As They Hate Me, They Will Hate You Too

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beanieboy

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I think that I'm beginning to understand why people cling so much to being hated.
It's easy to be hated. You do so by hurling insult, being selfish, abusive, accusatory, and any number of bad things.

To be loved is difficult. You have to give without expecting return, hold your tongue, speak kindness in the face of evil. It's very difficult.

But one can justify being hated by claiming it to be of God. Even Satan uses the bible to twist it to his own purpose.

It seems a very lonely way to live.
I believe there is some difficulty in trying to be kind, and gentle, and selfless, just as it is difficult to get to the gym 3 times a week. But the alternative (to sit and eat cheetohs watching Maury and saying how bad the world is) isn't a very good way to live.

Seems better that one should rejoice and be exceedingly glad, and if you aren't, you should explore what needs to change. Easier isn't necessarily better.

Peace
 
Zakath

Zakath

Resident Atheist
Free-Agent Smith said:
Consistently pagan. :) or atheist, apostate or whatever.
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Consistently correct and "practically perfect in every way".

Mary Poppins stole it from me... ;)
 
Gerald

Gerald

Resident Fiend
Free-Agent Smith said:
You call them Christian. They call themselves Christian. As a whole I won't because as a whole I don't believe they are.
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In your opinion, what percentage of those who call themselves Christian actually are Christian? Most? Many? Some? Few? Very Few?

I know you have an opinion on the matter.
 
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cattyfan

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beanieboy said:
I didn't claim that MLK was Jesus.
I said that MLK died to help free people. He died because he stood up for his beliefs. He died for selfless reasons.
The bible says, "There is no greater love than one who gives his life for another."
King knew that if he fought for the rights of African Americans, he ran the chance of getting killed. But he did it anyway, because it was the right thing to do.

He behaved like Christ. He was not CHRIST. He behaved Christ-like.

As Christ commanded.

I point it out, and you get angry.

odd.
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Sweetie, I'm not angry. I was laughing at your ignorance and arrogance.

No one is in the same category as Christ, even if they, for five minutes, exhibit a Christ-like characteristic now and then. And in summary what you said was, "MLK was killed for justice, and Jesus was also killed for justice." And I state, " There was nothing "just" about either man's death."

Let's see...dies at quick death with a bullet while fighting for freedom for a group of people....dies a grueling, drawn-out death during unbearable torture while carrying the weight of all of mankind's sins to set all people free....hmmmm...a moment in time versus at eternity....

Same category? I don't think so.
 
Granite

Granite

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I don't think beanie said he was in the same category...maybe a not-perfect analogy though.
 
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cattyfan

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granite1010 said:
I don't think beanie said he was in the same category...maybe a not-perfect analogy though.
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let's take a look:

beanieboy said:
President Carter has been involved with Habitat for Humanity, an organization that calls on volunteers to help build houses and provided housing for people that need it.

Conservative and self proclaimed moralist and Christian Rusch LImbaugh mockingly calls him "The Carpenter President."

Ironically, Jesus was a Carpenter as well. Yet, Rusch hates Carter, who is following in the way of Christ in loving his fellow man, and being seen as a fool for doing good deeds without gaining wealth from it.

If you are hated for that, then you should feel elated.

Hitler is hated. That doesn't make him close to Jesus.
Martin Luther King, Jr. did good, but was persecuted and eventually killed for justice sake, similar to Christ.
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puts Carter in same class as Christ; charcterizes both as carpenters and "doing good deeds" (which is a laughable understatement when speaking of Jesus)

Puts MLK in same class with Christ; calls him "similar to Jesus"

If that's not putting 'em all in the same category, what is?
 
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beanieboy

New member
cattyfan said:
Sweetie, I'm not angry. I was laughing at your ignorance and arrogance.

No one is in the same category as Christ, even if they, for five minutes, exhibit a Christ-like characteristic now and then. And in summary what you said was, "MLK was killed for justice, and Jesus was also killed for justice." And I state, " There was nothing "just" about either man's death."

Let's see...dies at quick death with a bullet while fighting for freedom for a group of people....dies a grueling, drawn-out death during unbearable torture while carrying the weight of all of mankind's sins to set all people free....hmmmm...a moment in time versus at eternity....

Same category? I don't think so.
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So, what MLK did was not in keeping with what Christ taught?
Giving your life to lead people to freedom was not being an active christian?
MLK is not worshipped, yet he was a reverend, and spoke out against in justice, even when threatened with death. That wasn't what Christ wanted?

Do I say that MLK was the son of God, or that he died for our sins?
Or did I say that MLK was hated because he worshipped God, and so, lived a Christ-like life, and that threatened the powers that be?
The verse, "as they hated me, so will you be hated" applies here.

You, Catty, even appear to be angry when I simply suggest that MLK lived a Christ-like life, accusing me of suggesting that MLK was Christ.

You sound angry at MLK.

(I don't know anyone who prays to MLK, MLK never claimed to take away the sins of the world, etc., nor did I suggest it. I'm sorry if there is some confusion. I'm simply suggesting that, "as they hated Jesus, so will they hate you, such as, MLK.")

Is that more clear?
 
Zakath

Zakath

Resident Atheist
cattyfan said:
And I state, " There was nothing "just" about either man's death."

...dies a grueling, drawn-out death during unbearable torture while carrying the weight of all of mankind's sins to set all people free....hmmmm...a moment in time versus at eternity....
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Christian dogma teaches that Jesus was killed in time, not in eternity. The crucifixion had specific beginning and a specific ending. Otherwise the resurrection makes no sense.

Plain and simple, Jesus was a human sacrifice to fulfill alleged justice and blood requirement of YHWH.

Unfortunately, the real world does not bear out the reality of the theology...
 
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beanieboy

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Part of what Catty suggests is that MLK's death meant less because it was fast and quick, and not tortuous.

To me, death is death. Giving one's life is giving one's life.
But after The Passion, it seems that Christ giving his life wasn't enough, but that he had to give his life AND be tortured, and some suggest that was a requirement of God.

I have never seen evidence of God saying to take your best lamb, spit on it, swear at it, beat it, and then kill it slowly.
The bible says that there is no greater love than one who gives their life for another.

According to Catty, it depends on how much it hurt.

While I argued that MLK and Christ were killed fighting for Justice (MLK for African Americans to be treated with equality, Jesus to help all people know the true love of God and released from the oppression of the Pharisees, and of sin itself) they were not killed for "just" reasons.

They were killed fighting FOR justice.
When read calmly, it's pretty clear.
 
Granite

Granite

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Zakath said:
Following catty's logic, Paul's martyrdom was not as efficacious than Peter's.
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:think:

Mmmmm. This could turn into a contest. Mostly Heinous Martyrdom.
 
Lighthouse

Lighthouse

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beanieboy said:
I think that I'm beginning to understand why people cling so much to being hated.
It's easy to be hated. You do so by hurling insult, being selfish, abusive, accusatory, and any number of bad things.

To be loved is difficult. You have to give without expecting return, hold your tongue, speak kindness in the face of evil. It's very difficult.

But one can justify being hated by claiming it to be of God. Even Satan uses the bible to twist it to his own purpose.

It seems a very lonely way to live.
I believe there is some difficulty in trying to be kind, and gentle, and selfless, just as it is difficult to get to the gym 3 times a week. But the alternative (to sit and eat cheetohs watching Maury and saying how bad the world is) isn't a very good way to live.

Seems better that one should rejoice and be exceedingly glad, and if you aren't, you should explore what needs to change. Easier isn't necessarily better.

Peace
Click to expand...
Who said I wasn't exceedingly glad?:confused: I rejoice in all. And count everything joy, for the sake of Christ. For His life is abundant life. And there is no greater joy, than to live in that life. I feel sorry for you. All you know is death and sadness. So much that you've convinced yourself that you're happy. But you have to keep telling yourself that, to keep tje lie alive. But it will come crashing down around you, one of these days. I hope it happens before your physical life does, so that you may come to the end of yourself, and truly find Christ, and the love, joy and peace He has to offer.:cheers:
 
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