The fool has said in his heart,“There is no God.”They are corrupt,They have done abominable works,There is none who does good.
Folly of the Godless, and God’s Final Triumph - To the Chief Musician. A Psalm of David. The fool has said in his heart, “There is no God.” They are corrupt, They have done abominable works, There is none who does good.
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of the kind you and religion peddles in order to subdue the gullible masses so the question is meaningless.
This is all false.
But just for hypothetical discussion, such a God should not in the first place create living sentient robots to do his work and bidding.
He didn't create robots.
He created man.
Any living sentient creation should be given free reign to do as they please, to explore the universe and make their place within it. Freedom without caveats, constraints, guns to the head and pathetic threats of eternal punishment and other (nonsense).
He tried that. Guess what happened?
Man became so wicked that He had to destroy them, save 8 people.
We agree on more than you think, SoT!
You're just too stubborn to realize it.
You condone the eternal torture
Who said anything about torture?
The Bible certainly doesn't.
and suffering of anyone who chooses not to follow the ideology.
The suffering people will experience in the lake of fire is not because someone is actively torturing them.
His suffering is a result of his rejection of his Creator. (This is also why there is suffering in the world today, it is caused by a rejection of God, and to whatever extent someone has rejected God, to that extent he will cause suffering.
They have only themselves to blame, because God honored their wish to live apart from Him.
That's wicked. Despotic. Tyrannical. Pure evil.
God is none of these things.
The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.
The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.
www.biblegateway.com
That's only according to your perverse ideology.
No, that's reality.
There could easily be a third option which is to live without God and live freely and happily without being tortured.
That's LITERALLY option 2, "Live without God for eternity."
That fact that your ideology only provides 2 options is what identifies it as utter nonsense to any sane rational thinking individual.
My "ideology" is based in the rules of logic.
Specifically, the law of excluded middle, SoT.
For any proposition, either the proposition or its negation is true.
There is no third option. Either you will live with God for all eternity, or you will live apart from God for all eternity.
Even sane Christians can see that there is something horribly wrong and twisted about that entire proposition and thus realise that whilst they still believe in a god, that it is religion and carefully crafted collections of scriptures that have lead to that ridiculous ideological position and the Church enslaving millions of humans via the psychological threat of future torture and suffering.
Just because some Christians have a hard time accepting what the Bible says doesn't make them correct.
But I suppose misery loves company...
No loving god would ever subject his own creations to eternal torture
God will not be in the lake of fire for eternity, torturing people.
God will have no part in the existence of those who willingly go there.
So, a loving God would not force someone to live with Him for eternity, which would cause them greater suffering than if He left them alone for all eternity?
Great! We agree!
Anyone who believes otherwise has left the path of reason and crucified their own innate rationality and intelligence.
Because you say so?
No he absolutely will not honour the wishes of those who reject him
He won't?
But you just got done saying He should honor people's wishes to live apart from Him, did you not?
That's what the lake of fire is.
The place where God is not.
The people who will go to the lake of fire wish to live apart from God.
The entire point of the Lake of Fire is that it is the place where God is NOT!
for no such person would wish to be eternally tortured.
No one will be "eternally tortured."
You have believed the lie of "eternal torture" for those who reject God.
Whoever told you that God will torture those who ultimately reject Him was lying to you, and so far you've done nothing but perpetuate the lie.
The Bible does not teach "eternal torture."
It teaches "eternal suffering." There's a HUGE DIFFERENCE between the two.
Your ideology is ridiculous.
This, coming from someone who has believed that God will torture people for eternity when in fact He will not be where He sends them... Hmmmm.....
There's a difference between sending someone away for eternity and making them deliberately suffer and be tortured for eternity.
Indeed there is a difference.
You seem to believe that I believe that God will do the latter.
I do not.
I believe God will do the former. The Bible calls the place that God is not "the lake of fire."
If ever there was a figure of speech, that's one of them.
It's not literally a lake. It's not literal fire.
The "lake" and "fire" are descriptions of what it will be like to live there.
Well, live is a rather strong word.
Exist, would be a better way to describe it. God is life, those who reject Him reject life, so they won't be alive, but they will exist, in the lake of fire, where God is not.
And the "fire" is simply describing the pain of living apart from one's Creator. Pain is not physical. The torment will not be pain inflicted upon one's body, but rather it will be a result of the mental anguish, the result of rejecting the One who is Life.
That you can't see that difference is testimony to how deeply indoctrinated you are.
You're the one who's been indoctrinated against the Bible, SoT.
But you can't see it because of how deeply you've been indoctrinated.
The truth will set you free. Jesus is the Way, the Truth, and the Life. No one comes to the Father except through Him.
Again, there are only two choices.
Live with God, and submit to Him, or live apart from God, and rebel against Him.
There is no middle ground. You are either in rebellion against Him, or you are in submission to Him.
Just utter nonsense. The real god is nothing like that. You have swallowed an evil pill.
You don't know the real God. It's why you make all these irrational and false claims about the God of the Bible.
You cannot have it both ways, SoT.
Either you reject God, who is life, and live apart from Him, and without life, or you repent of your sin (which is rebellion against God, rejection of God) and ask God to save you.
Get thee behind me with this pathetic scaremongering nonsense.
It's only scaremongering if what the Bible says about Hell and the Lake of Fire is false.
But the Bible is true. Therefore it's not scaremongering.
It's me warning you that you're in a car hurtling towards the edge of a cliff at 100 miles per hour with no brakes and pleading with you to jump out of it, so that you don't go over the edge with it!
That's not scaremongering!
You're denying the car even exists! Let alone the fact that it's about to go over the cliff!
I'm here pleading with you out of love for you as a fellow human being to jump out of it, so that you may live!
You won't be laughing on Judgement Day, SoT.
No. Complete the opposite.
False.
The Church has twisted the truth, assembled the Bible in such a way as to create this farcical and oppressive ideology that seeks to enslave people via threats of future suffering and torment. It's frankly disgusting and a form of abuse.
The "Church" has nothing to do with this discussion, other than to say humans are fallible and make mistakes, and ideas have consequences.
However, it doesn't change what the Bible says.
The Bible says you will go to the lake of fire if you die in unbelief.
Therefore, put your faith in God, so that you can have everlasting life!
I'm not the one threatening to make people suffer eternally. Simple as.
You want God to let people into heaven in spite of their rejection. No?
You would make everyone who loves God suffer because you're selfish and want God to be nice to those who reject Him.
You would turn heaven into hell.
That's why God created the Lake of Fire, is for people like you, who would harm those He loves to satisfy their own selfish desires.
He created man to tend a garden, according to the Bible.
That wasn't the only reason God made man, SoT.
What kind of life is that?!
What's wrong with having a peaceful life in a paradise? And even better, being able to talk face to face with your Creator!
Worse still he created man as a totally ignorant robotic entity
False.
You can keep asserting this all you like, but it won't make it magically come true.
not knowing anything of import,
The "knowledge of good and evil" is the knowledge of sin, rebellion against God.
How would God create man with such knowledge?
Why would God want His creation to rebel against Him?
Your arguments don't make any sense.
not even knowing he was wandering around naked.
Being naked would not be a problem in a sinless world, especially a pre-flood world. It was a paradise, not a hell-hole.
Because you say so?
Wrong.
I have the true "god" running through me like a river.
Liar.
You should stop deceiving yourself.
It's not healthy.
No I have only rejected YOUR perverse and illogical conception of god.
You reject the God of the Bible, the only true God.
A conception that is imaginary and wickedly false.
Saying it doesn't make it so.
I live because the universal life force that animates EVERY LIVING THING is within me, the true source of all life, infinite, immortal, everywhere available.
You have life because God gave you life.
And He can just as easily (and justifiably) take it away from you.
You take for granted what is a privilege.
You are on borrowed time, sir.
You should repent before it's too late.
No it's simple truth where as your ideology is "old-age, long past its time, no longer relevent to today's society" nonsense.
You seem to be misunderstanding something.
"New-age" nonsense is as old as the garden of Eden.
"You will not die" said the Serpent.
"I am immortal" said
@SwordOfTruth.
You have believed the Serpent's lies.
Why do you attempt to quote scripture?
And Jesus' words, nonetheless?
I wonder, is it because you inherently recognize the truth that is within the Bible?
Fascinating.
These pathetic psychological attacks
It's not a psychological attack.
It's a warning given out of love.
Repent before it's too late!
have no impact on a free mind.
You have convinced yourself that you are free, yet remain shackled in your rebellion against God.
Jesus can set you free, and you will be free indeed!
And again. Get thee behind me
These will be the words you say to God before He casts you into the lake of fire, where you will spend the rest of eternity, if you do not repent.
You, along with whatever demon has taken hold of you.
In the name of Jesus Christ, I rebuke you, demon. Leave this man alone, that he may be able to see the light.
Lord Jesus, please open this man's eyes, that he may come to trust in You!
