ECT Without benevolence, we cannot inherit eternal life.

[genuineoriginal]

And that is true for the gospel period, but at the time of that record, Jesus Christ had not yet suffered and died for us.

Once he did, the rules for receiving eternal life changed, receiving eternal life is a gift, Romans 6:23, it is no longer wages earned for faithful service to God.

Salvation, ie, eternal life is now a gift a result of God's grace, Ephesians 2:8-9

The rules for receiving eternal life have never changed.
Eternal life is never given as wages for works.
Eternal life has always been a gift that God chooses to give as a reward to those who pleased Him through faithful service to Him.

 

[Truster]

We can only inherit eternal life through God's benevolence (grace).
The only way man's benevolence means anything is when it pleases God enough for Him to want to grant eternal life to that person.

There is nothing in man that influences the bestowal of eternal life.

 

[genuineoriginal]

There is nothing in man that influences the bestowal of eternal life.

Maybe you should put some ointment on your eyes, so you can see well enough to read what is written in the Bible.

For example, Paul talks about what God told Moses in the Bible.

Romans 9:15 15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.​

One of the things God told Moses is the criteria that He uses when He is choosing who He will have mercy upon:

Exodus 20:5-6 5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; 6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.​

 

[Truster]

Maybe you should put some ointment on your eyes, so you can see well enough to read what is written in the Bible.

For example, Paul talks about what God told Moses in the Bible.

Romans 9:15 15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.​

One of the things God told Moses is the criteria that He uses when He is choosing who He will have mercy upon:

Exodus 20:5-6 5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; 6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.​

The only mercy being shown then was to those Yah Veh had called His own.

Prior to the revelation of His glory to Moses all Moses had was tell them I AM sent you. Moses needed a further revelation and this was it. Being called His people they were under the law.

Your ignorance is showing.

 

[genuineoriginal]

The only mercy being shown then was to those Yah Veh had called His own.

Prior to the revelation of His glory to Moses all Moses had was tell them I AM sent you. Moses needed a further revelation and this was it. Being called His people they were under the law.

Your ignorance is showing.

You seem to be making up a lot of nonsense by claiming things that are not found in the Bible.
I am very familiar with what is actually written in the Bible, but I confess I am ignorant of the nonsense you have been making up.

 

[Truster]

You seem to be making up a lot of nonsense by claiming things that are not found in the Bible.
I am very familiar with what is actually written in the Bible, but I confess I am ignorant of the nonsense you have been making up.

You have a theoretical knowledge of scripture, but the doctrine contained within is beyond your comprehension and so you call it nonsense.

 

[genuineoriginal]

You have a theoretical knowledge of scripture, but the doctrine contained within is beyond your comprehension and so you call it nonsense.

2 Timothy 3:16 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:​

When Paul mentions, "All scripture," he is referring to the entirety of the Old Testament.
You need to go back to the source to get good doctrine instead of making up doctrine as you have been doing.

 

[Truster]

2 Timothy 3:16 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:​

When Paul mentions, "All scripture," he is referring to the entirety of the Old Testament.
You need to go back to the source to get good doctrine instead of making up doctrine as you have been doing.

You don't even know what or why Moses was asking when He said, "Show me Thy glory". I said the same thing nearly 17 years ago and I have had my answer.

PS I know exactly what Paul was saying...

 

[7Spirits]

You missed Paul's point.

Paul is saying that you cannot force God into granting you forgiveness through your works.
God will never be in debt to any man for any reason.

God only gives His grace to those people that please Him.
He alone decides what pleases Him enough for Him to want to grant His grace.

God is not pleased by those people that think they can get His grace by doing nothing.

We can only inherit eternal life through God's benevolence (grace).
The only way man's benevolence means anything is when it pleases God enough for Him to want to grant eternal life to that person.

The rules for receiving eternal life have never changed.
Eternal life is never given as wages for works.
Eternal life has always been a gift that God chooses to give as a reward to those who pleased Him through faithful service to Him.

I'm kind of a 700 lb. T-Rex. I had my eye on you. You shouldn't have said this. You are a theological liar with a self contradictory tongue.

[MENTION=3698]Tambora[/MENTION]
[MENTION=16629]patrick jane[/MENTION]
[MENTION=15685]musterion[/MENTION]

Keep your gaze out for this one, they sound almost correct until Salvation is discussed.

G.O., You goofed up here and now your lies and rebuttal are actually in your self contradictory diatribe within the three quotes of yours, within this post.

 

[Tambora]

I'm kind of a 700 lb. T-Rex. I had my eye on you. You shouldn't have said this. You are a theological liar with a self contradictory tongue.

@Tambora
@patrick jane
@musterion

Keep your gaze out for this one, they sound almost correct until Salvation is discussed.

G.O., You goofed up here and now your lies and rebuttal are actually in your self contradictory diatribe within the three quotes of yours, within this post.

I'm a watchin'!

Those that have the notion that man's behavior plays a part of them becoming a member of the BOC, they need to be hit smack between the eyes with ....

Romans 5 KJV
(18) Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
(19) For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.


OUR righteousness and obedience is not included.

 

[musterion]

If my forgiveness and justification depend on me at any point, even as a believer, I am doomed simply because I, in myself, have no righteousness whatsoever. Nothing.

Anyone who says his forgiveness and justification depend on what he can do or not do is saying he has some righteousness of his own that, alongside Christ's...even if only 1% to his 99%...counts for something before God. In short, he's saying the Son's righteousness isn't enough to save him.

 

[Potter's Clay]

It is through God's grace that he has given us mercy instead of Justice.


Sent from my iPhone using TOL

 

[genuineoriginal]

I'm kind of a 700 lb. T-Rex. I had my eye on you. You shouldn't have said this. You are a theological liar with a self contradictory tongue.

[MENTION=3698]Tambora[/MENTION]
[MENTION=16629]patrick jane[/MENTION]
[MENTION=15685]musterion[/MENTION]

Keep your gaze out for this one, they sound almost correct until Salvation is discussed.

G.O., You goofed up here and now your lies and rebuttal are actually in your self contradictory diatribe within the three quotes of yours, within this post.

Tambora, patrick jane, and musterion have known me for years.
You are a new comer to this forum.

There is nothing contradictory about what I stated, and every one of my statements are backed up by the Bible.

You have been taught that God gives eternal life to those that displease Him, but that is not the testimony of the Bible.
You ignore the warnings of Paul:

1 Corinthians 10:1-12 1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea; 2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea; 3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat; 4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ. 5 But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness. 6 Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted. 7 Neither be ye idolaters, as were some of them; as it is written, The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play. 8 Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them committed, and fell in one day three and twenty thousand. 9 Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents. 10 Neither murmur ye, as some of them also murmured, and were destroyed of the destroyer. 11 Now all these things happened unto them for examples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come. 12 Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.​

 

[genuineoriginal]

Those that have the notion that man's behavior plays a part of them becoming a member of the BOC, they need to be hit smack between the eyes

It is the overwhelming testimony of the Bible that shows that man's righteousness and obedience are pleasing to God and that God will not give eternal life to those that are unrighteous and disobedient.

Romans 1:18 18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;​

1 Corinthians 6:9-10 9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.​

 

[genuineoriginal]

If my forgiveness and justification depend on me at any point, even as a believer, I am doomed simply because I, in myself, have no righteousness whatsoever. Nothing.

If believing in Jesus had not resulted in you repenting from your wickedness and starting to live a life of righteousness, then you are doomed.

Ezekiel 18:21-24 21 But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die. 22 All his transgressions that he hath committed, they shall not be mentioned unto him: in his righteousness that he hath done he shall live. 23 Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord God: and not that he should return from his ways, and live? 24 But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die.​

These are the words of the Lord unto Ezekiel.

Do you think God is lying or is mistaken?
Or do you thing God speaks the truth?

Anyone who says his forgiveness and justification depend on what he can do or not do is saying he has some righteousness of his own that, alongside Christ's...even if only 1% to his 99%...counts for something before God. In short, he's saying the Son's righteousness isn't enough to save him.

Do you think Jesus lied when He said you have to do at least two things to gain eternal life?

John 5:24 24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.​

Do you think Paul lied when He said you have to do at least two things to gain eternal life?

Romans 10:9 9That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.​

You keep claiming that you can be saved without believing in Jesus, without believing in God, and without doing what they tell you to do.

 

[genuineoriginal]

It is through God's grace that he has given us mercy instead of Justice.

Yes, and grace is always conditional on the ruler that grants grace being pleased with the person He is granting grace to.

There is no such thing as "unconditional grace", no matter how much that phrase has polluted Christianity.

 

[Potter's Clay]

Yes, and grace is always conditional on the ruler that grants grace being pleased with the person He is granting grace to.

There is no such thing as "unconditional grace", no matter how much that phrase has polluted Christianity.

Please provide Biblical support for the idea that an unregenerate man was able to overcome the dead sinful state that he/she was born into in order to choose life.


Sent from my iPhone using TOL

 

[genuineoriginal]

Please provide Biblical support for the idea that an unregenerate man was able to overcome the dead sinful state that he/she was born into in order to choose life.

What dead sinful state are you talking about?
Have you been drinking the Calvinist koolaid instead of drinking from the fountain of living water?


The Bible makes it very clear that God expects man to choose between life and death using the FREE WILL that God Himself breathed into man when man was created.

Deuteronomy 30:19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:​

​

 

[Potter's Clay]

What dead sinful state are you talking about?
Have you been drinking the Calvinist koolaid instead of drinking from the fountain of living water?


The Bible makes it very clear that God expects man to choose between life and death using the FREE WILL that God Himself breathed into man when man was created.

Deuteronomy 30:19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:​

​

The dead state that is described in Ephesians 2:1.


Sent from my iPhone using TOL

 

[musterion]

If believing in Jesus had not resulted in you repenting from your wickedness and starting to live a life of righteousness, then you are doomed.

How are you defining the word repent? What would someone repenting look like? What would it involve?

You keep claiming that you can be saved without believing in Jesus, without believing in God, and without doing what they tell you to do.

I do? Where?