The Myth of saying that Jesus Christ died for all men without exception !
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beloved57
Well-known member
Shall be saved by His Life !
Rom 5:10
10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.
Another reason why it is a myth to say that Christ died for all without exception, is because all He died for shall be saved by His Life..
And we know that all without exception shall be saved. For many shall perish in their sins.
What many in man made religion do not understand about the Work of Christ, that it is also Christ responsibility as Saviour of God's People, that what He did on the cross is applied to all He died to save, and that's why its stated after His resurrection that He went to appear before God for us Heb 9:24
24 For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us:
The us here are the elect of God, The many sons He brings to Glory, the seed of Abraham, the children God gave Him, partakers of the Heavenly calling.
Now a major reason for this [His appearing for us], is that as part of His Saving Purpose, He is to make intercession [for application] for all those He died. The Lord Jesus Christ intercessory work is vital for the applying of all His saving benefits to God's elect. There is an efficacy in His intercession, this is True because of His Merit and therefore shall prevail with God.
The Holy Spirit is vital in answering the call here, and is the Gift that the Father gave to the Son for His cross work Acts 2:33
33Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.
And because we shall saved by His Life, The Holy Spirit communicates to all of God's elect, those Christ died for, the Life we have in Christ as He is our risen Head and Mediator, Hence as it is written, the Gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord, and the meritorious ground whereby the Spirit imparts life to dead elect sinners is the work or cross of Christ...
All men without exception do not receive this life, because Christ did not die for them who do not receive it.
Rom 5:10
10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.
Another reason why it is a myth to say that Christ died for all without exception, is because all He died for shall be saved by His Life..
And we know that all without exception shall be saved. For many shall perish in their sins.
What many in man made religion do not understand about the Work of Christ, that it is also Christ responsibility as Saviour of God's People, that what He did on the cross is applied to all He died to save, and that's why its stated after His resurrection that He went to appear before God for us Heb 9:24
24 For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us:
The us here are the elect of God, The many sons He brings to Glory, the seed of Abraham, the children God gave Him, partakers of the Heavenly calling.
Now a major reason for this [His appearing for us], is that as part of His Saving Purpose, He is to make intercession [for application] for all those He died. The Lord Jesus Christ intercessory work is vital for the applying of all His saving benefits to God's elect. There is an efficacy in His intercession, this is True because of His Merit and therefore shall prevail with God.
The Holy Spirit is vital in answering the call here, and is the Gift that the Father gave to the Son for His cross work Acts 2:33
33Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.
And because we shall saved by His Life, The Holy Spirit communicates to all of God's elect, those Christ died for, the Life we have in Christ as He is our risen Head and Mediator, Hence as it is written, the Gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord, and the meritorious ground whereby the Spirit imparts life to dead elect sinners is the work or cross of Christ...
All men without exception do not receive this life, because Christ did not die for them who do not receive it.
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beloved57
Well-known member
Shall be made righteous !
Rom 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
This is a most blessed Truth of the Gospel, and if understood properly gives us proof that Christ death could not have been for all men without exception. Now its important to make this known, that all of the many that Christ by His obedience [death Phil 2:8] shall [promise] be made righteous.
The greek word for righteous is kathistēmi:
to set, place, put
a) to set one over a thing (in charge of it)
b) to appoint one to administer an office
c) to set down as, constitute, to declare, show to be
d) to constitute, to render, make, cause to be
e) to conduct or bring to a certain place
f) to show or exhibit one's self
1) come forward as
In this statement of shall be made righteous we have Two blessed Truths #1 The Many shall be declared righteous and they shall be shown to be righteous. That is they will be caused to be righteous. This is both legally and subjectively.
All those who are Legally declared righteous objectively by the obedience of ONE, shall also be caused to be righteous [subjectively] so subjective righteousness is the consequence of objective and legal righteousness.
Paul is stating that all for whom Christ died for , which was His One obedience unto death, will be made experientially or subjectively righteous, just as by the one man's disobedience [adam] the many were legally made sinners [before they were born] and we are made experientially subjectively sinners, there is just no way around the meaning of this contrast in vs 19. Now the only way to become subjectively righteous is by the New Birth, just as becoming subjectively sinful is by natural birth, the new birth is being born of the Spirit, so in essence what paul is saying here in Rom 5:19, is that Christ obedience unto death, for the many He represented, ensures their New Birth by the Spirit see Titus 3:5; Jn 3:3-8. This aspect of being made righteous is the commencing of our experiential sanctification, that is sanctification of the Spirit as in 2 Thess2:13
13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
For this sanctification is the process begun of being made experientially righteous Just as stated in Rom 5:19
So if one never becomes experientially righteous, then Christ obedience unto death was not for them..
Rom 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
This is a most blessed Truth of the Gospel, and if understood properly gives us proof that Christ death could not have been for all men without exception. Now its important to make this known, that all of the many that Christ by His obedience [death Phil 2:8] shall [promise] be made righteous.
The greek word for righteous is kathistēmi:
to set, place, put
a) to set one over a thing (in charge of it)
b) to appoint one to administer an office
c) to set down as, constitute, to declare, show to be
d) to constitute, to render, make, cause to be
e) to conduct or bring to a certain place
f) to show or exhibit one's self
1) come forward as
In this statement of shall be made righteous we have Two blessed Truths #1 The Many shall be declared righteous and they shall be shown to be righteous. That is they will be caused to be righteous. This is both legally and subjectively.
All those who are Legally declared righteous objectively by the obedience of ONE, shall also be caused to be righteous [subjectively] so subjective righteousness is the consequence of objective and legal righteousness.
Paul is stating that all for whom Christ died for , which was His One obedience unto death, will be made experientially or subjectively righteous, just as by the one man's disobedience [adam] the many were legally made sinners [before they were born] and we are made experientially subjectively sinners, there is just no way around the meaning of this contrast in vs 19. Now the only way to become subjectively righteous is by the New Birth, just as becoming subjectively sinful is by natural birth, the new birth is being born of the Spirit, so in essence what paul is saying here in Rom 5:19, is that Christ obedience unto death, for the many He represented, ensures their New Birth by the Spirit see Titus 3:5; Jn 3:3-8. This aspect of being made righteous is the commencing of our experiential sanctification, that is sanctification of the Spirit as in 2 Thess2:13
13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
For this sanctification is the process begun of being made experientially righteous Just as stated in Rom 5:19
So if one never becomes experientially righteous, then Christ obedience unto death was not for them..
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coulter4president
New member
what the devil are you talking about??
anyone who chooses can be one of His sheep!!!
anyone who chooses can be one of His sheep!!!
beloved57
Well-known member
More on Shall be made righteous !
Rom 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
1 Cor 15:22
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
Romans 5:19b can very well read so by the obedience of one shall many be made alive !
Even though in entirely different context, these scriptures teach the same principle of Truth, how the action of One as a Representative Head produced consequences and effects for whoever that one was a Representative Head; And so Just as Adam's disobedience effected sinnership and death, even so, Christ obedience for those He represented [His Church] effected righteousness and Life, hence Christ people are made alive to righteousness.
Thats why it says in Rom 5 18b
even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
Life here is not a legal term but a principle, its the greek word zoe and means:
life
a) the state of one who is possessed of vitality or is animate
b) every living soul
2) life
Its that spiritual life that Christ as the bread of Life gives to the elect world, the Church jn 6:33
33 For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.
Remember, in the OT what world did God give the bread from Heaven to ? Was it not just to His Chosen world of Israel, which was a type of His Church, His called out ones ?
So all those for whom Christ was a Head to, whom He represented, by His obedience [death] they shall be made alive, that is receive from Him Justification unto life..
They shall be made alive unto righteousness as per Rom 6:13
Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
Thats because they were made alive by Christ..
Rom 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
1 Cor 15:22
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
Romans 5:19b can very well read so by the obedience of one shall many be made alive !
Even though in entirely different context, these scriptures teach the same principle of Truth, how the action of One as a Representative Head produced consequences and effects for whoever that one was a Representative Head; And so Just as Adam's disobedience effected sinnership and death, even so, Christ obedience for those He represented [His Church] effected righteousness and Life, hence Christ people are made alive to righteousness.
Thats why it says in Rom 5 18b
even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
Life here is not a legal term but a principle, its the greek word zoe and means:
life
a) the state of one who is possessed of vitality or is animate
b) every living soul
2) life
Its that spiritual life that Christ as the bread of Life gives to the elect world, the Church jn 6:33
33 For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.
Remember, in the OT what world did God give the bread from Heaven to ? Was it not just to His Chosen world of Israel, which was a type of His Church, His called out ones ?
So all those for whom Christ was a Head to, whom He represented, by His obedience [death] they shall be made alive, that is receive from Him Justification unto life..
They shall be made alive unto righteousness as per Rom 6:13
Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
Thats because they were made alive by Christ..
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coulter4president
New member
I've read the entire Bible and HEARD the Bible several times over during (frequent) Mass
you are the one deceived
you dont believe the Word of God that says that God is not willing that ANY should perish but that ALL [find Him]
coulter4president
New member
Calvin lived some 1600 yrs after Christ ascended..
you follow a MAN, not Jesus Christ (God)
coulter4president
New member
God is not willing that ANY should perish but that ALL [find Him]
beloved57
Well-known member
Sure, not willing that any of His elect perish, and they wont..
beloved57
Well-known member
Calling the word of God calvin is not going to help you in rejecting the Truth..
patricius79
New member
Calvin was a heretic
Titus 2:11
11
2 For the grace of God has appeared, saving all
12
and training us to reject godless ways and worldly desires and to live temperately, justly, and devoutly in this age,
1 Jn 2:2
Titus 2:11
11
2 For the grace of God has appeared, saving all
12
and training us to reject godless ways and worldly desires and to live temperately, justly, and devoutly in this age,
1 Jn 2:2
Contradiction in terms, how could the elect perish?
beloved57
Well-known member
They cant, God is not willing..
Calvinism must insert words and concepts that are not in the original to retain a flawed view. Take it at face value and change your view.
For God so loved the elect vs unregenerate world?!
Calvinism limits the love of God and makes His justice arbitrary. Decretal, deterministic views ARE UNBIBLICAL.
And you don't? Shall I put up a bunch of your quotes now? I don't need to...everybody knows you are a con man.
Ardima
New member
Free-will creates a god who cannot save all.
Predestination creates a god who will not save all.
Universal reconciliation presents the God who can and will save all as the Bible teaches. (1st Timothy 4:10); (2nd Corinthians 5:19); (1st Corinthians 15:22); (Ephesians 1:10); (Colossians 1:20) just to name a few.
Predestination creates a god who will not save all.
Universal reconciliation presents the God who can and will save all as the Bible teaches. (1st Timothy 4:10); (2nd Corinthians 5:19); (1st Corinthians 15:22); (Ephesians 1:10); (Colossians 1:20) just to name a few.
I do not change the Johannine use of 'world' (kosmos) in the most famous Bible verse in the world by adding 'elite elect'. A comment or interpretation of a verse is NOT adding words to it or changing meaning, necessarily.
Feel free to quote my comments on specific verses so I can own or disown my specific past interpretations. I will clarify or qualify. Do not just post generic comments about my induction/deduction of theology based on biblical verses that believers may differ on (I don't have a Calvinistic paradigm, so their proof texting of individual vs corporate election will differ from me).
So, I am all ears. Quote my exegesis of specific verses and show where I distort the text by adding words (like JWs do to negate the Deity of Christ by adding 'other' 6x in Colossians where the underlying Greek does not have it).
KJV adds words as does every other version because going from Greek to English is not a one-to-one issue due to different grammar, syntax, etc.
Love is not divorced from holiness/justice.
God cannot unconditionally save all men without compromising His responsibility as a perfect Moral Governor.
The biblical balance is that God has made perfect provision for all men to be saved (not just limited atonement for elect only; TULIP is wrong), yet not all men will receive His free gift by responding to His reasonable conditions (includes faith to receive Him).
Jesus is willing, but men are not willing (Lk. 7:30; Matthew 23:37).
There is no love or relationship without free will. Free will is self-evident, so Calvinism is off the table.
Universalism is heretical and not a valid solution. It pits His love against His holiness/justice. Mercy can only be wisely extended under certain conditions (Satan will be in the lake of fire, not reconciled). Justice is reasonable for the impenitent. Those who reject Christ are also seen in the lake of fire where both are tormented day and night forever and ever.
So, reject Calvinism and universalism to remain biblical (Open Theism or Arminianism is a cogent alternative that upholds holiness and love).