The Order of Salvation

[Robert Pate]

The proper order is: In Christ first BEFORE one can hear and believe.

And to be in Christ is to be NOT lost and therefore saved.

Pate says salvation is "NOT WHAT WE DO", yet he teaches that UNLESS one hears and believes he cannot be saved. Paradoxical and laced with an impurity.

For Pate's doctrine to be scriptural, he has to remove the impurity from it: the false doctrine that people are born in sin instead of born in Christ.

In order for one to believe your doctrine that people are born saved means that you will have to discard many scriptures such as Psalm 51:5, "In sin did my mother conceive me". also Romans 5:12 "Wherefore as by one man sin entered the world and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men".
A heretic is one that deletes scripture or adds to scripture in order to prove their doctrine. It appears that you are off to a good start.

 

[jamie]

It's not a punishment its an example of not correctly addressing my Father and my Brother.

"Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me." (Matthew 25:40)

Robert Pate is your neighbor ... love him.

Respect is an aspect of love.

 

[Truster]

The proper order is: In Christ first BEFORE one can hear and believe.

And to be in Christ is to be NOT lost and therefore saved.

Pate says salvation is "NOT WHAT WE DO", yet he teaches that UNLESS one hears and believes he cannot be saved. Paradoxical and laced with an impurity.

For Pate's doctrine to be scriptural, he has to remove the impurity from it: the false doctrine that people are born in sin instead of born in Christ.

You propose the same filth as b57.

 

[Samie]

In order for one to believe your doctrine that people are born saved means that you will have to discard many scriptures such as Psalm 51:5, "In sin did my mother conceive me". also Romans 5:12 "Wherefore as by one man sin entered the world and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men".

The verses you paraded do not say people are born in sin.

David said he was conceived in sin, but the Lord told Jeremiah he was sanctified before birth. Hence, conceived in sin but sanctified before birth.

A heretic is one that deletes scripture or adds to scripture in order to prove their doctrine. It appears that you are off to a good start.

That definition of heretic best describes you. You teach against what Jesus said that apart from Him man can do NOTHING by teaching man can do SOMETHING - he can hear and believe - while apart from Christ.

 

[Samie]

You propose the same filth as b57.

Nope. You and b57 both believe that people are born in sin.

For you truth is filth.

 

[Truster]

Nope. You and b57 both believe that people are born in sin.

For you truth is filth.

The first time a person comes face to face with the enormity of his sin is after he has been converted. Hindsight in spiritual matters is 20/20. You have not been converted and so you have no hindsight. There is no before and after for you, just a before as you are still in Adam, in sin and under wrath because you are guilty under the law.

b57 thinks man is justified from eternity (past, as he mistakenly calls it)) and is therefore not in need of the experience of regeneration or conversion.

 

[Robert Pate]

People are saved and are born again by hearing and believing the Gospel. This is what the Bible teaches. The Bible does not teach that humanity is born sinless. Paul brings that out when he wrote, "There is NONE righteous, no, not one" Romans 3:10. If it were true that we are born sinless Paul would not have said, "There is NONE righteous". He probably would have said, "There are many born righteous, but they will sin". There is nothing in the scriptures like that. There is a strong emphasis in the Bible about being born again. Peter wrote, "Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God (the Gospel) which lives and abides for ever, 1 Peter 1:23.

 

[patrick jane]

"Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me." (Matthew 25:40)

Robert Pate is your neighbor ... love him.

Respect is an aspect of love.

Truster can't do that now that he's regenerate

 

[1Mind1Spirit]

Truster can't do that now that he's regenerate

They should have an emoticon pulling his hair out.

 

[jamie]

People are saved and are born again by hearing and believing the Gospel.

Did that happen with Jesus or was he born a second time by a resurrection from the dead?

 

[Samie]

People are saved and are born again by hearing and believing the Gospel. This is what the Bible teaches.

No. that's what you falsely teach. You are teaching salvation by works. The Bible teaches grace-based salvation.

The Bible does not teach that humanity is born sinless.

It's what it teaches; you just refuse to believe what it teaches in this regard.

Conceived in sin as per David (Ps 51:5) but sanctified before birth as per God Himself (Jer 1:5). And those whom God sanctified He made perfect FOREVER (Heb 10:10, 14).

Paul brings that out when he wrote, "There is NONE righteous, no, not one" Romans 3:10.

Paul simply quoted it from Psalms.

If it were true that we are born sinless Paul would not have said, "There is NONE righteous". He probably would have said, "There are many born righteous, but they will sin". There is nothing in the scriptures like that.

I have given you the verses long time ago, you just don't believe them. You even refuse to believe our Lord when He said man can do NOTHING when NOT in Him. You keep on insisting that while NOT in Christ, people can do the acts of hearing and believing for them to be in Him.

There is a strong emphasis in the Bible about being born again. Peter wrote, "Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God (the Gospel) which lives and abides for ever, 1 Peter 1:23.

You quote Peter but you don't believe him when he said it's God Who caused us to be born again:

NAS 1 Peter 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His great mercy has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead

You insist that man's new birth is brought about by his acts of "hearing and believing". Salvation by works is what you teach: UNSCRIPTURAL.

 

[Right Divider]

Conceived in sin as per David (Ps 51:5) but sanctified before birth as per God Himself (Jer 1:5). And those whom God sanctified He made perfect FOREVER (Heb 10:10, 14).

You are typical of someone that uses scripture WRONGLY to try to make your story true when it is NOT!

Jeremiah 1:5 is SPECIFICALLY about ONE person... and that is JEREMIAH.

And the sanctification that it is talking about was his being chosen as "a prophet unto the nations".

 

[Samie]

You are typical of someone that uses scripture WRONGLY to try to make your story true when it is NOT!

Jeremiah 1:5 is SPECIFICALLY about ONE person... and that is JEREMIAH.

So why take David's statement as applicable to all humans when David was talking about himself as being conceived in sin?

You are THAT someone who uses scripture WRONGLY to try to make your false story true!

 

[Right Divider]

So why take David's statement as applicable to all humans when David was talking about himself as being conceived in sin?

I was NOT commenting on David''s statement, so that is completely irrelevant to YOUR MISUSE of Jeremiah!

You are THAT someone who uses scripture WRONGLY to try to make your false story true!

You used Jeremiah DECEPTIVELY and OUT OF CONTEXT.

 

[Samie]

I was NOT commenting on David''s statement, so that is completely irrelevant to YOUR MISUSE of Jeremiah!

Then you have no Scripture to prove that people are born in sin.

You used Jeremiah DECEPTIVELY and OUT OF CONTEXT.

That's according to you.

Sanctification is God's work and He did it through Christ. Heb 10:10

 

[Robert Pate]

Then you have no Scripture to prove that people are born in sin.

That's according to you.

Sanctification is God's work and He did it through Christ. Heb 10:10

You have never been born again by the word of God or you would know better than to teach such heresy.

"Being born again, not of corruptible seed (Adam) but of incorruptible, by the word of God (the Gospel) which lives and abides for ever" 1 Peter 1:23.

 

[Samie]

You have never been born again by the word of God or you would know better than to teach such heresy.

"Being born again, not of corruptible seed (Adam) but of incorruptible, by the word of God (the Gospel) which lives and abides for ever" 1 Peter 1:23.

You are the one teaching heresy, Pate.

1. By teaching that man can do SOMETHING - they can hear and believe - while yet apart from Christ, you teach heresy because Christ taught that apart from Him man can do NOTHING. John 15:5

2. By teaching that unless man first hears and believes he cannot be born again, you teach heresy because Scriptures say it was God Who caused us to be born again through the resurrection of Christ. 1 Pet 1:3

 

[Robert Pate]

You are the one teaching heresy, Pate.

1. By teaching that man can do SOMETHING - they can hear and believe - while yet apart from Christ, you teach heresy because Christ taught that apart from Him man can do NOTHING. John 15:5

2. By teaching that unless man first hears and believes he cannot be born again, you teach heresy because Scriptures say it was God Who caused us to be born again through the resurrection of Christ. 1 Pet 1:3

Figure this one out heretic.

On the day of Pentecost, Acts chapter 2. Over 8,000 Jews heard Peters Gospel and were saved, Acts 2:41 also Acts 4:4. Some of those that were saved had participated in the crucifixion of Jesus, Acts 2:36. It is the preaching of the Gospel that brings people to Christ, simply because the Gospel is "The power of God unto salvation" Romans 1:16. Which all goes to prove that, "Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God" (which is the Gospel) Romans 10:17.

 

[Samie]

Figure this one out heretic.

On the day of Pentecost, Acts chapter 2. Over 8,000 Jews heard Peters Gospel and were saved, Acts 2:41 also Acts 4:4. Some of those that were saved had participated in the crucifixion of Jesus, Acts 2:36. It is the preaching of the Gospel that brings people to Christ, simply because the Gospel is "The power of God unto salvation" Romans 1:16. Which all goes to prove that, "Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God" (which is the Gospel) Romans 10:17.

You keep on teaching heresy, Pate. The verses you paraded do not say what you want them to say.

Again:

1. By teaching that man can do SOMETHING - they can hear and believe - while yet apart from Christ, you teach heresy because Christ taught that apart from Him man can do NOTHING. John 15:5

2. By teaching that unless man first hears and believes he cannot be born again, you teach heresy because Scriptures say it was God Who caused us to be born again through the resurrection of Christ. 1 Pet 1:3

Do you really want to keep on teaching heresy, Pate?

 

[Robert Pate]

You keep on teaching heresy, Pate. The verses you paraded do not say what you want them to say.

Again:

1. By teaching that man can do SOMETHING - they can hear and believe - while yet apart from Christ, you teach heresy because Christ taught that apart from Him man can do NOTHING. John 15:5

2. By teaching that unless man first hears and believes he cannot be born again, you teach heresy because Scriptures say it was God Who caused us to be born again through the resurrection of Christ. 1 Pet 1:3

Do you really want to keep on teaching heresy, Pate?

John 15:5 is about those who are already Christians and are being led by the Holy Spirit. Without the leading of the Spirit we can do nothing.

You are a typical heretic that believes scripture contradicts scripture. There is nothing wrong with the Bible, but there is plenty wrong with your doctrine.

You were not able to comment on what happened on the day of Pentecost because you can't. You are all over the Bible trying to prove your doctrine which you can't.