a case against Enyart's "Nicer than God"

[julie21]

Christ told us that He is the one way. The only way.

He told his disciples that if they come to a town where people do not want to hear the message, shake the dust off their sandals, and move along.

In effect, to hell with the willfully ignorant.

That's right Crow...Christ told the disciples to move on and not stick around to name call or de-base them, for the people had condemned themselves through their not being willing to see the Light and accept it as what it was, their eternal hope.

 

[Crow]

That's right Crow...Christ told the disciples to move on and not stick around to name call or de-base them, for the people had condemned themselves through their not being willing to see the Light and accept it as what it was, their eternal hope.

He did with the willfully ignorant who were disinterested. Now what did Christ do with those who kept seeking Him out and getting in His face with their stupidities?

His interactions with the Pharisees are a good illustration of His intentions toward that group.

 

[The Edge]

I think the real gist of it was in this paragraph:

"Mr. Enyart tells us time and time again that sometimes harsh words are needed. Yes, I agree, but SOMETIMES! Not all the time, and not just for the sake of using harsh words. Experience here has showed us that Enyartites are rude and harsh more than not, and they clearly enjoy it. This is not how a Christian should act. Gentiles are called dogs or swine. Again, unsaved people. And it says God hates wicked, bloodthirsty deceitful men….again unbelievers. Not how we are to treat believers who disagree with us on a minor point of doctrine. This 'Nicer than God' stuff is being used as a license to mock and demean brothers and sisters in Christ and it’s wrong. There are nuggets of truth in the article by Bob Enyart, but they apply to the watered down liberal churches, not the Christian church as a whole as he asserts."

Whether you agree with the sentiment or not he was targetting an idea of Enyart's that some here take and run. Sometimes into the ground.

Very good, granite. You see what I was trying to say.

I know where Enyart is coming from on Nicer than God. I know that many Christians are all watered down gospel and just trying to be lovey dovey and feel good. And I know that the gospel message offends sometimes. I agree with all of that. But the problem is that people are taking the article and using it as a license to mock people, both unbelievers and believers alike. And that is the heart of the problem, not Bob Enyart himself. And it is making some people on this board way to nasty and giving them a license to act the way they do. It's not the best witness for Christ that we can put forth. Actions speak louder than words.

No, I am not prepared to apologize, for having an opinion.

 

[Nathon Detroit]

No, I am not prepared to apologize, for having an opinion.

How about apologizing for willfully bearing false witness against another?

 

[The Edge]

Um, no. I spoke my opinion. I even said nice things about the guy. Bob Enyart is a man, and he's flawed just like me. I'm not apologizing for having a valid opinion. Go ahead and bad rep me again if you want. I have a point.

 

[logos_x]

I know where Enyart is coming from on Nicer than God. I know that many Christians are all watered down gospel and just trying to be lovey dovey and feel good. And I know that the gospel message offends sometimes. I agree with all of that. But the problem is that people are taking the article and using it as a license to mock people, both unbelievers and believers alike. And that is the heart of the problem, not Bob Enyart himself. And it is making some people on this board way to nasty and giving them a license to act the way they do. It's not the best witness for Christ that we can put forth. Actions speak louder than words.

I don't think most people would have any problem with this. It is a valid point.

But...since you also say that the problem isn't with Bob Enyart himself..and therefore also not with his "Nicer than God" article...perhaps it would be wise to apologize for at least the false title of this thread.
It isn't a case against Enyart's "Nicer than God", but an expose' of how some use it as license to ridicule and mock and isn't as effective as some seem to think...
The title..after all...isn't really reflecting the point you were trying to make...which I think is a point that needs to be made.

 

[The Edge]

I don't think most people would have any problem with this. It is a valid point.

But...since you also say that the problem isn't with Bob Enyart himself..and therefore also not with his "Nicer than God" article...perhaps it would be wise to apologize for at least the false title of this thread.
It isn't a case against Enyart's "Nicer than God", but an expose' of how some use it as license to ridicule and mock and isn't as effective as some seem to think...
The title..after all...isn't really reflecting the point you were trying to make...which I think is a point that needs to be made.

Perhaps. But it is the actions of the Enyartians that caused me to question the article in the first place. Then, when digging through the article, found some points in it to be very true, but I don't really think it needed to be written, as in my opinion it is doing no good and it is causing division in the church. And it is another example of certain sects of Christianity getting all wrapped around the axle on one teaching.

 

[Frank Ernest]

I'm with :crow:, oly: and julie21.

 

[Mr. 5020]

Experience here has showed us that Enyartites...

Perhaps. But it is the actions of the Enyartians...

Make up your mind man: Enyartites or Enyartians!?

 

[beanieboy]

So bascially what you're saying is we need to be Christlike and quit wasting responses on those that don't deserve it, like beanieboy.

I agree.

To hell with him! :thumb:

To hell with me?

That's not what Christ said. He didn't leave the Samaritans, and tell them to all go to hell. There is a time when people's hearts are open, and it is the HS that does that, not you.
The reason that you are getting so frustrated is that I won't accept Jesus on your timeline.

I think my conversion has little to do with your true concern for my soul, and more to do with your own ego, and being able to prove yourself right. I rarely see the fruits of the spirit in you, and so I see you as blind. I think my resistance tests your faith. You see that you can't control me, make me agree with you (even if you want to call that God, because it is your version of God), and that makes you frustrated. All I usually see from you is bitterness, anger, mocking, and little else to offer. And with all your huffing and puffing, you want me to convert, a strategy that pushes me farther away, if you haven't noticed.

So don't hold your breath.

 

[logos_x]

Perhaps. But it is the actions of the Enyartians that caused me to question the article in the first place. Then, when digging through the article, found some points in it to be very true, but I don't really think it needed to be written, as in my opinion it is doing no good and it is causing division in the church. And it is another example of certain sects of Christianity getting all wrapped around the axle on one teaching.

]To hell with him

Yeah.

 

[beefalobilly]

I don't think it's a good idea to try and put jesus or god into a tiny box, in other words, they aren't always one personality trait. That's a problem that some non-christians have is that the bible contradicts itself when it apparently gives God different attributes, as if the creator of the universe was a simplistic being that's only cabable of love and nothing else.

Same thing with jesus, the same jesus who performed the ultimate "nice" act of love (dying on the cross for us, "greater love has no one than this, that he lay down his life for his friends.") is the same jesus who pulled a whip out on the vendors in the temple and chased them out, turning over their tables.

So my point is, there's a time for both, and I don't know a whole lot about enyart, so I won't make any judgements on him, but I'd say we're supposed to be kind to most. No matter what you say about jesus, ultimately his greatest accomplishment is through what he did on the cross.

 

[beanieboy]

I don't think it's a good idea to try and put jesus or god into a tiny box, in other words, they aren't always one personality trait. That's a problem that some non-christians have is that the bible contradicts itself when it apparently gives God different attributes, as if the creator of the universe was a simplistic being that's only cabable of love and nothing else.

Same thing with jesus, the same jesus who performed the ultimate "nice" act of love (dying on the cross for us, "greater love has no one than this, that he lay down his life for his friends.") is the same jesus who pulled a whip out on the vendors in the temple and chased them out, turning over their tables.

So my point is, there's a time for both, and I don't know a whole lot about enyart, so I won't make any judgements on him, but I'd say we're supposed to be kind to most. No matter what you say about jesus, ultimately his greatest accomplishment is through what he did on the cross.

He made a whip because people were desecrating the temple (think televangelism.) He didn't whip prostitutes out of brothels.

 

[The Edge]

To hell with me?

That's not what Christ said. He didn't leave the Samaritans, and tell them to all go to hell. There is a time when people's hearts are open, and it is the HS that does that, not you.
The reason that you are getting so frustrated is that I won't accept Jesus on your timeline.

I think my conversion has little to do with your true concern for my soul, and more to do with your own ego, and being able to prove yourself right. I rarely see the fruits of the spirit in you, and so I see you as blind. I think my resistance tests your faith. You see that you can't control me, make me agree with you (even if you want to call that God, because it is your version of God), and that makes you frustrated. All I usually see from you is bitterness, anger, mocking, and little else to offer. And with all your huffing and puffing, you want me to convert, a strategy that pushes me farther away, if you haven't noticed.

So don't hold your breath.

Beanieboy, if you want someone to show you Christ, then you won't find it here. That's not what the Enyartians seem to care about.

 

[taoist]

Make up your mind man: Enyartites or Enyartians!?

I vote for Enyartians, it just seems so much more euphonic.

 

[Turbo]

Beanieboy, if you want someone to show you Christ...

He has demonstrated time and again that he doesn't.

then you won't find it here. That's not what the Enyartians seem to care about.

What about you?


(Note that the Edge used the words "seem to" to slightly soften an accusation he can't substantiate once again.)

 

[taoist]

n.b. for The Edge ... Enyart is (webmaster) Knight's pastor.

 

[beanieboy]

How about Enyartists?

 

[beanieboy]

He has demonstrated time and again that he doesn't.

I have come to discuss religion and examine people's beliefs, not to sign on to any one in particular. I have asked what the point is of TOL, and that was the understanding that I was given, not that I had an "obligation to buy."

 

[taoist]

Beanieboy, if you want someone to show you Christ, then you won't find it here. That's not what the Enyartians seem to care about.

I remember pulling out of a gas station once after stopping at the shop 'n go for a pack of smokes. As I dropped my leg over the saddle, this dude just standing next to me near his car just about jumped out of his skin. Of course, I was in full leathers. He stuttered something about being afraid I was gonna rob him.

I told him, "Look, if you park next to a bike, you oughta be expecting to run into a biker."