We're Not Ready To Say Goodbye To War Just Yet.

JAG

Active member
We're Not Ready To Say Goodbye To War Just Yet
By JAG
October 14, 2021


"Only the dead have seen an end to war."__Plato (and others) And some 6000 years
of human history says it's true.


Then way out there on War's extreme edge, we have: "You talk of food. I have no
taste for food. What I really crave is slaughter and blood and the choking groans
of men."__Achilles, The Iliad, 19:250-260 That attitude offers no hope to humanity,
but the Lord Jesus does. He says: "blessed are the peacemakers for they will be
called children of God." And the great Apostle Paul takes up this theme and says,
"If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone." (Romans
12:18) But sometimes it doesn't depend on you, and sometimes it's not possible.


Badd Mann had just murdered two bank tellers and he was now pointing his pistol
at three police officers who had already yelled out "Drop your gun" two times. Badd
Mann screamed back, "I will not drop my gun." How do you live in peace with the
Badd Mann's of this world?


Pacifism (violence is immoral under all circumstances) reduces to "Don't use violence
to stop Badd Mann, rather allow Badd Mann to murder as many innocent humans as
necessary to satiate his blood lust for cold blooded murder. Why so? "Because we've

got to protect our No Violence Under Any Circumstances Principle, no matter how many
innocent humans are murdered by the Badd Mann's of this world."__John Weak Pacifist


Pacifists can't get elected to office ~ voters tends to dislike being murdered and they
generally view pacifists as societal curiosities unworthy of holding leadership positions.
Who will protect their loved ones from Badd Mann? They know pacifists will not.


By the way, do you think Jesus was a pacifist?


"Jesus said, My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent
my arrest by the Jewish leaders." John 18:36


Add this: The Lord Jesus never disagreed with His Father. So when His Father commanded
Joshua to take the whole army and go up and attack Ai (Joshua 8:1), the Lord Jesus was
in full agreement with that command, right?


The pacifists do not take Romans 13:1-7 seriously. It says God has established governments
and given them the power of the sword to enforce good laws with morally justified violence. The
police shot and killed Badd Mann inside the bank, and Romans 13:1-7 teaches they did what
was good and right when they killed him. Out there in the world there are a lot of evil men afoot
that must be stopped by police and soldiers carrying loaded guns.


Over 291,000 Americans soldiers (many of them Christians) suffered and died in World War 2,
to protect, with the edge of the bloody sword, good people from being killed or enslaved by
Nazism. The Good Fighters won World War 2 through death and suffering. We too can do the
same thing, in principle, when called upon, to defend the Good People in the world from being
murdered or enslaved by evil tyrants (like Hitler). The Lord Jesus laid down His life for us at
Calvary. He went straight into the pain to save us from Death and His great self-sacrifice there
on The Cross paid for our sins and gave us Eternal Life. We shall never die (John 11:25-26).
We humans greatly admire this kind of fighting selfless heroics. We call it True Love and we
write big and bold on our Christian battle flags: "THE LORD IS A WARRIOR" EXODUS 15:3

I just love Christianity. Suffering makes us stronger (Rom. 5:3-4). Death
takes us home to be with the Lord ~ absent from the body is to be at
home with the Lord (no soul sleep) 2 Cor.5:6,8 Philippians 1:21-24


And we fight wars knowing:
~ God determines the results of battles
~ God determines the day of our death and how we die
~ We want to live, but when our time comes, we know "to die is gain" Philippians 1:21
I want God:
~ to be pleased with me
~ to be impressed with me
~ to be proud of me
Faith pleases God ("Have faith in God"__The Lord Jesus)
Courage pleases God (God to Joshua: "Be strong and very courageous")


We Christians fight just wars to defend The Good and we go to it with a glad
heart determined to win. We strongly desire peace, but if evil men demand
war so they can institutionalize tyranny, we'll be there. We'll show up with
swords.


And doing that glorifies God.


"Greater love has no one than this: to lay down his life for one's friends"__The
Lord Jesus (John 15:13)


"Then outspake brave Horatius
the Captain Of The Gate
Every man upon this Earth
must die soon or late
And what better way to die
than fighting fearful odds
For the ashes of our fathers
and the glories of our God"
__Macaulay
(edited and slightly Christianized by JAG


The principle of justified violent force to stop evil men is a strong clear Biblical
principle: Exodus 15:1 "The Lord is a Warrior."


Exodus 15:1 is as real as it gets.


Just ask Pharaoh and his army if they think "The Lord is a Warrior"?
"The water flowed back and covered the chariots and horsemen ~ the entire army

of Pharaoh that followed the Israelites into the sea. Not one of them survived."
Exodus 14:28


Then ask those 185,000 dead Assyrian soldiers if they think "The Lord is a Warrior"?
"When the people got up the next morning ~ there were all the dead bodies." Isa. 37:36



Then ask all those who have experienced, in Gehenna, the perish of John 3:16, if they
think "The Lord is a Warrior"?
"Do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. But rather fear Him who is
able to destroy both soul and body in Hell." __The Lord Jesus (Matt. 10:28)

The world has some serious problems with a lot of violence here in the 21st century.
The Wikipedia article titled "Homicide", reports that in one recent year the total number
of global murders was 468,000.


Nations today, 21st century, are heavily armed. The United States recently built the world's
deadliest and most advanced war machine ~ the enormous 25 deck aircraft carrier the USS
Gerald Ford ($13 billion). Guns galore. Good. We need "The Gerald." Nobody knows who or
what may rise to power in say communist China or Russia in the years ahead or what they
will decide to do with their war machines to "make the world better." (think Hitler).


The USS Gerald Ford was designed to kill a lot of humans and to kill them quickly ~ and "Peace
Through Strength" does not change that fact. The total firepower of the world's military machines,
if unleashed and unrestrained for 48 hours, could kill billions of people and turn huge swaths of
the earth into vast wastelands.


Here is the good news: God has a Plan to gradually and incrementally change the world so that
war machines like "The Gerald" will no longer be needed. Life is very much more enjoyable when
people are not killing people.


So how does God plan to get this accomplished? He is going to change hearts and minds through
Holy Spirit blessed simple gospel preaching, starting with John 3:3's you must be born again,
followed by John 3:16's you must believe in Jesus as your Savior, followed by Gal.5:22-23's you
must allow the Holy Spirit to produce His fruits in your life: love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness,
goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control. If we had a world like this, then we wouldn't
need "The Gerald." And God is going to make it happen. God Almighty is going to Christianize the
world and He is going to get it done BEFORE the Lord Jesus returns. The Lord Jesus Himself put it
this way: "ALL authority in heaven and on Earth has been given to Me. THEREFORE go and make
disciples of all nations . . . teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I
am with you always, to the very end of the age." Matthew 28:18-20


There will come a time when war will be no more. "There will be no more death, or morning or crying
or pain, for the old order of things has passed away." Rev. 21:4


"I am making everything new."__The Lord Jesus Rev. 21:5


The Power Of The Cross, and the Power Of The Resurrection, and The Power Of The Exaltation (being
NOW seated at the right hand of the Father) has NOW already defeated Satan, Sin, and Death and the
Lord Jesus is NOW King Of Kings and Lord Of Lords and is NOW reigning as The King and He will
gradually and incrementally put all His enemies under His feet (1 Cor. 15:25). And He will do this through
the supernatural power of the Holy Spirit who empowers His Christian Church to successfully carry out
His Great Commission command to go and make disciples of all nations (Matthew 28:16-20.)


So? So war will one day go the way of VHS tapes and flip phones. And while we wait for that day to arrive,
we pray for peace, preach John 3:16, and prepare for war ~ armed to the teeth.


[]


Agree?
Disagree?
Thoughts?
 

marke

Well-known member
Badd Mann had just murdered two bank tellers and he was now pointing his pistol
at three police officers who had already yelled out "Drop your gun" two times. Badd
Mann screamed back, "I will not drop my gun." How do you live in peace with the
Badd Mann's of this world?
Justin Garner, a young 25-year-old police officer in the small town of Carthage, got the call about an active shooter at 10:00 am, Sunday, 3-29-2009. He was the only officer on duty at the time. He raced to the scene and entered the rest home where he confronted the shooter at 10:05 am. He ordered the gunman to drop his weapon but the gunman instead shot the officer as the officer returned fire, disabling the gunman. Garner was later criticized on national TV for not waiting for backup, but he did the right and brave thing by confronting the shooter immediately in the middle of the shooter's active murders.

Justin Garner grew up in Moore County, the son of independent Baptist parents who taught him to fear God and not men. Thank God.
 

JAG

Active member
Justin Garner, a young 25-year-old police officer in the small town of Carthage, got the call about an active shooter at 10:00 am, Sunday, 3-29-2009. He was the only officer on duty at the time. He raced to the scene and entered the rest home where he confronted the shooter at 10:05 am. He ordered the gunman to drop his weapon but the gunman instead shot the officer as the officer returned fire, disabling the gunman. Garner was later criticized on national TV for not waiting for backup, but he did the right and brave thing by confronting the shooter immediately in the middle of the shooter's active murders.

Justin Garner grew up in Moore County, the son of independent Baptist parents who taught him to fear God and not men. Thank God.

Sad to hear that.
All that is the offshoot of Liberalism and such as Joe.
America can fix it.
But its gonna be painful.
Regarding POTUS Joe:
My personal political strategy is to wait patiently until liberal policy-excesses
lays upon the American electorate sufficient severity motivating them collectively
to move back to the conservative right to correct the liberal policy excesses.

Yes there is a human cost to this approach. However, there is no legal alternative.
America is a democratic republic and the American electorate eventually get what
they really and truly want.

So?

So if they want Joe and Joe's political policies, they must be willing to pay the price
in terms of human suffering. America is a huge "army" and she can survive high
numbers of "dead and wounded."

So my position is to:
Remain calm.
Stay steady.
And give Joe & Associates enough rope to hang themselves come next election.

Again there is no legal alternative to the above strategy:

Why not?

Because the Conservatives (GOP) at the present time, are not in power
and they have no national leader, right now, that is certain to win in 2024
And because the key for Conservatives to get political power and hold
political power is for them to get huge blocks of Democrat voters to
switch parties and VOTE GOP and only Joe and his party can convince
the Democrats to switch and vote GOP in 2024 and in future mid-terms.

So?

So Joe is a very good ally of the GOP as long as Joe stays on his present course.

Best Regards.

JAG
 

Bradley D

Well-known member
There will always be war upon war till the end of these times.

"And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet" (Matthew 24:6).
 

JAG

Active member
The greatest commandments are to love God and all our neighbours. We are asked to love and pray for our enemies. We can do nothing greater.
Lets see how you would actually apply that up there to this situation:

Badd Mann had just murdered two bank tellers and he was now pointing his pistol
at three police officers who had already yelled out "Drop your gun" two times. Badd
Mann screamed back, "I will not drop my gun."

At this point should the three police officers shot and killed Badd Mann,
or should they have just stood there and waited for Badd Mann to also
murder them or perhaps other bank tellers or innocent bystanders?

Give me a straight up answer to that question.
(Or will you dodge the question because you know very well that there is the principle
of The Justified Use Of Physical Force established within the question?)

JAG


``
 

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
Lets see how you would actually apply that up there to this situation:

Badd Mann had just murdered two bank tellers and he was now pointing his pistol
at three police officers who had already yelled out "Drop your gun" two times. Badd
Mann screamed back, "I will not drop my gun."

At this point should the three police officers shot and killed Badd Mann,
or should they have just stood there and waited for Badd Mann to also
murder them or perhaps other bank tellers or innocent bystanders?

Give me a straight up answer to that question.
(Or will you dodge the question because you know very well that there is the principle
of The Justified Use Of Physical Force established within the question?)

JAG


``
Good luck
 

Eric h

Well-known member
Badd Mann had just murdered two bank tellers and he was now pointing his pistol
at three police officers who had already yelled out "Drop your gun" two times. Badd
Mann screamed back, "I will not drop my gun."
In the situation you describe, the police officers could be justified to shoot, if there were no alternatives.
prepare for war ~ armed to the teeth.

The most powerful nation on Earth lives in fear, and they went to war against Iraq, before Iraq made war against America.

If you truthfully want to save lives, there are millions of children living in abject poverty. Thousands die every day from starvation and preventable disease. You would not have to shoot anybody to save these children.
 

ok doser

lifeguard at the cement pond
The greatest commandments become invisible. It seems far better to try and justify war, rather than to feed children who are starving to death daily.
What are YOU doing to feed the 4500 children who die from starvation in India, everyday.
Every single day.
4500 children starve to death.

What are YOU doing?
 
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JAG

Active member
In the situation you describe, the police officers could be justified to shoot, if there were no alternatives.


The most powerful nation on Earth lives in fear, and they went to war against Iraq, before Iraq made war against America.

If you truthfully want to save lives, there are millions of children living in abject poverty. Thousands die every day from starvation and preventable disease. You would not have to shoot anybody to save these children.
I support monthly with $ money several Christian Charities
for example Samaritan's Purse

The Sovereign God controls the world and the Iraq War served
His good purposes. All Christians do not agree on these issues.
The Sovereign God wanted Saddam removed from power and
executed along with his two evil sons ~ and that very thing took
place.

Best

JAG
 

JAG

Active member
Donate money to Christian charities, not guns.
There is a significant number of Biblical truth-principles to support this:
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And I like this one too:

20170215-6zlYJwOb0fKK9WPTEAmI




JAG
 

JAG

Active member
The greatest commandments become invisible. It seems far better to try and justify war, rather than to feed children who are starving to death daily.
Christendom does BOTH.
American Christendom BOTH feeds starving children AND justifies just wars like WW2
and we shall continue to do so.

Only the dead have seen an end to war.
Pacifists have no significant voice in the global conversation.

Great book here:

JAG
 

Eric h

Well-known member
Pacifists have no significant voice in the global conversation.
That has been proved correct throughout history, and Herman Goering spells it out clearly.

Why of course the people don’t want to go to war. Why would some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best he can hope for is to come back to his farm in one piece. Naturally the common people don’t want war, neither in Russia nor in England nor in America, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But after all it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether in a democracy, fascist dictatorship or a parliament or a communist dictatorship.

Voice or no voice the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for a lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.
Herman Goering
 

Gary K

New member
Banned
That has been proved correct throughout history, and Herman Goering spells it out clearly.
I guess all those pacifists in heaven must have been pretty angry after reading Goering.

Revelation 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

Revelation 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
 

Eric h

Well-known member
The Sovereign God wanted Saddam removed from power and
executed along with his two evil sons ~ and that very thing took
place.
It is estimated over 400.000 Iraqi died and around two million became refugees. This was not God's plan.
 

Gary K

New member
Banned
It is estimated over 400.000 Iraqi died and around two million became refugees. This was not God's plan.
Hmmmmm.... Was the destruction of Jerusalem by the Babylonians and the Romans OKed by God? Millions of people died and millions more were made refugees and prisoners of war in those two wars alone.
 

JAG

Active member
It is estimated over 400.000 Iraqi died and around two million became refugees. This was not God's plan.
You live in your world and I will live in my world.

"God from all eternity did, by the most wise and holy counsel of his own will,
freely and unchangeably ordain whatsoever comes to pass; yet so as thereby
neither is God the author of sin, nor is violence offered to the will of the
creatures, nor is the liberty or contingency of second causes taken away,
but rather established."__The Westminster Confession

JAG


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