Greg Jennings
New member
That right there shows that you have no interest in truth, just what you want to be the truth.
Are pro-lifers who say No exception 4 rape/incest.. extremists?
- Thread starter republicanchick
- Start date
That right there shows that you have no interest in truth, just what you want to be the truth.
Greg Jennings
New member
So you don't have the ability to look at two sides of an issue? That actually makes perfect sense in light of what you say across this forum, but you should know that most people do have such a superhuman ability.
Ugh you just cannot be this thick, man. You have to be messing with me
glassjester
Well-known member
What makes this "living thing" worth caring for?
genuineoriginal
New member
I do have the ability to look at many different sides of an issue.
I also have the ability to reach a conclusion after examining many different sides.
About 25 years ago, I believed much the same as you do now.
Hopefully you will find out about the sides of the issue that you are currently not looking at, take some time to look at them, and come to a conclusion.
It is always fun to watch someone like you when you are projecting.
Feel free to back up your claim by showing one post where I called you a baby murderer. I will wait.
BTW, when you are unable to produce such a quote, will you claim you were mistaken or just lying?
Why? IF you truly believe that unborn babies are not worthy of protection, than it shouldn't matter how the mother got pregnant.
Which is why I am calling you on your inconsistent, emotional, self-serving, drivel of an argument.
The biological makeup, innocence and humanity of a baby conceived from rape is no different than that of one conceived due to consensual sex.
The two sides are:
The mother lives and allows her unborn baby to live
OR
The mother lives and kills her unborn baby
Greg Jennings
New member
Excuse me, shouting "baby killer!" not "baby murderer!" And that was a comment about your constant use of emotional language, not about you directly accusing anyone of killing a baby, as you obviously couldn't know if anyone had had an abortion on a forum without then telling you.
I will do what I did above, and explain (likely to no avail as you are on an emotional rampage) that it was a comment on your emotional language being completely out of control. I guess I literally thought you were Nancy Grace, too?
My onus is on the protection of the woman in a rape case. I've laid out my position clearly time and again. You don't like it. Sorry, but I don't really care if YOU like it. It's not about you, it's about not making someone who never wanted the responsibility of a child having it thrust on her via rape, and I think that's wrong. You don't. And I disagree with that. The difference between us is I won't call you a monster or lose my mind when you have the audacity to have your own opinion.
See above
And no one ever said differently. But I doubt you care about that.
I guess since it's obvious that nobody here has any interest in conversation, but instead only in name-calling, projecting, mud-slinging, and the belief that "only my way can be right and anyone who disagrees is stupid," I'll take a page out of what a friend here told me and simply quit engaging people in conversation about a topic that makes them so incensed that they can't think or see straight. Enjoy yourself, Rusha
Greg Jennings
New member
OR
the mother and the baby die in childbirth
OR
the mother kills herself out of depression and the baby also dies
OR
the mother has the baby and is unable to care for it properly
OR, OR, OR......
This is what I mean, Rusha, you are too emotionally charged up on this issue to think straight about it. Feel free to respond, but this will be my last post on this dreadful thread
Drama much? You use excuses and exaggerations of desperation and then accuse me of being *too charged up* on this issue.
Way to project.
You accused me of saying something I didn't say ... who again is being emotional, as well as dishonest?
Well, thank you for staying so calm and responsible, Ms. Coulter. Need a hanky?
No it isn't. Mother's do not need to intentionally kill their unborn babies via abortion in order to be protected from rape. The rape has already happened. They need medical and emotional support. Your way offers a quick fix that victimizes another defenseless human being.
True ... I don't not care for pro-abortion positions.
Right ... which is why you keep tripping over your feet grasping to defend your deplorable POV. :yawn:
Of course it's not about me, drama queen. It's about a mother and her innocent, unborn baby. You have still not explained why you are against *other* abortions that end with the SAME result. The unborn baby is dead. You are either against abortion OR pro-abortion. Get off the fence and quit pretending you value the lives of the unborn.
My opinion is one that does not condone the extermination of defenseless, unborn babies based on their location and the circumstances of their conception.
Right ... it's not good for you to engage in a topic that leaves you such an emotional wreck.
Of course.
glassjester
Well-known member
What makes this "living thing" worth caring for?
Greg, I have a question for you. But, before I ask it, let me explain something to you. When I was 18, I was raped. A few weeks (maybe about two months, give or take), I thought I was pregnant. I took a pregnancy test and it came up positive. I didn't know what to do. I knew that, if I had to look at that baby's face every day, I would think of my rapist and relive what had happened to me. I also knew that there was no way I could raise a baby. My family blamed me for the rape, telling me that if I hadn't been out at that time of night, it would never have happened.
Do you think I should have gotten an abortion, just based on what I've told you? I will tell you now that I didn't get an abortion. But, I will also tell you that I ended up miscarrying the baby. One of my friends, who lived close to me, came to me when she heard that I was pregnant and asked me if she and her husband could adopt the baby. They had been trying for five years and she couldn't conceive. Before I miscarried, I decided to let them adopt the baby. It wasn't because of anything she did or said, either. What helped me was someone showing me emotions, that you seem to totally disregard. A Christian couple were at the clinic the day I found out I was pregnant. The woman saw me come out, crying because I had no idea what to do. She and her husband offered to let me stay with them, they would cover all my medical costs (obstetric and counselling costs). They didn't ask me to give them the baby or do anything to earn my keep. All they did was show me that someone loved me. It was because of that couple that I eventually got over what had happened to me. It is because of that couple, that my late husband and I did the same thing, several times over. We would offer our home with all expenses taken care of to pregnant girls (raped or not). We didn't ask them to give us their babies. And, we showed them that we loved them no matter what. In the six years we were together, we helped four girls out like that. To help a girl who has been raped and may be pregnant, you have show emotion. This is an emotional event. Stepping back and being totally clinical about their situation does not help them at all.
Do you think I should have gotten an abortion, just based on what I've told you? I will tell you now that I didn't get an abortion. But, I will also tell you that I ended up miscarrying the baby. One of my friends, who lived close to me, came to me when she heard that I was pregnant and asked me if she and her husband could adopt the baby. They had been trying for five years and she couldn't conceive. Before I miscarried, I decided to let them adopt the baby. It wasn't because of anything she did or said, either. What helped me was someone showing me emotions, that you seem to totally disregard. A Christian couple were at the clinic the day I found out I was pregnant. The woman saw me come out, crying because I had no idea what to do. She and her husband offered to let me stay with them, they would cover all my medical costs (obstetric and counselling costs). They didn't ask me to give them the baby or do anything to earn my keep. All they did was show me that someone loved me. It was because of that couple that I eventually got over what had happened to me. It is because of that couple, that my late husband and I did the same thing, several times over. We would offer our home with all expenses taken care of to pregnant girls (raped or not). We didn't ask them to give us their babies. And, we showed them that we loved them no matter what. In the six years we were together, we helped four girls out like that. To help a girl who has been raped and may be pregnant, you have show emotion. This is an emotional event. Stepping back and being totally clinical about their situation does not help them at all.
republicanchick
New member
not so
The mother lives and allows her child to live
or
The child dies; the mother lives physically but is killed mentally and emotionally and spiritually
+
republicanchick
New member
she is right, it compromises the pro life position
You can't say it is murder and then allow it for those unfortunate children who had sinners for parents
+
republicanchick
New member
yeh, we've all heard THOUSANDS of stories like that... pregnant women going berserk and...
geez
actually it is the opposite
Pregnant women commit suicide at a FAR lower rate than non-pregnant
+++
Greg Jennings
New member
Firstly, I think your family blaming you for the rape is deplorable. Secondly, I have no problem (as I have said repeatedly, yet no one seems to notice [Rusha...cough cough]) with you choosing to not have an abortion. I simply want a rape victim to have the CHOICE to abort if they so choose. If they choose not to abort, as you did, then by all means they have every right to go through with the birth. All I'm saying is I don't want to FORCE a rape victim to birth a baby that she never wanted to begin with. Do you understand that?
Somehow the position of refusing to force a rape victim to endure further trauma makes me a monster in some people's eyes. But to me, forcing a rape victim to go through with a rape-induced pregnancy is monstrous. I would rather nobody get an abortion, whether the pregnancy is due to rape or otherwise, but I'll never advocate for forcing a rape victim to do anything against her will. Is my position clear?
To Rusha and others, it either isn't clear or they don't care about dissenting opinions (I'm leaning towards thinking the latter). I hope you are different in that regards. If you or anyone else wants further clarity on my position, feel free to read through the thread. If you do this, you'll find that I've answered every question posed, but Rusha and others simply refuse to acknowledge my answers and ask the same questions over and over again. It's dishonest, but on an online forum that's expected. Have a wonderful evening.
Greg Jennings
New member
And here we go again.....something I never said being thrown at me as an accusation. How shocking....
I said that an impregnated rape victim who is forced to birth a baby against her will might be inclined to take her life. How about you comment on that? And if you want to disagree Republicanchick, how about you do something you've never done before and look at some statistics?
I understand what you're saying. But, I don't agree with your position. When a rape victim finds out that she's pregnant by her rapist, she's just relived the rape in her mind and probably will for at least a few days to weeks. She's in no shape, mentally, to make such a life-changing decision, especially since she's already been blamed, by her family, for the rape. More than likely, she will need counseling to help her realize that it wasn't her fault and that nothing she did or didn't do could prevent the rape. She will also need someone to make sure that she knows she is loved and that, no matter what, she will be loved and supported by someone.
Most of the girls I know that have gone through this same experience have told me as much. I have helped girls who decided not to have abortions. But, I have also helped girls who have had abortions. Those that I helped were dealing with guilt over being raped (their families blamed them) plus they felt that they had just killed the babies they were carrying as a result of the rape. No. I never told the girls that they killed the babies. But, their own thoughts and feelings told them this. One of my best friends, when I was about 20, committed suicide because she could live with the guilt of killing her unborn child. She told me this before she committed suicide and wrote it in her suicide note. She needed someone to convince her that she was loved too. I just couldn't do enough for her. No matter what I said, she felt that having an abortion was unforgivable.
Your position is extremely clear. But, you also have to realize that a rape victim is in no way ready to make such a decision for herself and her unborn child. She needs to see her rapist face justice (And, I mean real justice, not what our courts provide now. I'm a firm believer in the death penalty for rapists because they have destroyed a woman's/girl's life. And, I definitely don't agree with the courts I've seen nowadays that give visitation rights to the "father" of the baby in cases of rape.). Only after seeing her rapist face justice and having people show her that she is loved will she begin to heal. In my case, I had one of the two things happen. People showed me that I was loved. My rapist got away with it because, before it happened, we were extremely good friends. I didn't think I wouldn't be safe with him. It took me ten years before I completely got over it. Now, I still remember. But, I no longer hate or blame myself for the rape. And, I know that with what I went through, I can help other women.
I cannot speak for all of the others. But, I can tell you that the reason Rusha is so passionate about this issue is because she actually cares about both the rape victim and the unborn child. I don't know if she's ever been raped or not. But, she shows the heart of someone who has been and has gone through the healing process. She knows that the rape victim needs love and support without the pressure of having to make a decision to abort the product of the violence committed against her. And, like many people, she doesn't want to see that someone thinks there is logic to offering a rape victim the "solution" of abortion. I agree with her.
I'm not going to ask you anymore questions, Greg. It will do nothing to change your mind, in my opinion. And, no matter how logical you think your opinion is, you're not going to convince any of us who see your viewpoint as illogical.
Greg Jennings
New member
Thank you for a clean, concise reply devoid of angry language that doesn't amount to anything more. I've also said that counseling is a good idea for rape victims, no argument there.
I fail to see how your idea of not letting the victim make a decision is somehow looking out for the victim, but your calm-minded approach is more than welcomed.
Couldn't have stated my views regarding your opinion (which you every right to hold) and that of Rusha and others any better myself. I think we understand each other
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glassjester
Well-known member
Maybe if I ask three times, you'll answer.
What makes this "living thing" worth caring for?