Your Approach to Torah Study

[Jacob]

I said
That is a lie. The new covenant does not involve the Torah. It involves the new testament law of Christ.

The new covenant involves God's law. Read Jeremiah for that. Jeremiah says nothing of the law of Christ. You are speaking of a new testament or the new testament (the new testament scriptures). Unless you are saying that the new testament law of Christ does not pertain to the new testament scriptures but to the new testament.

 

[Squeaky]

The new covenant involves God's law. Read Jeremiah for that. Jeremiah says nothing of the law of Christ. You are speaking of a new testament or the new testament (the new testament scriptures). Unless you are saying that the new testament law of Christ does not pertain to the new testament scriptures but to the new testament.

I said
Your an idiot.
Jews
[Jhn 7:19
19 "Did not Moses give you the law, yet none of you keeps the law? Why do you seek to kill Me?"
[Rom 2:17-24
17 Indeed you are called a Jew, and rest on the law, and make your boast in God,
18 and know [His] will, and approve the things that are excellent, being instructed out of the law,
19 and are confident that you yourself are a guide to the blind, a light to those who are in darkness,
20 an instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, having the form of knowledge and truth in the law.
21 You, therefore, who teach another, do you not teach yourself? You who preach that a man should not steal, do you steal?
22 You who say, "Do not commit adultery," do you commit adultery? You who abhor idols, do you rob temples?
23 You who make your boast in the law, do you dishonor God through breaking the law?
24 For "the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles because of you," as it is written.
[Gal 6:13
13 For not even those who are circumcised keep the law, but they desire to have you circumcised that they may boast in your flesh.
[Gal 5:3
3 And I testify again to every man who becomes circumcised that he is a debtor to keep the whole law.
[Jas 2:10
10 For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one [point], he is guilty of all.

XXX Jews only want others to become Jews because they refuse to accept Jesus as Messiah. The more Jews the less they will be persecuted for not believing Jesus. And they can boast in converting you. But they themselves dont even keep the law of Moses--Torah.

 

[Jacob]

I said
Your an idiot.
Jews
[Jhn 7:19
19 "Did not Moses give you the law, yet none of you keeps the law? Why do you seek to kill Me?"
[Rom 2:17-24
17 Indeed you are called a Jew, and rest on the law, and make your boast in God,
18 and know [His] will, and approve the things that are excellent, being instructed out of the law,
19 and are confident that you yourself are a guide to the blind, a light to those who are in darkness,
20 an instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, having the form of knowledge and truth in the law.
21 You, therefore, who teach another, do you not teach yourself? You who preach that a man should not steal, do you steal?
22 You who say, "Do not commit adultery," do you commit adultery? You who abhor idols, do you rob temples?
23 You who make your boast in the law, do you dishonor God through breaking the law?
24 For "the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles because of you," as it is written.
[Gal 6:13
13 For not even those who are circumcised keep the law, but they desire to have you circumcised that they may boast in your flesh.
[Gal 5:3
3 And I testify again to every man who becomes circumcised that he is a debtor to keep the whole law.
[Jas 2:10
10 For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one [point], he is guilty of all.

XXX Jews only want others to become Jews because they refuse to accept Jesus as Messiah. The more Jews the less they will be persecuted for not believing Jesus. And they can boast in converting you. But they themselves dont even keep the law of Moses--Torah.

I am a Jew. Yeshua is our Messiah. If you want to accept Him as your Messiah, either you are a Gentile or you have become a Jew or you already are a Jew.

 

[drbrumley]

[MENTION=5582]Jacob[/MENTION], you study the Torah by the light of the New Testament

 

[Squeaky]

[MENTION=5582]Jacob[/MENTION], you study the Torah by the light of the New Testament

I said
He is very confused. He teaches the Torah because he was kicked out of Christianity. He thinks he is a Jew. And he doesn't even keep the law. He is condemning himself.


[Gal 6:13
13 For not even those who are circumcised keep the law, but they desire to have you circumcised that they may boast in your flesh.
[Gal 5:3
3 And I testify again to every man who becomes circumcised that he is a debtor to keep the whole law.
[Jas 2:10
10 For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one [point], he is guilty of all.

 

[Jacob]

[MENTION=5582]Jacob[/MENTION], you study the Torah by the light of the New Testament

Amen. Unless you know of an error in the New Testament. I do not know why there are two different lists of apostles between Matthew and Luke.

 

[Jacob]

I said
He is very confused. He teaches the Torah because he was kicked out of Christianity. He thinks he is a Jew. And he doesn't even keep the law. He is condemning himself.


[Gal 6:13
13 For not even those who are circumcised keep the law, but they desire to have you circumcised that they may boast in your flesh.
[Gal 5:3
3 And I testify again to every man who becomes circumcised that he is a debtor to keep the whole law.
[Jas 2:10
10 For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one [point], he is guilty of all.

Incorrect

 

[Tnkrbl123!]

Amen. Unless you know of an error in the New Testament. I do not know why there are two different lists of apostles between Matthew and Luke.

What are you talking about with 2 different lists of apostles between Matthew and Luke ... there was a change because of Judas but if you read the chapter carefully you will understand why there was a change and who it was changed to.
You keep saying you do not understand why there are "2 different lists of apostles" but you never give reference to where you think you found this. so please reference what you are talking about

 

[Jacob]

What are you talking about with 2 different lists of apostles between Matthew and Luke ... there was a change because of Judas but if you read the chapter carefully you will understand why there was a change and who it was changed to.
You keep saying you do not understand why there are "2 different lists of apostles" but you never give reference to where you think you found this. so please reference what you are talking about

The Third Month the Eleventh Day, Erev Evening Laylah Night.

Matthew 10:1-4.
Luke 6:12-16.

 

[Squeaky]

Here is what a real Jew says.

Originally Posted by Yoḥanon-benYaʿăqov
The rest of your thread is less than meaningless to me, but this particular paragraph needs to be addressed, because it is a bald faced lie.Unlike certain others, I actually am a Jew, and have been since the day I was born: 5 Sh’vat 5717 in Haifa, Eretz Israel.

I can tell you with absolute certainty that Jews DO NOT Proselytize; Jews DO NOT actively seek converts; Jews DO NOT SEEK converts at all; Jews DO NOT WANT converts; Jews DO NOT NEED converts; Jews ACTIVELY DISSUADE converts.

Jews are a family, converting to Judaism is joining our family. We don’t want or need any new members of our family. There is no need for any gentile to ever convert to Judaism, and in fact it is totally illogical.

In order to be considered a righteous gentile by the God of Israel, all one has to do is obey the Shevaʿ Mitzvot b’néy-Noaḥ (Seven Commandments of the descendants of Noah). Basically if anyone is merely a decent human being, he/she is probably obeying these Mitz’vot without even knowing he/she is doing it.

In order to LEGALLY convert to Judaism, a gentile has to jump through a whole lot of hoops just to be considered for eligibility for potential candidacy for the conversion process. A person cannot even apply for conversion unless they are sponsored by a certified Rabbi.

Different Rabbis have different requirements for sponsorship, but one absolute pre-requisite is the potential candidate must live in and be an active part
of a Jewish Community for a bare minimum of nine months. That’s just one pre-requisite for sponsorship.

Even if you do find a sponsor, that doesn’t mean that your application for conversion will ever be accepted. I know a gentleman who desperately wants to convert to Judaism, and has been actively trying for over ten years; in three different countries; has had six different sponsors; and his request has still not been accepted. But he still perseveres, and I can’t even begin to understand why. Converting to Judaism is a very difficult process, and very few ever last from start to finish.

It could very easily take more than two years just to acquire a sponsor. If by some chance your application for conversion is accepted, you then go through an average of three years of education before the legal portions even begin.

NO!!! JEWS DO NOT SEEK OR WANT CONVERTS!!!

As for the last sentence of the quote: I do not recall seeing the phrase hil’ḵot Mosheh (law of Moses) anywhere within the Hebrew Scriptures. Torah means: instruction, education, lesson, teaching – not “law.” If you are insinuating that Jews are not being obedient to our God given Commandments – Mitz’vot, please be more specific, we have quite a few of them to choose from

 

[Jacob]

Today is Shishi, the Third Month, the Eleventh Day. It is Boker, Morning. Yom, Day.

Amen Squeaky.

There is a common misconception that Jews seek converts, that they proselytize. However, we know that though this is a good thing to do it is not how a person becomes a Jew, not necessary, and even contrary to the way some of us think. (Meaning, an individual makes decisions to obey God. You do not need to be a Jew to do this. But Jews discuss God's Law among themselves. And knowing the truth is better than thinking you are converting to a religion and that once you have done so that is all that matters or all that is important. This is not the way to understand what it means to be a Jew.) Are you familiar with Kiruv?

 

[Squeaky]

Today is Shishi, the Third Month, the Eleventh Day. It is Boker, Morning. Yom, Day.

Amen Squeaky.

There is a common misconception that Jews seek converts, that they proselytize. However, we know that though this is a good thing to do it is not how a person becomes a Jew, not necessary, and even contrary to the way some of us think. (Meaning, an individual makes decisions to obey God. You do not need to be a Jew to do this. But Jews discuss God's Law among themselves. And knowing the truth is better than thinking you are converting to a religion and that once you have done so that is all that matters or all that is important. This is not the way to understand what it means to be a Jew.) Are you familiar with Kiruv?

I said
lol Your a hypocrite Christian and a hypocrite Jew.

 

[Jacob]

I said
lol Your a hypocrite Christian and a hypocrite Jew.

Rebuke only helps. Because without it a person may not know they are wrong. But you are buffering me after the fact.

 

[Squeaky]

Rebuke only helps. Because without it a person may not know they are wrong. But you are buffering me after the fact.

I said
I'm not rebuking you. I am reproving you. You made a big mistake. You assume you can understand the bible and you cant. When you look at a verse you only see the milk understanding. You do not see the meat understanding. You don't have the understanding to teach it. Look at the verses you gave me as your logic.

[Mat 5:17
17 "Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill.

You only see the words not to destroy the law. So you exaggerate that part. But the rest of it says but to fulfill. He did that. It has been fulfilled. When one fulfills a contract the contract is no longer valid. It is over done. But you don't see that. Your going to have to learn to study every word. Before you make a claim of knowing. Your going to have to purge your mind of all that deception that is in you.

 

[Tnkrbl123!]

The Third Month the Eleventh Day, Erev Evening Laylah Night.

Matthew 10:1-4.
Luke 6:12-16.

Those 2 lists are the EXACT same and the names 9f the apostles are in the EXACT same order (except in one Thomas and Matthew are flipped).
There is definately not 2 lists of apostles and those 2 scriptures give the EXACT Same apostles... I have no idea where you are reading 2 lists of apostles but you need to read more carefully because you are obviously misreading.
The names of the apostles that BOTH lists give are:
-Simon Peter
-Andrew
-James
- John
-Philip
-Bartholomew
-Thomas
-Matthew
-James
-Simon
-Judas

Just like in grade school where your class might have 2 Matthew's in it and 2 James in it...the same thing goes here... some disciples have the same name but are different people

either way those scriptures have the EXACT same list of apostles and if you are getting confused you have to read more carefully. you can even write the names down on a piece of paper to compare

 

[Jacob]

Those 2 lists are the EXACT same and the names 9f the apostles are in the EXACT same order (except in one Thomas and Matthew are flipped).
There is definately not 2 lists of apostles and those 2 scriptures give the EXACT Same apostles... I have no idea where you are reading 2 lists of apostles but you need to read more carefully because you are obviously misreading.
The names of the apostles that BOTH lists give are:
-Simon Peter
-Andrew
-James
- John
-Philip
-Bartholomew
-Thomas
-Matthew
-James
-Simon
-Judas

Just like in grade school where your class might have 2 Matthew's in it and 2 James in it...the same thing goes here... some disciples have the same name but are different people

either way those scriptures have the EXACT same list of apostles and if you are getting confused you have to read more carefully. you can even write the names down on a piece of paper to compare

Here are the twelve from Matthew

Simon
Andrew
James
John
Philip
Bartholomew
Thomas
Matthew
James
Lebbaeus
Simon
Judas Iscariot

Here is the list from Luke

Simon
Andrew
James
John
Philip
Bartholomew
Matthew
Thomas
James
Simon
Judas
Judas Iscariot

Shalom.

Today is Rishon, the Third Month the Thirteenth Day. It is Yom, Day.

Echad means One.

Shema Yisrael Yahveh Eloheinu Yahveh Echad
Hear Israel Yahveh Our God Yahveh is One