Can a Christian lose their salvation

[JudgeRightly]

If they sin, they have already been erased.

So Jesus lied in John 10:27-29?

My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch out of My Father’s hand.

Bible Gateway passage: John 10:27-29 - New King James Version

My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand.

www.biblegateway.com

By walking in the light, there is no stumbling.

Indeed. And yet, sometimes, people stop walking in the light, and therefore they stumble.

Again, THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT GOD'S GRACE IS FOR!

Only a true turn from sin and baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of past sins can cause their conversion and eventual salvation.

False.

Neither "Turning from sin" nor "baptism" can cause salvation.

Only God can cause salvation. That would mean that those things merit salvation, and they do not.

And He said that whoever believes, He will save.

Continued sin, or as you metaphorically call it...stumbling...is the sign of not being reborn of Gods seed.

False.

One is saved by God based only on whether they have believed on Christ. If one has professed Christ, they are saved, because God is the one who saved him, not he who professed. Salvation is ENTIRELY God's work. Why are you trying to put yourself into God's role?

I couldn't find the name "Elijah" in the letter from James.
Did you mis-cite the author?

Again, had you read my post, you would have seen me QUOTING JAMES.

Here it is again, because you clearly aren't familiar with the Bible:

Elijah was a man with a nature like ours, and he prayed earnestly that it would not rain; and it did not rain on the land for three years and six months. And he prayed again, and the heaven gave rain, and the earth produced its fruit.

Bible Gateway passage: James 5:17, James 5:18 - New King James Version

Elijah was a man with a nature like ours, and he prayed earnestly that it would not rain; and it did not rain on the land for three years and six months.

www.biblegateway.com

Our opinions differ on that.

My opinion has nothing to do with it.

Your opinions are not in line with Scripture.

You do not believe God when He said, through Paul, "for by grace you have been saved, through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast."

And you are one of the most boastful people I've seen on this forum, claiming to be perfect and sinless, when only one Man was perfect and sinless.

You are wrong.

False.

You yourself have stated that you are not saved. That makes you a sinner in need of a Savior. Repent, before it's too late.

A true repentance from sin will make one an ex-sinner.

False.

Now therefore, why do you test God by putting a yoke on the neck of the disciples which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved in the same manner as they.”

Bible Gateway passage: Acts 15:10-11 - New King James Version

Now therefore, why do you test God by putting a yoke on the neck of the disciples which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved in the same manner as they.”

www.biblegateway.com

"True repentance from sin" does not merit salvation.

Only by believing in the One who died for your sins.

THAT'S GRACE!

Is that what you are?

I am no longer a sinner, but I still sin.

My identity is in Christ, not in sin.

His righteousness is imputed to my account.

Nothing I do, or have done, or ever will do, will cause Him to cast me away.

THAT'S GRACE!

A non-sinner

Yes.

My identity is in Christ.

I am no longer identified by the sin I have committed or will commit.

who is as perfect as God is perfect?

I will not be perfect until Christ's return, when I receive my glorified body.

You will not receive one, if you do not repent!

 

[Hoping]

Paul said that he and his some of his contempory addressees were already saved in the first century A.D.:

For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. (1 Corinthians 1:18)

He divides people into two groups: "us which are saved" and "them that perish". You telling us that you have never been saved is you telling us that you are one of them that perish; you are thereby advertising that the preaching of the cross is to you foolishness.

My salvation , and Paul's, is dependent on the final judgement.
Paul wrote..."For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?
But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it." (Rom 8:24-25)
What are you hoping for ?

 

[Hoping]

So Jesus lied in John 10:27-29?
My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch out of My Father’s hand.

Bible Gateway passage: John 10:27-29 - New King James Version

My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand.

www.biblegateway.com

If they committed a sin, they were children of the devil, and not of God.

Indeed. And yet, sometimes, people stop walking in the light, and therefore they stumble.

Supra.
"He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him." (1 John 2:10)

 

[7djengo7]

My salvation ,

I do not believed you are saved, you sinner. You're a Christ-hating child/servant of your father Satan.

and Paul's, is dependent on the final judgement.

False. Paul was already saved long ago, while he still walked the earth, 2,000 years ago. Besides, out of the other side of your mouth, you keep telling us that a person's salvation depends upon his/her works, but then you contradict yourself by saying it depends upon "the final judgement". For you to sit there and tell us that Paul has never been saved is for you to advertise that you love being known as the deranged retard you've shown yourself to be. Please, by all means, since you say Paul has never been saved, tell us what Paul, right now, needs to do in order to get saved in the future, at "the final judgement".

 

[7djengo7]

Paul wrote..."For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?
But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it." (Rom 8:24-25)

Yeah. And?

What you are doing is serving your father Satan by flatly contradicting what Paul wrote. Paul wrote: "For we ARE saved by hope", whereas you are asserting that Paul was NEVER saved, and is STILL NOT saved. Paul wrote: "For we ARE saved by HOPE", whereas you are asserting that nobody is saved, that nobody has ever been saved, and that it is "the final judgement" that will eventually save anybody who will get saved. Paul preaches salvation by FAITH ALONE, whereas you, a vicious serpent, preach salvation by JUDGEMENT ALONE.

What are you hoping for ?

Among other things, that you will only ever have very few, if any, people who are weak-minded enough to become your victims, victims of your heretical, Christ-hating venom. You are a ravening wolf.

 

[JudgeRightly]

If they committed a sin, they were children of the devil, and not of God.

Nope. You're trying say that those who are of God are of the devil.

Shame on you.

Supra.

Supra.

"He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him." (1 John 2:10)

Right, when walking in the light.

But occasionally, people STOP walking in the light, and thus, they stumble.

THAT'S WHAT GRACE IS FOR!

Grace is when someone gets something that they don't deserve.

Eternal life, when they sin, or rather, in spite of their sin.

You want it to be that God cannot show grace to anyone.

You deny God's grace, just so that you can claim that you are perfect, yet unsaved.

That's how much you have to twist God's word in order to uphold your personal beliefs.

You are NOT a Christian, Hoping. You need to repent! BEFORE IT'S TOO LATE!

 

[Hoping]

Nope. You're trying say that those who are of God are of the devil.
Shame on you.

You are saying that sin comes from those in Christ.
I can't agree, as there is no darkness in God. (1 John 1:5)

Right, when walking in the light.

Those walking in God don't waver.
They can't bring forth the devil's fruit, as they are born of God's seed.

But occasionally, people STOP walking in the light, and thus, they stumble.

We call them "posers", pretenders.
Were they actually walking in God, there would be none occasion of stumbling. (1 John 2:10)
Christianity isn't a revolving door religion like the OT Jewish one was.

THAT'S WHAT GRACE IS FOR!
Grace is when someone gets something that they don't deserve.
Eternal life, when they sin, or rather, in spite of their sin.
You want it to be that God cannot show grace to anyone.
You deny God's grace, just so that you can claim that you are perfect, yet unsaved.
That's how much you have to twist God's word in order to uphold your personal beliefs.
You are NOT a Christian, Hoping. You need to repent! BEFORE IT'S TOO LATE!

You see God's grace as a bandage, while I realize it is a cure.

 

[7djengo7]

But occasionally, people STOP walking in the light, and thus, they stumble.

Were they actually walking in God, there would be none occasion of stumbling.

So, @Hoping, basically, your doctrine is "Once walking in God, always walking in God" (OWIGAWIG). Yet, out of the other side of your mouth, you contradict it by telling us that you are presently "walking in God", but that you don't know that you will still be doing so years from now:

What I am in five or ten years may not be the same as I am right now.

If (as you like to tell yourself, and those of us who know better) you are "walking in God" right now, and if it is impossible for you to stop doing so, then how could you not be "walking in God" "in five or ten years" from now? You've once again shot down your own, heretical, logic-despising stupidity by means of your own, heretical, logic-despising stupidity.

 

[7djengo7]

We call them "posers", pretenders.
Were they actually walking in God, there would be none occasion of stumbling.

VS​

Many men start out strong, "in the Lord", but fall away later when things get tough

How can they "fall away" if, as you say, they have "none occasion of stumbling"? You've not thought this stuff through.

Those walking in God don't waver.

But, out the other side of your self-defeating mouth, you say they fall away:

Many men start out strong, "in the Lord", but fall away later when things get tough.

They can't bring forth the devil's fruit, as they are born of God's seed.

But, according to you, they fall away:

Many men start out strong, "in the Lord", but fall away later when things get tough.

 

[Hoping]

So, @Hoping, basically, your doctrine is "Once walking in God, always walking in God" (OWIGAWIG). Yet, out of the other side of your mouth, you contradict it by telling us that you are presently "walking in God", but that you don't know that you will still be doing so years from now:

That's right.
What I think of myself now may be proved wrong by sin tomorrow.
If I truly am "in Christ", I won't change back to being a child of the devil.
But if I am a poser, I could undo my conversion at any time.

If (as you like to tell yourself, and those of us who know better) you are "walking in God" right now, and if it is impossible for you to stop doing so, then how could you not be "walking in God" "in five or ten years" from now?

Right now I could think I was doing OK.
But unless I "do OK" until my, or, the end, what I think of myself now will be proved wrong.

 

[Hoping]

How can they "fall away" if, as you say, they have "none occasion of stumbling"? You've not thought this stuff through.

If they "fall away" they were posers.
Never really "in Christ Jesus".
Just going through he motions by their own power.

But, out the other side of your self-defeating mouth, you say they fall away:

Better said would be..."Manifested that they were fake Christians".

But, according to you, they fall away:

By appearances, they fell away.
In reality they were never "out of the flesh".

 

[7djengo7]

So, @Hoping, basically, your doctrine is "Once walking in God, always walking in God" (OWIGAWIG). Yet, out of the other side of your mouth, you contradict it by telling us that you are presently "walking in God", but that you don't know that you will still be doing so years from now:

That's right.

You are not right in the head. I've documented you in the act of glaringly contradicting yourself, and not only have you just noted your agreement with the fact of your self-contradiction, but you sit there actually doubling down in that very self-contradiction, as though you consider contradicting yourself is a good thing to do.

 

[7djengo7]

What I think of myself now may be proved wrong by sin tomorrow.
If I truly am "in Christ", I won't change back to being a child of the devil.

According to you, if you're "in Christ" now, you are incapable of sinning tomorrow. So, by admitting to us you are capable of sinning tomorrow, you are admitting to us that you think you are not "in Christ" now; you are admitting to us that you think you are a child of the devil. You've shot yourself down, you logic-despising heretic.

 

[7djengo7]

If they "fall away" they were posers.
Never really "in Christ Jesus".

So, by telling us you are capable of "falling away" tomorrow, you are telling us you are a poser, and that you are not now, and have never been, "in Christ Jesus".

 

[Hoping]

You are not right in the head. I've documented you in the act of glaringly contradicting yourself, and not only have you just noted your agreement with the fact of your self-contradiction, but you sit there actually doubling down in that very self-contradiction, as though you consider contradicting yourself is a good thing to do.

What you view as a contradiction I see as two different subjects.
Those reborn of God's seed cannot bring forth the devil's fruit.
No matter what religion men subscribe to, the seed from which they are born or reborn of can only bring forth after its own kind.
A man professing Christianity must be bringing forth God's fruit.

 

[7djengo7]

But, according to you, they fall away:

By appearances, they fell away.

But you did not say "by appearances" before; rather, you said they fall away:

Many men start out strong, "in the Lord", but fall away later when things get tough.

So now, once again shooting yourself in your foot, you've just changed your story from saying they do "fall away" to saying they do not "fall away".

 

[7djengo7]

What you view as a contradiction I see as two different subjects.

I view your self-contradiction as a self-contradiction. And what you are doing, now, is lying about your self-contradiction, and trying to distract attention from it by uttering nonsense like "I see as two different subjects". You clearly are highly devoted to your father Satan.

 

[Hoping]

According to you, if you're "in Christ" now, you are incapable of sinning tomorrow.

True, emphesis on the "if".
A sin would show I was lying about having been "in Christ", reborn, repentant, or a believer.

So, by admitting to us you are capable of sinning tomorrow, you are admitting to us that you think you are not "in Christ" now;

I am capable of doing what I want, and thankfully, I want to please God.
I could at any time make my conversion of no repute.
But because I am born of God's seed, I won't do that.

you are admitting to us that you think you are a child of the devil. You've shot yourself down, you logic-despising heretic.

Your misunderstanding leads you down wrong roads.

 

[Hoping]

But you did not say "by appearances" before; rather, you said they fall away:

So what ?

So now, once again shooting yourself in your foot, you've just changed your story from saying they do "fall away" to saying they do not "fall away".

Sinners can't masquerade as righteous men for too long of a time.
God roots out the posers.

 

[7djengo7]

God roots out the posers.

Your lying and glaring self-contradiction throughout this thread is a rooting-out of you, poser.