Do you not think that believers possessed eternal life prior to the Cross?
:chuckle:
At the risk of setting off one so called "TOL club MAD" member, or another (in general) those among "their number...not wise" in that they so easily take issue with having a thing pointed out to them, though that is all they themselves do all day to anyone not of their so called "number"
:
What's your take on the following; Jerry?
I know you have gone into it before: but I forget; as it has been a long time since you last voiced your view on it.
John 8:28 Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things. 8:29 And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him. 8:30 As he spake these words, many believed on him. 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. 8:33 They answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how sayest thou, Ye shall be made free? 8:34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin. 8:35 And the servant abideth not in the house for ever: but the Son abideth ever. 8:36 If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.
For it appears to be connected to their New Covenant promise of the Spirit yet future from John's narrative, as the Lord has not yet died: at that point; and the Spirit has not yet been given.
In other words, they were still under the Law in Matthew thru John.
Thus, their need to "continue in my word...until the time of reformation..."
Hebrews 9:9 Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience; 9:10 Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation. 9:11 But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building; 9:12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
Thus, He was still reminding them of things in line with that; such as this...
Matthew 8:1 When he was come down from the mountain, great multitudes followed him. 8:2 And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean. 8:3 And Jesus put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, I will; be thou clean. And immediately his leprosy was cleansed. 8:4 And Jesus saith unto him, See thou tell no man; but go thy way, shew thyself to the priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a testimony unto them.
This here...
Leviticus 14:2 This shall be the law of the leper in the day of his cleansing: He shall be brought unto the priest: 14:3 And the priest shall go forth out of the camp; and the priest shall look, and, behold, if the plague of leprosy be healed in the leper; 14:4 Then shall the priest command to take for him that is to be cleansed two birds alive and clean, and cedar wood, and scarlet, and hyssop: 14:5 And the priest shall command that one of the birds be killed in an earthen vessel over running water: 14:6 As for the living bird, he shall take it, and the cedar wood, and the scarlet, and the hyssop, and shall dip them and the living bird in the blood of the bird that was killed over the running water: 14:7 And he shall sprinkle upon him that is to be cleansed from the leprosy seven times, and shall pronounce him clean, and shall let the living bird loose into the open field. 14:8 And he that is to be cleansed shall wash his clothes, and shave off all his hair, and wash himself in water, that he may be clean: and after that he shall come into the camp, and shall tarry abroad out of his tent seven days. 14:9 But it shall be on the seventh day, that he shall shave all his hair off his head and his beard and his eyebrows, even all his hair he shall shave off: and he shall wash his clothes, also he shall wash his flesh in water, and he shall be clean. 14:10 And on the eighth day he shall take two he lambs without blemish, and one ewe lamb of the first year without blemish, and three tenth deals of fine flour for a meat offering, mingled with oil, and one log of oil. 14:11 And the priest that maketh him clean shall present the man that is to be made clean, and those things, before the LORD, at the door of the tabernacle of the congregation:
And so on.
Until this...
Hebrews 9:15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death,
for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance. 9:16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator. 9:17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.
Meaning that the eternal life those passages in John are promising is still connected: at that point - still under the Law - with the passing over of their sins (definition of "remission" of sins, under the Law, or first testament) through the forebearance of God...
This here..
Romans 3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness
for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God; 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
Your thoughts?
And thanks...
