sentientsynth said:
This seems to me to be highly problematic.
Who cares what seems highly problematic to you?
If we do as you say and assume that God breathing life into Adam is synonymous with Him breathing holy spirit into him,
I didn't say that. The parallel has to do with the word for spirit (not necessarily THE Spirit although that too is referred to with the same Hebrew word) having "breath" as a secondary (if not a primary) meaning. The concepts of breath and spirit are connected is the point.
we must ask, then, how Adam and Eve, who did not yet possess fallen flesh or sin nature by which to be tempted, were beguiled by the Devil.
They were beguiled by Lucifer (not yet Satan). One does not have to have a "fallen flesh or sin nature" in order to sin. Lucifer and a third of the angelic hosts of heaven had neither and yet rebelled against God and were cast out of heaven as a result. Likewise Adam and Eve rebelled and were thus cast out of the Eden and where separated from God, which is spiritual death.
On the contrary, to possess both holy spirit and no sin nature would, to my mind, necessitate that neither Adam nor Eve were able to be deceived, unless, of course, we are prepared to maintain that once we receive our restored bodies we too will be able to be deceived by some means. A frightening prospect.
I just reread my post and I think it is quite clear that I never meant to suggest that they were given THE Holy Spirit but were simply given a spirit. And once again, I couldn't care less what is necessary "to your mind".
Furthermore, you have violated the contexts of these passages. The term ruwach, as you have already shown, is very broad. And the ruwach "of life" absolutely cannot be said to be spirit as in the spirit of God. Notice that even base animals possess the breath of life.
Read the post again, if you read it in the first place. To deny that the concepts of spirit and breath are connected in the Hebrew language is simply to deny the obvious.
- Ge 6:17 And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven; and every thing that is in the earth shall die.
- Ge 7:15 And they went in unto Noah into the ark, two and two of all flesh, wherein is the breath of life.
- Ge 7:22 All in whose nostrils was the breath of life, of all that was in the dry land, died.
And yet this exact same word is translated "Spirit" or "spirit" 232 times in the KJV including the very first time it is used in Genesis 1:2.
Thank you for proving my point.
As of yet, I am not prepared to say that zebras and monkeys possess the spirit of God.
Nor am I and I think you know that it was never my intention to suggest any such thing. I'm not stupid, are you?
In summary, clearly all that is shown by "breathed into his nostrils the breath of life" is that Adam was made alive.
Spiritually alive. That is, he was alive to God and could fellowship with Him. Can mere animals do that?
And the fact that his creation as a "living soul" is contrasted to the Lord being a "quickening spirit" is further evidence that Adam possessed no spirit.
You ignore the context of 1 Corinthians 15! Look just a few verses earlier...
1 Corinthians 15:20 But now Christ is risen from the dead, and has become the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21 For since by man came death, by Man also came the resurrection of the dead.
How could Adam have died spiritually if he never had a spirit to begin with?
Genesis 2:17 but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.
Adam didn't die physically for another 930 years and his soul didn't die nor can it, but on the day he ate of that Tree, he died spiritually.
I asked whence this doctrine of Adam possessing spirit comes. It does not come from scripture.
I have used nothing but Scripture to substantiate the doctrine.
It is a tradition of mere men.
This is funny coming from you, Augustine boy!
To support this doctrine, one must violate the context of passages and utterly deny what the terms involved mean. It's time to cast this demonic doctrine aside. It is clearly fallacious.
I count this as an intentional lie.
How so?
Premise one: Non spiritual or spiritually dead creatures cannot have a love relationship with God.
Premise two: Adam was created to have a love relationship with God.
Therefore Adam was spiritually alive.
In what way is that circular?
Resting in Him,
Clete