The Serpent's doctrine

[CherubRam]

The Serpent's doctrine is eternal life in Hell.

Genesis 2:17
...but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die."


Genesis 3:4
"You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman.

 

[CherubRam]

There is dead, and then there is really dead. Like no return dead. Their punishment is eternal death.

 

[dodge]

There is dead, and then there is really dead. Like no return dead. Their punishment is eternal death.

Scripture says you are wrong:


Luk 16:23
And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

 

[jamie]

The Serpent's doctrine is eternal life in Hell.

Eternal life is a gift from God, it is not something we have innately. Death and hell will be cast into the lake of fire.

 

[CherubRam]

Scripture says you are wrong:


Luk 16:23
And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

In regards to: The Rich Man and Lazarus. Luke 16:19-31

Theophilus is the name or honorary title of the person to whom the Gospel of Luke and the Acts of the Apostles are addressed (Luke 1:3, Acts 1:1)

It is unanimously agreed that both Luke and Acts were originally written in Koine Greek, and that "Theophilos," as it appears therein, means friend of God or (be)loved by God or loving God in the Greek language.

No one knows the true identity of Theophilus who wrote the story, and there are more than several conjectures and traditions around an identity.
In all there are about eight traditions based upon that story. Again I say: Hell has never been a doctrinal belief in Judaism.

Don't you think if Yahshua was to introduce a new doctrine that he would at least explain the story?


Hades ( /ˈheɪdiːz/; from Greek ᾍδης (older form Ἀϝίδης), Hadēs, originally Ἅιδης, Haidēs or Άΐδης, Aidēs (Doric Ἀΐδας Aidas), meaning "the unseen") was the ancient Greek god of the underworld. The genitive ᾍδου, Haidou, was an elision to denote locality: "[the house/dominion] of Hades". Eventually, the nominative came to designate the abode of the dead.

In Greek mythology, Hades is the oldest male child of Cronus and Rhea. According to myth, he and his brothers Zeus and Poseidon defeated the Titans and claimed rulership over the cosmos, ruling the underworld, air, and sea, respectively; the solid earth, long the province of Gaia, was available to all three concurrently.

Hades was also called "Plouton" (Greek: Πλούτων, gen.: Πλούτωνος, meaning "Rich One"), a name which the Romans Latinized as Pluto. The Romans would associate Hades/Pluto with their own chthonic gods, Dis Pater and Orcus. The corresponding Etruscan god was Aita. Symbols associated with him are the Helm of Darkness, the bident and the three-headed dog, Cerberus.

 

[CherubRam]

Hell
Old English hel, hell, of Germanic origin; related to Dutch hel and German Hölle, from an Indo-European root meaning ‘to cover, conceal, or hide.
Hell was taught in Greek philosophy by Plato between 427-347 BC.

Hell
Also Hell, Old English hel, helle, "nether world, abode of the dead, infernal regions, place of torment for the wicked after death," from Proto-Germanic *haljo "the underworld" (cognates: Old Frisian helle, Old Saxon hellia, Dutch hel, Old Norse hel, German Hölle, Gothic halja "hell").

The English word may be in part from the Old Norse mythological Hel (from Proto-Germanic *halija "one who covers up or hides something"), in Norse mythology the name of Loki's daughter who rules over the evil dead in Niflheim, the lowest of all worlds (nifl "mist"). Hell is a pagan concept and word adapted to Christianity.

 

[CherubRam]

Tar-ta-rus (tartarus) [[ Gr Tartaros ]] Gr. Myth. 1. An infernal abyss below Hades, where Zeus hurls the rebel Titans, later a place of punishment for the demons and devils. (mentioned only once in the Bible)

Ha-des (hadez) [[Gr Haides ]] 1 Gr. Myth. a. The home of the dead, beneath the earth. b The god of the underworld. 2. Bible: The state or resting place of the dead: name used in some modern translations of the New Testament

She-ol (sheol) [[Heb shaal , to dig]] A place in the depths of the earth conceived of as the dwelling of the dead. Note: In the KJV about half of scriptures are translated as hell, the other half as grave.

Gehenna: Mentioned twelve or thirteen times in the bible. Gehenna: Referring to the Valley of Hinnom, or Gehenna which is the city dump outside the walls of Jerusalem.

Topheth is believed to be a location in Jerusalem, in the Valley of Hinnom, where the Canaanites sacrificed children to the god Moloch by burning them alive.

 

[CherubRam]

Catholic Gnosticism.
The attitude of the Catholic Church toward paganism is best summed up by Pope Gregory the Great, in his words to a missionary: “You must not interfere with any traditional belief or religious observance that can be harmonized with Christianity.”

Not only were the Congregations divided by Gnosticism, but enticed by philosophy and paganism also, and there were geographic divisions as well.
Pope Gregory 540 – 12 March 604.

Just a reminder that it was the Catholic Church that canonized scripture.


The Rich Man And Lazarus With Commentary.
Luke 16:19. "There was a rich man who was dressed in purple and fine linen and lived in luxury every day. 20At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores 21and longing to eat what fell from the rich man's table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.
Wealth, comfort, poverty, and suffering have nothing to do with a person’s salvation.

22"The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried. 23In hell, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side. 24So he called to him, 'Father Abraham, have pity on me and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, because I am in agony in this fire.'
The word messenger is replaced with the word angel. And assuming that this is a parable, there would be no need for Lazarus to be carried to Abraham, and before the resurrection. As for being in Hell and torment and agony; that contradicts the verse that says the dead know nothing. It also is a contradiction where scripture says that Yahwah kills the condemned. In regards to the water on the finger; that would evaporate before it even got to a person. It also contradicts where God said “you will surly die.”

25"But Abraham replied, 'Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, while Lazarus received bad things, but now he is comforted here and you are in agony. 26And besides all this, between us and you a great chasm has been fixed, so that those who want to go from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.'

Again I say to you that wealth and poverty has nothing to do with the resurrection of the righteous. There is one truth in all of this, and that there is a chasm that has been set in place; and that is called death of the condemned, which are killed by Yahwah. There is no life for them afterward.

27"He answered, 'Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house, 28for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.'

29"Abraham replied, 'They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.'

30" 'No, father Abraham,' he said, 'but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.'
31"He said to him, 'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.' "

These are obviously the words of a dim wit, and not the words of an ancient being. No place in these verses is credit given to Yahwah, but only to Moses and the prophets; which would be unlike Yahshua to exclude Yahwah in matters of life and death.

Hell is a pagan belief and part of the Pagan religion. Why would Yahshua use a nonexistent biblical teaching for which he never explains afterward? Before the return from Babylon, Judaism never taught the concept of hell. After the return from Babylon the Hellenistic and Kabbalistic Jews began to introduce Hell into Judaism.

Yahshua never identified the story as a parable, and never explained the relevance as he did in other legitimate parables.
Yahshua, being an ancient being full of knowledge and wisdom, would have had the good sense to explain the new concept. Obviously the story of “The Rich Man and Lazarus” are the words of some man introducing the Pagan concept of Hell.

If it is true that there will be people ALIVE in Hell, Then God lied, and the Serpent told the truth. Was the word "Hell" added to scripture replacing the words grave, pit, and Gehenna? God is not a liar.

 

[djhow]

Call it weird but I have never been pre occupied by the afterlife even as a Christian. I have no fear or worries about what will happen even though I don't know and that despite all the speculation that history has conjured up I just know it'll be good and if it turns out I go to hell I will have no objections nor cries of terror.

All that aside to imagine God would endlessly torture is something that only the Devil could come up with. The disciples had the hope of resurrection but in the meantime they got on with life. I just know that to try and imagine life after death will come up short.

I know that you may point me to scripture so I would like to point you to prayer and ask God "Did you really sanction and take delight in genocide?"

Jesus said to the Pharisees you don't know Jehovah, if you want to see Jehovah then look to me and they wanted to stone him

 

[jamie]

Yahshua never identified the story as a parable, and never explained the relevance as he did in other legitimate parables.

The story is so simple and clear it needed no explanation to the Jewish mind.

 

[CherubRam]

The story is so simple and clear it needed no explanation to the Jewish mind.

Orthodox Jews and Christians did not teach or believe in a Hell. Hell was introduced by the Gnostic Catholics into the scriptures.

 

[CherubRam]

The number of times "Hell" appears in the English Bible
Translations


Bible Translations
Old Testament
New Testament
Total's
"Authorized" King James Version
31
23
54
New King James Version
19
13
32
American Standard Version
0
13
13
New American Standard Bible
0
13
13
Revised Standard Version
0
12
12
New Revised Standard Version
0
12
12
Revised English Bible
0
13
13
New Living Translation
0
13
13
Amplified
0
13
13
New International Version (best-selling English Bible)
0
14
14
Darby
0
12
12
New Century Version
0
12
12
Wesley's New Testament (1755)

0
0
Scarlett's N.T. (1798)

0
0
The New Testament in Greek and English (Kneeland, 1823)

0
0
Young's Literal Translation (1891)
0
0
0
Twentieth Century New Testament (1900)

0
0
Rotherham's Emphasized Bible (reprinted, 1902)
0
0
0
Fenton's Holy Bible in Modern English (1903)
0
0
0
Weymouth's New Testament in Modern Speech (1903)

0
0
Jewish Publication Society Bible Old Testament (1917)
0

0
Panin's Numeric English New Testament (1914)

0
0
The People's New Covenant (Overbury, 1925)

0
0
Hanson's New Covenant (1884)

0
0
Western N.T. (1926)

0
0
NT of our Lord and Savior Anointed (Tomanek, 1958)

0
0
Concordant Literal NT (1983)

0
0
The N.T., A Translation (Clementson, 1938)

0
0
Emphatic Diaglott, Greek/English Interlinear (Wilson, 1942)

0
0
New American Bible (1970)
0
0
0
Restoration of Original Sacred Name Bible (1976)
0
0
0
Tanakh. The Holy Scriptures, Old Testament (1985)
0

0
The New Testament, A New Translation (Greber, 1980)

0
0
Christian Bible (1991)
0
0
0
World English Bible (in progress)
0
0
0
Original Bible Project (Dr. James Tabor, still in translation)

0
0
0
Zondervan Parallel N.T. in Greek and English (1975)

0
0
Int. NASB-NIV Parallel N.T. in Greek and English (1993)**

0
0


The word hell was not originally in the Greek, Hebrew, or Aramaic text, as the so called biased translators have tried to establish it as scripture; but they were not good enough to cover up the reality of what God is saying. The source of this word hell and the concept of eternal torture is not Christian, but Pagan. You can find it in Babylon, in Greece, and especially Rome. But if you dig a little bit deeper you will see that it is bad translations that have infected this doctrine of Damnation in scriptures. As a matter of fact, scripture teaches the opposite.

 

[CherubRam]

If the word Hell is biblical, then the Serpent told the truth and God lied. Get my point?

Romans 1:32. Although they know God's righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.


Genesis 18:25
Far be it from you to do such a thing—to kill the righteous with the wicked, treating the righteous and the wicked alike. Far be it from you! Will not the Judge of all the earth do right?”


Matthew 10:28
And do not fear them which can kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in [hell / Gehenna.


Ecclesiastes 9:5
For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing; they have no further reward, and even their name is forgotten.


Job 27:8
For what hope have the godless when they are cut off, when God takes away their life?


As we all know the bible uses many parables. There is no real Hell, that word was put into scriptures by the Gnostic Pagans. Words like grave, pit, and Gehenna were replaced with the word hell. Those who are condemned to destruction never return. They are cut off for all eternity, never to live again.

 

[CherubRam]

Gehenna: Mentioned twelve or thirteen times in the bible. Gehenna: Referring to the Valley of Hinnom, or Gehenna, which is the city dump outside the walls of Jerusalem.

According to Archaeologist, there is no evidence to support that Gehenna was a place for burning garbage. There were however lots of Potsherds found.


Jeremiah 19:2
and go out to the Valley of Ben Hinnom, near the entrance of the Potsherd Gate. There proclaim the words I tell you,...

 

[CherubRam]

[FONT=&quot]Hell is the Serpent's doctrine.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Daniel 8:12[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
Because of rebellion, the LORD’s people and the daily sacrifice were given over to it. It prospered in everything it did, and truth was thrown to the ground.
Scripture is God's truth.


Catholic Gnosticism.
The attitude of the Catholic Church toward paganism is best summed up by Pope Gregory the Great, in his words to a missionary: “You must not interfere with any traditional belief or religious observance that can be harmonized with Christianity.”

Not only were the Congregations divided by Gnosticism, but enticed by philosophy and paganism also, and there were geographic divisions as well.
Pope Gregory 540 – 12 March 604.


[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Revelation 12:9[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his (angels / messengers) with him.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]

Just a reminder that it was the Catholic Church that canonized scripture.[/FONT]

 

[Ben Masada]

The Serpent's doctrine is eternal life in Hell Genesis 2:17
...but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die."

Genesis 3:4 "You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman.

The serpent doctrine is eternal life, period. Hence, it must be really terrible!

 

[CherubRam]

The serpent doctrine is eternal life, period. Hence, it must be really terrible!

Life immortal is a gift from God, and not anything a Serpent or person can do.

 

[Ben Masada]

Orthodox Jews and Christians did not teach or believe in a Hell. Hell was introduced by the Gnostic Catholics into the scriptures.

We do believe in a hell but, the hell we believe is called Sheol aka the grave. Nothing to do with the Christian hell-fire.

 

[Ben Masada]

Call it weird but I have never been pre occupied by the afterlife even as a Christian. I have no fear or worries about what will happen even though I don't know and that despite all the speculation that history has conjured up I just know it'll be good and if it turns out I go to hell I will have no objections nor cries of terror.

How do you know it will be good? You neither know now nor in the afterlife... and that's good that we don't know about the after life and that we never will.

All that aside to imagine God would endlessly torture is something that only the Devil could come up with. The disciples had the hope of resurrection but in the meantime they got on with life. I just know that to try and imagine life after death will come up short.

The Devil does not exist as a being. It is only a concept to illustrate the evil inclination in man. The disciples of Jesus were all Jewish and they had no hope in resurrection because they knew that we once dead, will never rise from the grave. (II Samuel 12:23; Isaiah 26:14; Job 7:9)

I know that you may point me to scripture so I would like to point you to prayer and ask God "Did you really sanction and take delight in genocide?"

God is not like a man to take delight in genocide or even to be involved with genocide. It is all man's things.

Jesus said to the Pharisees you don't know Jehovah, if you want to see Jehovah then look to me and they wanted to stone him

Jesus was a Jew. A Jew would never speak like that. He would have to be a mental case. You have not mentioned but I am almost sure you bring that reference from John 8. If you read verse 31, Jesus was speaking to the Jews who had believed in him. Now, if you go to verse 44, Jesus is calling them children of the Devil.How could he have called children of the Devil the Jews who had believed in him. It doesn't make sense at all. Better off to discard the whole thing altogether as a forgery by the Hellenist who wrote the book of John.

 

[Ben Masada]

Life immortal is a gift from God, and not anything a Serpent or person can do.

Eternal life is one of the attributes God has not granted to man. Please, read Genesis 3:22. The reason why Adam & Eve were banished from the Garden of Eden was to prevent them from eating of the tree of life and live forever. Man could not live forever as this attribute belongs to God only.