose whatever you want to do...as long as you are convinced in your own heart about it...

Take fruit to the altar instead of a lamb why don't ya?

Make a golden calf and claim it is the One who brought you out of bondage...

Choose to eat human flesh as long as you give thanks to God for it...

I said
Stop and think of what your doing. You are becoming defiled.

Heb 12:15
15 looking diligently lest anyone fall short of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up cause trouble, and by this many become defiled;
(NKJ)

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

I said
Stop and think of what your doing. You are becoming defiled.

Heb 12:15
15 looking diligently lest anyone fall short of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up cause trouble, and by this many become defiled;
(NKJ)

Hebrews was pertaining to the HEBREWS.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Do you believe that Paul and those with him were corrupting Christianity when they made it plain that faith is all that is needed to be saved?:

"And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house" (Acts 16:30-31).

Meshak doesn't know if she's saved or not. She believes "The Jehovah Witnesses" are godly people.

 

[Squeaky]

Hebrews was pertaining to the HEBREWS.

I said
I can warn him, your a lost cause.

 

[beameup]

Yes, but they were members of the Body of Christ.

The Jews were specifically tasked with bringing the entire NATION of Israel to repentance so that the Kingdom could be set-up immediately.
The Hebrew Epistles (including Hebrews) are addressed to this group of believers, tasked with conversion of the Hebrew NATION.
As such, the Hebrew Epistles (Hebrews-Jude) will have a profound importance and significance to Israel during the Tribulation.
With this in mind, they provide valuable information for the Body of Christ, as the Body is a separate entity from National Israel.

The Holy Spirit has left us an obvious clue concerning the Book of James:
James, a bond-servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ,
To the twelve tribes who are dispersed abroad: Greetings.

 

[KingdomRose]

Reply to Squeaky's post #1:

You are certainly correct, and have shown it clearly. The only reason I can see for people to argue with that is that it simply goes against what their clergymen have told them and they want to stay in their clergyman's good graces. Religious leaders teach this because it is an EASY road to "salvation." It appeals to people who want to do nothing. Thereby the clergy's pews and coffers become full.

Paul said that being a Christian would prove to be difficult, especially in the last days. It is difficult because a Christian has to DO THINGS just like Christ did, and maintain one's faithfulness.


"...In the last days it is going to be very difficult to be a Christian." (2Timothy 3:1, Living Bible)

"Let your light shine before men in such a way that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father who is in heaven." (Matthew 5:16, New American Standard Bible)

"For you have been called for this purpose, since Christ also suffered for you, leaving you an example for you to follow in his steps." (I Peter 2:21, NASB)

"...Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life." (Revelation 2:10b, NASB)

 

[Lazy afternoon]

You obviously cannot even understand what the Lord Jesus said at John 5:24.

And instead of believing you when you say that no one is saved apart from works I will believe the words of Paul and those with him when he answered in the following way:

"And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house" (Acts 16:30-31).

Act 16:30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
Act 16:31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.
Act 16:32 And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.
Act 16:33 And he took them the same hour of the night, and washed their stripes; and was baptized, he and all his, straightway.
Act 16:34 And when he had brought them into his house, he set meat before them, and rejoiced, believing in God with all his house.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

After reading this thread I have come of the understanding that I don't apply to the MAD belief camp. I believe all scripture is useful for reproof. Even those directed towards different churches in the NT. I don't see my self different from another human being believing in Christ Jesus except for my circumstances. Although the apostle is tackling on real problems unique to each letter I still believe it's useful to understand and apply the advice he gives. Such as the book of James. Is it wrong to believe that 'faith without works is dead'? Some people think works means for example you must be water baptized. The book speaks about loving others though. I can take from that book that Jesus wants me to love my neighbor. That's what I take from that book.

Madists take nothing from the book of James, especially the love thy neighbour bit.

LA

 

[Squeaky]

The Jews were specifically tasked with bringing the entire NATION of Israel to repentance so that the Kingdom could be set-up immediately.
The Hebrew Epistles (including Hebrews) are addressed to this group of believers, tasked with conversion of the Hebrew NATION.

I said
Now I have learned that there is no distinction between them when one is following the Holy Spirit. Because the Holy Spirit can use anything that is in the new testament. I know because of all the revelations I have received.

 

[Squeaky]

After reading this thread I have come of the understanding that I don't apply to the MAD belief camp. I believe all scripture is useful for reproof. Even those directed towards different churches in the NT. I don't see my self different from another human being believing in Christ Jesus except for my circumstances. Although the apostle is tackling on real problems unique to each letter I still believe it's useful to understand and apply the advice he gives. Such as the book of James. Is it wrong to believe that 'faith without works is dead'? Some people think works means for example you must be water baptized. The book speaks about loving others though. I can take from that book that Jesus wants me to love my neighbor. That's what I take from that book.

I said
When I see lables put on groups like MAD it bothers me. Because there are always lots of versions to every lable.

 

[Squeaky]

Reply to Squeaky's post #1:

You are certainly correct, and have shown it clearly. The only reason I can see for people to argue with that is that it simply goes against what their clergymen have told them and they want to stay in their clergyman's good graces. Religious leaders teach this because it is an EASY road to "salvation." It appeals to people who want to do nothing. Thereby the clergy's pews and coffers become full.

Paul said that being a Christian would prove to be difficult, especially in the last days. It is difficult because a Christian has to DO THINGS just like Christ did, and maintain one's faithfulness.


"...In the last days it is going to be very difficult to be a Christian." (2Timothy 3:1, Living Bible)

"Let your light shine before men in such a way that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father who is in heaven." (Matthew 5:16, New American Standard Bible)

"For you have been called for this purpose, since Christ also suffered for you, leaving you an example for you to follow in his steps." (I Peter 2:21, NASB)

"...Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life." (Revelation 2:10b, NASB)

I said
Your right. And that is what I find so sad. People worshiping their preacher rather than the Word of God.

 

[meshak]

Do you believe that Paul and those with him were corrupting Christianity when they made it plain that faith is all that is needed to be saved?:

"And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house" (Acts 16:30-31).

"Faith without deeds is dead" is so simple and clear. Why do you have the need to have twist verses out of context?

 

[clefty]

I said
Stop and think of what your doing. You are becoming defiled.

Heb 12:15
15 looking diligently lest anyone fall short of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up cause trouble, and by this many become defiled;
(NKJ)

Bitter? Me? I delight in His Law and rejoice in His truth...grateful for His grace I desire to please Him

I think you may be projecting here...it's ok...being corrected does cause one to be bitter resentful and resort to ad homs...

 

[meshak]

Bitter? Me? I delight in His Law and rejoice in His truth...grateful for His grace I desire to please Him

I think you may be projecting here...it's ok...being corrected does cause one to be bitter resentful and resort to ad homs...

You are arrogant and it is enemy of Jesus' teaching.

 

[clefty]

You are arrogant and it is enemy of Jesus' teaching.

Cute...tag team with squeaky...

Ok so what part of I delight in His Law is arrogant?

 

[Samie]

Are you under the illusion that the LORD does not know the heart of man and He doesn't know if a person has faith or not?

Let us look at this verse:

"Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life" (Jn.5:24; NIV).

In this verse the Greek word translated "believes" and the Greek word translated "has" are both in the "present" tense.

In The Blue Letter Bible we read the following meaning of the present tense:

"The present tense represents a simple statement of fact or reality viewed as occurring in actual time. In most cases this corresponds directly with the English present tense."

Therefore, John 5:24 is saying that those who were believing at the time the Lord Jesus spoke those words had already received eternal life. That is what is meant as something being "viewed as occuring in actual time."

Those who believed did not have to do anything to prove that they had faith because they received eternal life the moment when they believed.

Your conclusion seems inconsistent with the ONE WHO spoke the words recorded in John 5:24. Here's what He said as to when eternal life is received:

Mark 10:30 But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.

 

[Squeaky]

Bitter? Me? I delight in His Law and rejoice in His truth...grateful for His grace I desire to please Him

I think you may be projecting here...it's ok...being corrected does cause one to be bitter resentful and resort to ad homs...

I said
lolol I see now. Your either a Jew or a muslim. But that also reveals your bitterness. Because us Christians don't have to keep the Sabbath. That also reveals your dishonesty. My advice is that you really should go learn more about Christianity before you try to be a heckler. Your really not very good at it.

Ps 1:2
2 But his delight is in the law of the LORD, and in His law he meditates day and night.
(NKJ)

Ps 119:34-35
34 Give me understanding, and I shall keep Your law; indeed, I shall observe it with my whole heart.
35 Make me walk in the path of Your commandments, for I delight in it.
(NKJ)

 

[Ben Masada]

Faith Without Works is Dead.

Indeed, faith without works aka the Law aka obedience is akin to a body without its breath of life. Dead to say it in a word. (James 2:26)