Wastewater injection causes earthquakes

[Greg Jennings]

Actually there is no litigation as of yet only the threat of it. My point is you would know this if you took the time to follow the links offered.



I had a really detailed post worked up about this whole subject and it fell into the abyss when I tried to preview it. Suffice to say the only such activity of note currently is occurring in Oklahoma and to make such pronouncements as you have offered with such limited data is, at best, premature. Suffice to say there is a lot more to the subjects of plate tectonics, hydrodynamics, fracking and injection wells than can be encompassed in such as simplistic manner as you offered. That is if one is in any way interested in diligence.



No. And I would suggest that you don't either.

Actually yes, I do. It's discussed often when you're taking geology courses. It's well known that lubricating faults makes them more likely to slip, and (spoiler alert) water is a decent lubricant.

Obviously and by your own admission, you don't know much about faults, earthquakes, fault locations, and geology in general. That's fine, not a ton of people do. But your general assumption that I'm incorrect without even bothering to see what the scientists say is off-putting, to put it nicely. This isn't really up for debate.
Water on a fault making earthquakes more likely is as easy a conclusion to reach in geology as 2+2=4 is in mathematics. It's basic. We know that water aids in the subduction of oceanic plates by lubricsting them deep beneath the ocean crust and allowing easier slippage. Why in the world would you expect it to cause movement there, but not at another tectonic boundary?

Not to mention the incredibly sharp increase in earthquake frequency in Oklahoma, which has fault lines running through parts of it. I know you want to blame that all on no one gathering data before this year, but come on man. That's crazy. It's up 2800% since fracking started. Do really think that, when the data is coupled with the basic geological knowledge that water makes plates slip, the increase in earthquakes is a coincidence? What sources are telling you that? They're bad sources

 

[fzappa13]

Actually yes, I do. It's discussed often when you're taking geology courses. It's well known that lubricating faults makes them more likely to slip, and (spoiler alert) water is a decent lubricant.

This whole thread was predicated on the idea that putting water back into wells that had water taken out of them was causing earth quakes. If you and your college professors don't see the inanity of that, well, … it is what it is. Suffice to say you aren't the first person to fall victim to the notion that all that falls from a tenured professor's mouth is holy writ. Indeed when one pays good money to be fed what at the time passes for the latest sponsored reality, woe be unto him that attempts to come between said acolyte and that. I've seen the same thing happen in the field of Christian religious study as well.

Obviously and by your own admission, you don't know much about faults, earthquakes, fault locations, and geology in general. That's fine, not a ton of people do. But your general assumption that I'm incorrect without even bothering to see what the scientists say is off-putting, to put it nicely. This isn't really up for debate.

Okay … no debate … got it. Must be nice being that **** sure about what you think you know. These days, when someone offers me the salutation “wadda ya know?” I usually respond, “ If you had have asked me when I was 14 I could have told you any thing you wanted to know … now I'm not so sure.” I suspect this phenomenon played no small part in the creation of the term "sophomoric wisdom." Assuming that I am unfamiliar with the various arguments concerning this subject is just that ... an assumption ... and you know what the say about assuming.

Water on a fault making earthquakes more likely is as easy a conclusion to reach in geology as 2+2=4 is in mathematics. It's basic. We know that water aids in the subduction of oceanic plates by lubricsting them deep beneath the ocean crust and allowing easier slippage. Why in the world would you expect it to cause movement there, but not at another tectonic boundary?

The ocean being the ultimate tectonic lubricant one would think California would have parted for more Westerly climes long ago ... Would that they had.

Not to mention the incredibly sharp increase in earthquake frequency in Oklahoma, which has fault lines running through parts of it. I know you want to blame that all on no one gathering data before this year, but come on man. That's crazy. It's up 2800% since fracking started. Do really think that, when the data is coupled with the basic geological knowledge that water makes plates slip, the increase in earthquakes is a coincidence? What sources are telling you that? They're bad sources

Please take a deep breath and step back … and look at what you just said …



Oklahoma.


If I lived in Oklahoma I would no doubt now be casting about for answers as well, but … It's Oklahoma. That should be your first hint that there may be some other causality than fracking and waste water disposal given it's relative ubiquity in the states surrounding and otherwise near Oklahoma.

 

[Greg Jennings]

This whole thread was predicated on the idea that putting water back into wells that had water taken out of them was causing earth quakes. If you and your college professors don't see the inanity of that, well, … it is what it is. Suffice to say you aren't the first person to fall victim to the notion that all that falls from a tenured professor's mouth is holy writ. Indeed when one pays good money to be fed what at the time passes for the latest sponsored reality, woe be unto him that attempts to come between said acolyte and that. I've seen the same thing happen in the field of Christian religious study as well.




Okay … no debate … got it. Must be nice being that **** sure about what you think you know. These days, when someone offers me the salutation “wadda ya know?” I usually respond, “ If you had have asked me when I was 14 I could have told you any thing you wanted to know … now I'm not so sure.” I suspect this phenomenon played no small part in the creation of the term "sophomoric wisdom." Assuming that I am unfamiliar with the various arguments concerning this subject is just that ... an assumption ... and you know what the say about assuming.

If you have no regard for the expertise of those working in higher education, then there's nothing I can say to help you. Your delusion is too deep to break. Just keep on thinking that every university is full of liberals out to brainwash you into thinking science is God. That's what you crazy people think, right?

The ocean being the ultimate tectonic lubricant one would think California would have parted for more Westerly climes long ago ... Would that they had.

Omg.....obviously no geology for you ever :doh: Look up "subduction zone" for me. It'll show you how sea water gets sucked beneath the crust into the lithosphere. Again, when you obviously know so little about the subject, why do you adamantly deny what is evident from everything?

Please take a deep breath and step back … and look at what you just said …



Oklahoma.


If I lived in Oklahoma I would no doubt now be casting about for answers as well, but … It's Oklahoma. That should be your first hint that there may be some other causality than fracking and waste water disposal given it's relative ubiquity in the states surrounding and otherwise near Oklahoma.

I can't say I'm following.

 

[fzappa13]

I can't say I'm following.

That is self evident.

 

[Greg Jennings]

That is self evident.

Yes it's clear from our exchange that I was the idiot here


:chuckle:

 

[fzappa13]

Yes it's clear from our exchange that I was the idiot here


:chuckle:

I would say you are more like the person who, having walked by two people having a conversation and having heard part of it, goes on to try and respond. It is annoying to the folks who were participants in the original conversation.

 

[Greg Jennings]

I would say you are more like the person who, having walked by two people having a conversation and having heard part of it, goes on to try and respond. It is annoying to the folks who were participants in the original conversation.

This is a forum. If you want a conversation to stay private, then don't start an open thread. If you want a discussion to go private, then use PMs. Open threads are for everyone.

If a few facts from a bypassing stranger tick you off so much, then maybe the Internet ain't for you

 

[fzappa13]

This is a forum. If you want a conversation to stay private, then don't start an open thread. If you want a discussion to go private, then use PMs. Open threads are for everyone.

If a few facts from a bypassing stranger tick you off so much, then maybe the Internet ain't for you

Dear Greg, I've been here since '03. That you presume to lecture me about the function of this forum is every bit as presumptuous as you lecturing me about the subject of this thread. But, possessed of the assurity that is unique to youth, you lecture when you should listen. The good news is you will eventually outgrow this. The bad news? ... it'll likely be a while.

 

[Greg Jennings]

Dear Greg, I've been here since '03. That you presume to lecture me about the function of this forum is every bit as presumptuous as you lecturing me about the subject of this thread. But, possessed of the assurity that is unique to youth, you lecture when you should listen. The good news is you will eventually outgrow this. The bad news? ... it'll likely be a while.

I'm not lecturing on how this forum goes. I'm telling you how all forums go. People comment on things in order to start or join a conversation. That's sort of the whole point.

Or perhaps you can show me in the TOL rules where it states that one should not talk to another while the other person is already engaged?

 

[fzappa13]

I'm not lecturing on how this forum goes. I'm telling you how all forums go. People comment on things in order to start or join a conversation. That's sort of the whole point.

Or perhaps you can show me in the TOL rules where it states that one should not talk to another while the other person is already engaged?

Actually, it's more a matter of wisdom and decorum that should, but seldom does, regulate speech. Don't get me wrong, there is definitely something to be said for the zeal of youth, however; do you know the depth of waste water wells? The porosity of the strata between them and the boundary of the tectonic plates in question? The distance between the zones being fracked and said plates and said wells? Unfortunately I do as a result of my dealings with an O and G industry I hope to not have to interface with again in this lifetime. It is corrupt from one end to the other.

I said all that to suggest this; if you trade practical experience for academic theorems offered by those paid tenure to champion whatever the latest cause du jour is by those offering tenure, well, you get what you pay for and that is what you paid for. Learn to think for yourself. Yes, I know it goes against the grain and there will be few to encourage you in this endeavor but, like virtue, truth is its own reward.

Said another way, when you place what is known practically about the formations in question against what is currently offered by media sanctioned academia the two don't agree. So, it looks like we have a choice to make. Choose well.

 

[User Name]

This issue has been back in the news lately after a 5.6-magnitude earthquake in Oklahoma...

 

[fzappa13]

This issue has been back in the news lately after a 5.6-magnitude earthquake in Oklahoma...

Though it is just now "in the news again" things have been rumbling in Oklahoma steadily for quite some time. As it concerns the subject of this thread you're not seeing this in the other areas that have allowed oil producers to re-inject the water they have extracted back where it came from. I think it time to explore other suspects as it concerns reasons for this phenomenon in OK.

 

[CabinetMaker]

How come pumping water into the ground absolutely causes earthquakes but burning millions of tons of fossil fuels each day doesn't case climate change?

 

[User Name]

Though it is just now "in the news again" things have been rumbling in Oklahoma steadily for quite some time. As it concerns the subject of this thread you're not seeing this in the other areas that have allowed oil producers to re-inject the water they have extracted back where it came from. I think it time to explore other suspects as it concerns reasons for this phenomenon in OK.

Between 1972 and 2008, the USGS recorded just a few earthquakes a year in Oklahoma. In 2008, there were more than a dozen; nearly 50 occurred in 2009. In 2010, the number exploded to more than 1,000. These so-called "earthquake swarms" are occurring in other places where the ground is not supposed to move. There have been abrupt upticks in both the size and frequency of quakes in Arkansas, Colorado, Ohio, and Texas. Scientists investigating these anomalies are coming to the same conclusion: The quakes are linked to injection wells. -- http://www.motherjones.com/environment/2013/03/does-fracking-cause-earthquakes-wastewater-dewatering

See also: "Wastewater disposal and earthquake swarm activity at the southern end of the Central Valley, California" -- From Geophysical Research Letters, which is a peer-reviewed scientific journal of geoscience.

 

[User Name]

Drilling Reawakens Sleeping Faults in Texas, Leads to Earthquakes:

https://www.scientificamerican.com/...leeping-faults-in-texas-leads-to-earthquakes/