ECT The Holy Con Artists

[Totton Linnet]

The Gospel provides a different wealth from worldly riches; as a matter of fact, there is a general call to give what you have to help others-if anything, there is giving rather than receiving. That's the general problem with this type of theology: the poor are told that they don't believe hard enough and that's why they're poor. That's awful.

I am not saying that God does not provide, but I'm certainly not going to say that He provides to all of us at the same level.

No HERE is the real problem...YOU, your half a doctrine.

Give give give

But the bible doesn't SAY give give give

Paul said about giving "but this I say he who soweth sparingly shall also reap sparingly and he who soweth abundantly shall also reap abundantly.

Every man according as he purposeth in his heart so let him give not grudgingly or of necessity for God loveth the cheerful giver.

And He is able to make all grace BOUND toward you

that YE

always having sufficiency in ALL THINGS may abound to every good work

As it is written He hath dispersed abroad He hath given to the poor His righteousness remaineth forever

Now He that ministereth seed to the sower both minister bread to the eater and multiply your seed sown and increase the fruits of your righreousness

Being enrich with all bountifulness which causeth through us thanksgiving to God.

This is the same doctrine of the Lord Jesus who said GIVE and it shall be given you again, good measure, pressed down and running over shall men give into your bosom. For with the measure you give shall it be meted unto you again.

Prreach the WHOLE word , not half only. Preach the duty and preach the blessing also.

It is the devil who for CENTURIES has been quoting half the scriptures...he doesn't want you to read this.

It's not the poor who are unbelieving it is the preachers

 

[Angel4Truth]

You sure like to mix things up, like too many Bible mashers. When the kingdom comes, prosperity will abound and sin will not be allowed. But in the dispensation of the grace of God prosperity does not necessarily indicate the state of the wealthy.

Well said.

Revelation 3:17 'Because you say, "I am rich, and have become wealthy, and have need of nothing," and you do not know that you are wretched and miserable and poor and blind and naked

 

[Totton Linnet]

You sure like to mix things up, like too many Bible mashers. When the kingdom comes, prosperity will abound and sin will not be allowed. But in the dispensation of the grace of God prosperity does not necessarily indicate the state of the wealthy.

We's suppose to be despoiling the devil of his usurped wealth...it doesn't belong to him

He's a thief, he's a liar...he wants the world's wealth to murder.

I agree we won't see the victory until Jesus comes but we's suppose to be working towards that....in fact we have in a measure...a very small measure

 

[Totton Linnet]

Well said.

Revelation 3:17 'Because you say, "I am rich, and have become wealthy, and have need of nothing," and you do not know that you are wretched and miserable and poor and blind and naked

YOU are become wealthy in comparison to most Asians and Africans.

If there is one thing you can be sure, that church was not a GIVING church, it was not after winning the souls of men, women and children who at present are dragging in the dirt in different parts of the world, living in utter poverty and desolation while the western church has grown fat and sleek.

The devil wants to keep them poor, he is delighted if they starve to death, never hearing the gospel.

 

[Totton Linnet]

Well said.

Revelation 3:17 'Because you say, "I am rich, and have become wealthy, and have need of nothing," and you do not know that you are wretched and miserable and poor and blind and naked

Well said...well said

I defy you in Jesu's name to deny this scripture

Give and shall be given unto you again, good measure, pressed down and running over will men put into your bosom

Go ahead throw it back in God's face

 

[Angel4Truth]

YOU are become wealthy in comparison to most Asians and Africans.

If there is one thing you can be sure, that church was not a GIVING church, it was not after winning the souls of men, women and children who at present are dragging in the dirt in different parts of the world, living in utter poverty and desolation while the western church has grown fat and sleek.

The devil wants to keep them poor, he is delighted if they starve to death, never hearing the gospel.

You miss the point of the scripture, like a lot of name it and claim it preachers do. True wealth is measured by the content of the heart and His Spirit, not what we have materially.

 

[glorydaz]

You miss the point of the scripture, like a lot of name it and claim it preachers do. True wealth is measured by the content of the heart and His Spirit, not what we have materially.

Amen, sister. :thumb:

 

[revpete]

"We must obey the law" is their motto.

They dare not say "We" obey the law therefore you must follow us because they know very well that they don't. But when they say we must obey they are implying that they do.

It is a con trick.

They tried this out in church and they were found out, that is why they are all unchurched. Now they are online where nobody can see their inconsistent lives.

They try to strike fear into people, then they suppose everyone is going to become their little disciples.

Have you the courage to name them?
Pete

 

[Totton Linnet]

You miss the point of the scripture, like a lot of name it and claim it preachers do. True wealth is measured by the content of the heart and His Spirit, not what we have materially.

First I am not a name and claimer, that comes from an entirely different theological outlook to my own.

True wealth is not measured by how much you got in the bank...most opponents of God's abundant provision have a satisfactory bank sheet. [armchair Pauls, they sit in their silken gowns and recount Paul's struggles as a proof, they think, that God wants us poor so that we will be holy]

True wealth is measured by where your real treasure is, if it is in heaven it will never fail, if it is in heaven you won't ever be anxious about what you will eat or what you will drink...what clothes you will wear.

If it is in heaven you will look to put it to heavenly use.

You will KNOW that God will never ask you to GIVE without that He intends to give you back many times more than you gave.

God doesn't owe anybody a dime. Nobody has ever given to God and He did not repay.

 

[Totton Linnet]

Have you the courage to name them?
Pete ��

They are all those who say we must obey the commandments to be saved, or when we are saved to stay saved.

They are easy enough to find.

 

[revpete]

This thread really shows us our hearts, doesn't it? Remember the widow and her two mites? The Lord said she gave more than all who gave of their abundance. The point is that real giving is a sacrifice not just an offering!
Pete

 

[Totton Linnet]

This thread really shows us our hearts, doesn't it? Remember the widow and her two mites? The Lord said she gave more than all who gave of their abundance. The point is that real giving is a sacrifice not just an offering!
Pete ��

This thread was never about money...it got changed to being about money.

Jesus did notice that widow, He was prolly the only one who did.

She was old, so she had survived, somebody must have been looking out for her.

The temple and those who ministered in it had long, long ceased to be an instrument of blessing or outreach, she was giving into something that so incurred God's anger that He was about to totally destroy it, raze it to the ground.

Jesus contrasted her giving to the general giving of others, it was not very generous...pretty much like Christians today. Christians today do not generally give like that widow gave, they give a small portion out of their abundance.

They don't give out of penury....have you have ever given your last dollar? I have on at least 3 occasions I can think of.

But that widow is a reflection of the spiritual stupor into which Israel had sunk...not her giving, but her giving in comparison to other people.

In times of spiritual vigour and revival people dig deep and GIVE big time...when God's Holy Spirit is abroad, like at Pentecost when people sold land and property and brought the proceeds thereof and laid it at the apostle's feet.

That was holy

 

[Totton Linnet]

Do you really want to know what God thinks about money? YOUR money?

"Now He that ministereth seed to the sower and bread to the eater and MULTIPLY your seed sown and INCREASE the fruit of your righteousness

Being enriched in every thing to all BOUNTIFULNESS which causeth through us thanksgiving unto God."

Give and SHALL be given unto you again....you know it

The key to receiving is to give....it is the giving that people don't like. And if people are poor it is difficult to give, but if you BELIEVED these scriptures, if the preachers PREACHED these doctrines, people could find a way out of their poverty.

 

[Totton Linnet]

I am not saying there is not a snag and snare to money, BEWARE the snag and snare.

But there is a snag and snare to poverty too....

 

[revpete]

I am not saying there is not a snag and snare to money, BEWARE the snag and snare.

But there is a snag and snare to poverty too....

There is indeed a snare to riches as we are warned:

1 Timothy: 6. 9. But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition.

A snare to poverty? Be careful, many brothers and sisters are born into poverty through no fault of their own. True wealth is as we are taught:

James: 2. 5. Hearken, my beloved brethren, Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him?

Pete

 

[JonahofAkron]

You miss the point of the scripture, like a lot of name it and claim it preachers do. True wealth is measured by the content of the heart and His Spirit, not what we have materially.

Agreed.

Totton, I don't disagree that the leaders of these congregations will certainly be held more accountable,but it will be for the nonsense they teach that you cling to that says we have to be wealthy. Taking care of needs and having wealth like the 1% of the world are very different things.

 

[Totton Linnet]

There is indeed a snare to riches as we are warned:

1 Timothy: 6. 9. But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition.

A snare to poverty? Be careful, many brothers and sisters are born into poverty through no fault of their own. True wealth is as we are taught:

James: 2. 5. Hearken, my beloved brethren, Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him?

Pete ��

The kingdom of heaven is nigh, are you a heir? when are you going to start drawing on your inheritance? nigh means at hand.

We are all born poor and naked

Listen to me, if riches will lead you into a snare and many foolish and hurtful lusts, and I am in no way down playing that scripture

But if you are drawn into these things because you can afford them...don't you think that you have a problem to begin with? people are snared by those things even though they cain't afford them...what do you think the film industry is all about...it is in their minds, in their imaginations.

Get rid of those things from your mind by the washing of renewal.

turn your desiring into a new and godly direction like soul winning...you need money to win souls, sure you need an awful lot more than money but you do need money.

Money is an enabler...it enables you to be the person you desire to be, it takes the limitations of your life...for good or for evil

I think one BIG mistake is to regard God's promises as personal to us as individuals when He promises to "meet ALL your needs according to His riches in Christ Jesus" Paul said that in regard to givinf and receiving as a partnership between himself and the churches who did help fund him.

It is not that YOU personally will have a whacking great bank balance but that the assembly will always have money PLENTY money for it needs and to look after the poor.

What about folks led into crime and prostitution through poverty....you think people are holy because they are poor? don't you know most of the crime is in poor districts?

Poverty will not make you sin, sin will make you sin....but if the sin is there poverty will act as the spur.

 

[Totton Linnet]

Agreed.

Totton, I don't disagree that the leaders of these congregations will certainly be held more accountable,but it will be for the nonsense they teach that you cling to that says we have to be wealthy. Taking care of needs and having wealth like the 1% of the world are very different things.

I don't belong to those churches, Angel didn't answer, I defy YOU like I defied her to deny the words of Jesus Christ the Son of God

"Give and it shall be given you again, good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over will men give into your bosom. For with the measure you mete so shall it be meted unto you again."

YOU are talking about being wealthy...I am talking about giving, do you understand?

That 1% have so much of the world's wealth because YOU allow them to have it. If Christians had half a heart to winning souls and SOLVING the poverty of Asia and Africa...they would get to work at despoiling the devil's crowd of their usurped wealth in the name of Jesus Christ and making His kingdom a reality.

 

[Totton Linnet]

Agreed.

Totton, I don't disagree that the leaders of these congregations will certainly be held more accountable,but it will be for the nonsense they teach that you cling to that says we have to be wealthy. Taking care of needs and having wealth like the 1% of the world are very different things.

You don't have to be wealthy, you can stay stinky poor if'n that is what you want.....but if you want to do something for Christ, sooner or later you are going to come up against need and how to answer that need.

And provision is not always money. Did you ever see Jesus not having something He needed to hand when He needed it?

 

[revpete]

The kingdom of heaven is nigh, are you a heir? when are you going to start drawing on your inheritance? nigh means at hand.

We are all born poor and naked

Listen to me, if riches will lead you into a snare and many foolish and hurtful lusts, and I am in no way down playing that scripture

But if you are drawn into these things because you can afford them...don't you think that you have a problem to begin with? people are snared by those things even though they cain't afford them...what do you think the film industry is all about...it is in their minds, in their imaginations.

Get rid of those things from your mind by the washing of renewal.

turn your desiring into a new and godly direction like soul winning...you need money to win souls, sure you need an awful lot more than money but you do need money.

Money is an enabler...it enables you to be the person you desire to be, it takes the limitations of your life...for good or for evil

I think one BIG mistake is to regard God's promises as personal to us as individuals when He promises to "meet ALL your needs according to His riches in Christ Jesus" Paul said that in regard to givinf and receiving as a partnership between himself and the churches who did help fund him.

It is not that YOU personally will have a whacking great bank balance but that the assembly will always have money PLENTY money for it needs and to look after the poor.

What about folks led into crime and prostitution through poverty....you think people are holy because they are poor? don't you know most of the crime is in poor districts?

Poverty will not make you sin, sin will make you sin....but if the sin is there poverty will act as the spur.

Do not presume to make assumptions about me when you know nothing about me as I know nothing about you only what you post.

You do not need money to win souls, you need the enabling power and presence of The Holy Spirit! I understand what you say but the way you state your case can be easily misunderstood and make you sound like a prosperity teacher.

Pete