UNCONDITIONAL REPROBATION.

[Truster]

Most people have a serious blind spot when it comes to predetermined (predestination) salvation, except of course those who worship Calvin. A blind spot often occurs, even with Calvinists, when it comes to Unconditional Reprobation.

Unconditional Reprobation means that Elohim reprobated people unconditionally and not because of evil or sin they would commit during their lives.

Why did Elohim emphasize that He loved Jacob before Jacob had done anything good and hated Esau before Esau had done anything bad? Because He was showing that election and reprobation are both unconditional.

"For [the children] not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil, that the purpose of Elohim according to election might stand, not of works, but of the [One] calling, it was said to her, The greater shall serve the lesser; even as it has been written, I loved Jacob, and I hated Esau" (Romans 9:11-13).

 

[Nick M]

I told you Truster is evil and wicked in his heart. What a degenerate our creator would be if this were true.

 

[Truster]

This message is hidden because Nick M is on your ignore list.

In Romans 9:11-22 KJV, the Holy Spirit through Paul appeals to the absolute sovereignty of the Eternal Almighty, not some blasphemous standard of justice that man imposes on Elohim. The Eternal Almighty can do whatsoever pleases Him with His creation, including making some people vessels of His blessing and making other people vessels of His wrath.

"So, then, to whom He desires, He shows mercy. And to whom He desires, He hardens" (Romans 9:18).

 

[steko]

Most people have a serious blind spot when it comes to predetermined (predestination) salvation, except of course those who worship Calvin. A blind spot often occurs, even with Calvinists, when it comes to Unconditional Reprobation.

Unconditional Reprobation means that Elohim reprobated people unconditionally and not because of evil or sin they would commit during their lives.

Why did Elohim emphasize that He loved Jacob before Jacob had done anything good and hated Esau before Esau had done anything bad? Because He was showing that election and reprobation are both unconditional.

"For [the children] not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil, that the purpose of Elohim according to election might stand, not of works, but of the [One] calling, it was said to her, The greater shall serve the lesser; even as it has been written, I loved Jacob, and I hated Esau" (Romans 9:11-13).

Did the individual named Esau ever become the servant of Jacob?

Did GOD predestinate the man named Esau to eternal damnation?

 

[Truster]

Did the individual named Esau ever become the servant of Jacob?

Did GOD predestinate the man named Esau to eternal damnation?

Go and search the scriptures. The answers are there.

 

[steko]

Go and search the scriptures. The answers are there.

Yep!

 

[glorydaz]

I told you Truster is evil and wicked in his heart. What a degenerate our creator would be if this were true.

:thumb:

 

[Epoisses]

Most people have a serious blind spot when it comes to predetermined (predestination) salvation, except of course those who worship Calvin. A blind spot often occurs, even with Calvinists, when it comes to Unconditional Reprobation.

Unconditional Reprobation means that Elohim reprobated people unconditionally and not because of evil or sin they would commit during their lives.

Why did Elohim emphasize that He loved Jacob before Jacob had done anything good and hated Esau before Esau had done anything bad? Because He was showing that election and reprobation are both unconditional.

"For [the children] not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil, that the purpose of Elohim according to election might stand, not of works, but of the [One] calling, it was said to her, The greater shall serve the lesser; even as it has been written, I loved Jacob, and I hated Esau" (Romans 9:11-13).

Heresy. God hated Esau because he sold his birthright for a bowl of soup. Esau represents the lost who value the shed blood of Christ as being no higher than a single meal.

 

[Nang]

Did the individual named Esau ever become the servant of Jacob?

Did GOD predestinate the man named Esau to eternal damnation?

Yes and yes . . .

God IS Sovereign, you know.

Or do you?

 

[Epoisses]

This message is hidden because Nick M is on your ignore list.

In Romans 9:11-22 KJV, the Holy Spirit through Paul appeals to the absolute sovereignty of the Eternal Almighty, not some blasphemous standard of justice that man imposes on Elohim. The Eternal Almighty can do whatsoever pleases Him with His creation, including making some people vessels of His blessing and making other people vessels of His wrath.

"So, then, to whom He desires, He shows mercy. And to whom He desires, He hardens" (Romans 9:18).

Absolute sovereignty is a myth. Sin is a violation of God's Divine will not something he ordained. Satan/Lucifer the original sinner was created perfect until iniquity was found in him. God did not will for Satan nor Adam to sin therefore sin is chargeable to the creation not the creator. The verses in Romans refer to a creation that is already fallen and so are not applicable to the creation in it's pre-fallen state.

 

[Truster]

Absolute sovereignty is a myth. Sin is a violation of God's Divine will not something he ordained. Satan/Lucifer the original sinner was created perfect until iniquity was found in him. God did not will for Satan nor Adam to sin therefore sin is chargeable to the creation not the creator. The verses in Romans refer to a creation that is already fallen and so are not applicable to the creation in it's pre-fallen state.

I cannot believe how ignorant you people are.

 

[Epoisses]

I cannot believe how ignorant you people are.

Your ignorance makes God the author of sin which is a sin against God himself!

Romans 8-11 is an effort to combat the extreme works righteousness of the Jews in the 1st century. You're reading the verses with your 21st century goggles on and forgetting that.

 

[meshak]

I cannot believe how ignorant you people are.

why don't you correct our mistakes?

thanks.

 

[Nang]

Your ignorance makes God the author of sin which is a sin against God himself!

God is the first cause of all things, but God is not the author of sin. Scripture clearly places the blame for sin upon Adam. Romans 5:12

Romans 8-11 is an effort to combat the extreme works righteousness of the Jews in the 1st century. You're reading the verses with your 21st century goggles on and forgetting that.

Romans 8-11 is all about the election of Sovereign God to show mercy on whom He wills and to harden whom He wills in order to make His power known. Romans 9:14-18

 

[JudgeRightly]

I've gone over this before in another thread, but the phrase "Jacob I have loved, but Esau I have hated" doesnt literally mean God loved Jacob and hated Esau. No, it's using a Hebrew idiom which means "to love and to love more." God loved both Jacob and Esau, but He loved Jacob more.

Also that verse isn't talking about two little babies in the womb. It's talking about two nations, the descendants of Esau, whom God loved, and the descendants of Jacob/Israel, whom God loved more.

Does that make sense? God doesn't hate babies. He loves everyone and wants all to come to Him, but Israel He loved more than any other nation.

 

[Truster]

why don't you correct our mistakes?

thanks.

It would be like going down to the local graveyard and conversing with corpses.

 

[Truster]

I've gone over this before in another thread, but the phrase "Jacob I have loved, but Esau I have hated" doesnt literally mean God loved Jacob and hated Esau. No, it's using a Hebrew idiom which means "to love and to love more." God loved both Jacob and Esau, but He loved Jacob more.

Also that verse isn't talking about two little babies in the womb. It's talking about two nations, the descendants of Esau, whom God loved, and the descendants of Jacob/Israel, whom God loved more.

Does that make sense? God doesn't hate babies. He loves everyone and wants all to come to Him, but Israel He loved more than any other nation.

You neither know the Almighty nor can you worship Him in spirit or in truth.


The trouble is that you receive the testimony of Elohim only so far as you can satisfactorily account for all the reasons and grounds of His conduct, which means you will accept nothing but that which can be measured in the petty scales of your own limited capacities.(borrowed from awp)

The revelation you have received is the general revelation and you have built your religion on that foundation of sand. I've been witness to people like you finding themselves in that evil day that is promised and its not a pleasant sight.

 

[JudgeRightly]

You neither know the Almighty nor can you worship Him in spirit or in truth.


The trouble is that you receive the testimony of Elohim only so far as you can satisfactorily account for all the reasons and grounds of His conduct, which means you will accept nothing but that which can be measured in the petty scales of your own limited capacities.(borrowed from awp)

The revelation you have received is the general revelation and you have built your religion on that foundation of sand. I've been witness to people like you finding themselves in that evil day that is promised and its not a pleasant sight.

So instead of replying to what I wrote, you're just going to be condescending towards me? Right.

 

[Truster]

So instead of replying to what I wrote, you're just going to be condescending towards me? Right.

I have given you the facts I cannot give you the spiritual capacity necessary to comprehend, embrace and base your worship on these facts. You choose to make idols of errors and false doctrine. Not being content with that you want to spread the falsehoods.

In due time your foot shall slide.

 

[meshak]

It would be like going down to the local graveyard and conversing with corpses.

This is not Jesus' spirit, friend.

cheer up, Jesus loves you.