dodge
New member
Can you take your MAD glasses off for that long ?
ECT Who actually revealed the "mystery" of the Gospel of grace ? Was Paul the first ?
- Thread starter dodge
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Can you take your MAD glasses off for that long ?
musterion
Well-known member
musterion
Well-known member
Ask anyway, whether or not I can. You'll get a straight answer no matter what.
Can you take off your Baptist glasses?
dodge
New member
dan, but I feel pretty sure he will get a pass from other MADist.
musterion
Well-known member
dodge
New member
The Baptist did not form my beliefs the Bible did. I have questioned every pastor I have ever had when their sermon or teachings deviated from context or common sense.
Nonsense, bro, that is YOUR reading YOUR conclusions into things.
Learn how to do a thorough and proper word study.
musterion
Well-known member
Amen!
dodge
New member
Before Paul was saved when he was still going to and fro having Christians jailed and killed more than 8000 known folks were added to the B.O.C., and Paul himself said there were others in Christ before he was. So the question is why and how can you believe Paul was the first to preach the mystery that Jesus and the Holy Spirit revealed to ALL of the Apostles ?
Act 2:41
Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
Again in Acts 4 many are added to the B.O.C..
Act 4:4
Howbeit many of them which heard the word believed; and the number of the men was about five thousand.
P.S. no not I.F.B. they are way to judgmental for me.
musterion
Well-known member
Two ways (at least) to view it.
1. The saved Jew/saved non-proselyte Gentile BoC existed from who knows how far back...some say as far back as Adam...but no one realized it until the FACT of the one Body was revealed to and through Paul, as he is the first one to say it.
or
2. The BoC did not exist until Paul - a blasphemer of the Holy Spirit and unable to be saved per Mt 12:31 - was indeed saved as the first saved under the dispensation of GRACE, making him the 1st member of the Jew/Gentile BoC. In fact, he couldn't be saved any other way.
Clearly, both can't be true, right?
The answer to figuring out which does not lie in trying to determine when the body of Christ came into existence.
The FIRST question to be settled is, what (or WHO) exactly IS the BoC, and how can we know that? Answering the WHAT/WHO question will help nail down the WHEN, instead of assuming the WHEN, which you're doing.
WHAT/WHO...
...then WHEN.
PS
IFB?
Lon
Well-known member
Briefly 1) that Moses is still veiled to them as well and that even back then, it is fulfilled in the Lord Jesus Christ. 2 Corinthians 3:14
2) Jesus was with the disciples and told them Mark 8:31 Matthew 17:22,23 John 2:19 that He was going to die and come to life.
Nobody He told, believed Him nor understood the good news of it.
3) The OT, as you say, did preach the suffering Messiah and salvation through Him Isaiah 53 etc.
Not sure if I'm answering your question. -Lon
dodge
New member
I believe I see our difference ! Jesus , the living ,walking ,talking, and living Gospel came to share with men HIMSELF, which was the revelation of the mystery.
No not I.F.B. they are way to judgmental for me.
True story I think you will appreciate:
Went to an IFb church in south Louisiana 1 time and the pastor preached on the evil of alcohol ( one hour and 45 minutes) including mouth wash because mouthwash contains alcohol. I waited until every one had left after the service ( out of respect for his position ). I asked the pastor if he thought Jesus was a sinner. He replied of course not. I then told him where Jesus said," John the Baptist came neither eating or drinking and you say he is possessed with a devil the Son of man came eating and drinking and you say I am a gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her children".
After our talk the pastor thanked me and said he had never considered Jesus' teachings on the subject in the light of the following verses and would have to reevaluate what he believed and taught.
Mat 11:18
For John came neither eating nor drinking, and they say, He hath a devil.
11:19
The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her
[h=2]Who actually revealed the "mystery" of the Gospel of grace ?[/h]
Jesus Christ
Jesus Christ
musterion
Well-known member
No, sorry. The reason why not:
Read
Rom 1:3, 2 Cor 5:16
in contrast with
Rom 16:25, Eph 3:8-9
Note 'according to'
dodge
New member
Musterion. ALL of the Apostles including Paul were proclaiming the revelation that Jesus Himself revealed , and sending the Holy Spirit. Proved by Jesus'rule over nature,disease,death,and revelation of the gospel that HE was sacrificed for mankind proved with the D.B.R-resurrection, and ascension.
You might want to read the gospel of John again.
Luke 18:33-34 KJV -
musterion
Well-known member
Got to turn in. Leave you with this.
According to prophecy [revealed and foretold in Scripture] =/= according to musterion [previously undisclosed secret].
Period.
Yep.
This...spoken since the world began...
Acts 3:21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.
In contrast to this kept since the world began...
Romans 16:25 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,
dodge
New member
I did not say they understood what Jesus revealed about Himself , but make no mistake Jesus was the revelation,fulfillment, and completion of His own gospel.