We need help to learn and understand Torah

Jacob

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Do you observe God's commands? Do you understand God's word?

What do you have questions about?

Can you give insight into Torah? Can you explain the scriptures and God's word the Bible?

Worship and serve God and Him alone! There is no other God but Him! He is the Creator of heaven and earth! The only God! The only true God! Who is like unto Him?! There is none like Him.
 
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6days

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That is all true Jacob.

Isaiah 9:6 For to us a child is born, to us a son is given; and the government shall be on his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
 

TweetyBird

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Do you observe God's commands? Do you understand God's word?

What do you have questions about?

Can you give insight into Torah? Can you explain the scriptures and God's word the Bible?

Luke 16:16
The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.
 

Jacob

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That is all true Jacob.

Isaiah 9:6 For to us a child is born, to us a son is given; and the government shall be on his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
Thanks.
 

TweetyBird

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Amen. Can you explain this?

Jesus did not teach Torah. He taught the Kingdom of God/Heaven - forgiveness of sins, love for others, belief in Him, forgiveness, compassion, mercy, the Gospel of Christ. That is not Torah. Torah commanded retaliation, hatred of all nations outside of Israel, curses for disobedience. Jesus taught the opposite of that.
 

Jacob

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Jesus did not teach Torah. He taught the Kingdom of God/Heaven - forgiveness of sins, love for others, belief in Him, forgiveness, compassion, mercy, the Gospel of Christ. That is not Torah. Torah commanded retaliation, hatred of all nations outside of Israel, curses for disobedience. Jesus taught the opposite of that.
You are wrong.

See Matthew 5:17-20 NASB. Jesus is a Jew, of Israel. You don't even know what the Torah teaches. You also should spend time with what Jesus has taught us. Continue to learn from Him.

Mark 1:14-15 NASB - 14 Now after John had been taken into custody, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of God, 15 and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel."

See also what Paul taught. Romans 3:23 NASB. Romans 6:23 NASB.
 

TweetyBird

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You are wrong.

See Matthew 5:17-20 NASB. Jesus is a Jew, of Israel. You don't even know what the Torah teaches. You also should spend time with what Jesus has taught us. Continue to learn from Him.

Mark 1:14-15 NASB - 14 Now after John had been taken into custody, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of God, 15 and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel."

See also what Paul taught. Romans 3:23 NASB. Romans 6:23 NASB.

Mark 1:14-15 says nothing about Jesus teaching Torah. He preached the Gospel of the Kingdom of God/Heaven. The Mosaic Law/Torah was not the Gospel.

Are you going to request for this thread to be closed as well?
 

Jacob

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Mark 1:14-15 says nothing about Jesus teaching Torah. He preached the Gospel of the Kingdom of God/Heaven. The Mosaic Law/Torah was not the Gospel.

Are you going to request for this thread to be closed as well?

What do you mean am I going to request for this thread to be closed as well? I have not made a request for a thread to be closed.

You need to read Matthew 5:17-20 NASB to read about Jesus teaching Torah.

Reevaluate what you are saying.

Matthew 5:17-20 NASB - 17 "Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill. 18 "For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest letter or stroke shall pass from the Law until all is accomplished. 19 "Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches others to do the same, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 "For I say to you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven.
 

TweetyBird

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What do you mean am I going to request for this thread to be closed as well? I have not made a request for a thread to be closed.


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You need to read Matthew 5:17-20 NASB to read about Jesus teaching Torah.

Reevaluate what you are saying.

Matthew 5:17-20 NASB - 17 "Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill. 18 "For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest letter or stroke shall pass from the Law until all is accomplished. 19 "Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches others to do the same, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 "For I say to you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven.

Jesus said there that He would fulfill all the Law and Prophets. Which He did. That text is old news. The good news is that Jesus took care of it and then told us Heaven and earth were going to pass away - because He fulfilled the Law and Prophets, every jot and tittle of them.


Please note that Matt 5:17-20 is taken out of context. Read all of Matt 5, 6, and 7 to see what Jesus was teaching - and it was not Torah. Compare to what Luke stated:

Luke 16:17
And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.


2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

Revelation 21:1
And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
 

Jacob

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Thread: Learning More About God by reading the Torah



Jesus said there that He would fulfill all the Law and Prophets. Which He did. That text is old news. The good news is that Jesus took care of it and then told us Heaven and earth were going to pass away - because He fulfilled the Law and Prophets, every jot and tittle of them.


Please note that Matt 5:17-20 is taken out of context. Read all of Matt 5, 6, and 7 to see what Jesus was teaching - and it was not Torah. Compare to what Luke stated:

Luke 16:17
And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.


2 Peter 3:10
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

Revelation 21:1
And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
In Luke 16:17 why is the law mentioned?

Matthew 5:17-20 does support the idea that God's word or Law, even His instruction, is never old.

I don't know that there is yet a new heaven and a new earth.
 

TweetyBird

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You are wrong.

See Matthew 5:17-20 NASB. Jesus is a Jew, of Israel. You don't even know what the Torah teaches. You also should spend time with what Jesus has taught us. Continue to learn from Him.

Mark 1:14-15 NASB - 14 Now after John had been taken into custody, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of God, 15 and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel."

See also what Paul taught. Romans 3:23 NASB. Romans 6:23 NASB.

Jesus was not teaching Torah in Matt 5. He said He came to fulfill the Law of Moses - every jot and tittle. Matt 5, 6 7 was not Torah, it was new doctrine, new commandments and the people were amazed at His teaching.

The Gospel is not Torah. The Gospel is the Kingdom of God preached to all nations - that Jesus was crucified for our sin, suffered and died for us, shed His own blood for us - that is the New Covenant. Then He arose again and called all nations unto Himself. All those who believe on Him are saved.
 

Jacob

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Jesus was not teaching Torah in Matt 5. He said He came to fulfill the Law of Moses - every jot and tittle. Matt 5, 6 7 was not Torah, it was new doctrine, new commandments and the people were amazed at His teaching.

The Gospel is not Torah. The Gospel is the Kingdom of God preached to all nations - that Jesus was crucified for our sin, suffered and died for us, shed His own blood for us - that is the New Covenant. Then He arose again and called all nations unto Himself. All those who believe on Him are saved.
I desire for you to know and understand the truth.

You can improve from here.
 

Jacob

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Jesus is the Way, the Truth, and the Life. Not Torah. One can only improve in Christ, Torah can do nothing for those in Him.
Please read Matthew 5:19 NASB.

Matthew 5:19 NASB - 19 "Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches others to do the same, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Philippians 3:16 NASB - 16 however, let us keep living by that same standard to which we have attained.
 

Jacob

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Philippians 3:7-21 NASB - 7 But whatever things were gain to me, those things I have counted as loss for the sake of Christ. 8 More than that, I count all things to be loss in view of the surpassing value of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them but rubbish so that I may gain Christ, 9 and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith, 10 that I may know Him and the power of His resurrection and the fellowship of His sufferings, being conformed to His death; 11 in order that I may attain to the resurrection from the dead. 12 Not that I have already obtained it or have already become perfect, but I press on so that I may lay hold of that for which also I was laid hold of by Christ Jesus. 13 Brethren, I do not regard myself as having laid hold of it yet; but one thing I do: forgetting what lies behind and reaching forward to what lies ahead, 14 I press on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus. 15 Let us therefore, as many as are perfect, have this attitude; and if in anything you have a different attitude, God will reveal that also to you; 16 however, let us keep living by that same standard to which we have attained. 17 Brethren, join in following my example, and observe those who walk according to the pattern you have in us. 18 For many walk, of whom I often told you, and now tell you even weeping, that they are enemies of the cross of Christ, 19 whose end is destruction, whose god is their appetite, and whose glory is in their shame, who set their minds on earthly things. 20 For our citizenship is in heaven, from which also we eagerly wait for a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ; 21 who will transform the body of our humble state into conformity with the body of His glory, by the exertion of the power that He has even to subject all things to Himself.
 

TweetyBird

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Please read Matthew 5:19 NASB.

Matthew 5:19 NASB - 19 "Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches others to do the same, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

In the very next breath, Jesus began to point out the deficiencies of the Mosaic Law. The context shows what Jesus was referring to, the commandments He was teaching was not Torah.

Philippians 3:16 NASB - 16 however, let us keep living by that same standard to which we have attained.

That Standard is not Torah, but Jesus.

Heb 3
Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus; 2 who was faithful to him that appointed him, as also Moses was faithful in all his house. 3 For this man was counted worthy of more glory than Moses, inasmuch as he who hath builded the house hath more honour than the house. 4 For every house is builded by some man; but he that built all things is God. 5 And Moses verily was faithful in all his house, as a servant, >>>>>>>>>> for a testimony of those things which were to be spoken after; 6 but Christ as a son over his own house; whose house are we, if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end.

 

TweetyBird

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Philippians 3:7-21 NASB - 7 But whatever things were gain to me, those things I have counted as loss for the sake of Christ. 8 More than that, I count all things to be loss in view of the surpassing value of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them but rubbish so that I may gain Christ, 9 and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith, 10 that I may know Him and the power of His resurrection and the fellowship of His sufferings, being conformed to His death; 11 in order that I may attain to the resurrection from the dead. 12 Not that I have already obtained it or have already become perfect, but I press on so that I may lay hold of that for which also I was laid hold of by Christ Jesus. 13 Brethren, I do not regard myself as having laid hold of it yet; but one thing I do: forgetting what lies behind and reaching forward to what lies ahead, 14 I press on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus. 15 Let us therefore, as many as are perfect, have this attitude; and if in anything you have a different attitude, God will reveal that also to you; 16 however, let us keep living by that same standard to which we have attained. 17 Brethren, join in following my example, and observe those who walk according to the pattern you have in us. 18 For many walk, of whom I often told you, and now tell you even weeping, that they are enemies of the cross of Christ, 19 whose end is destruction, whose god is their appetite, and whose glory is in their shame, who set their minds on earthly things. 20 For our citizenship is in heaven, from which also we eagerly wait for a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ; 21 who will transform the body of our humble state into conformity with the body of His glory, by the exertion of the power that He has even to subject all things to Himself.

Paul is saying that all he learned from a child onward -his Jewish, his knowledge of "Torah", his study under Gamaliel is dung to him in order to attain to the resurrection of Christ.

Phil 3
Finally, my brethren, rejoice in the Lord. To write the same things to you, to me indeed is not grievous, but for you it is safe. 2 Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the concision. 3 For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh. 4 Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more: 5 circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee; 6 concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless. 7 But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ. 8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
 

TweetyBird

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See Galatians 3 NASB.

Galatians 3 is about faith not about the Law of Moses. The Law of Moses was a curse. We walk in the Spirit. Look at Gal 4 where Paul compares the Law of Moses Covenant to Hagar which is bondage. The New Jerusalem which is Jesus is the new covenant and freedom. Then in chapt 5, Paul lists those things that are unacceptable to God and will keep people out of the kingdom of Heaven. Please note, that list is not the Law of Moses. Then Paul shows what God expects - living the gifts of the Spirit which is walking in the Spirit. That is not even in the same ball park as the Law of Moses. You are grasping at what you can do, when it's about what Jesus has done for us.
 
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