step by step by step

[pentatonic145]

How is a sinner ever supposed to repent if he never "feels like crap" about his rebellion against God?

Please - You are NOT the Holy Spirit - it is not your job to convict people of sins. The Father sent the Holy Ghost into the world to convict the world of sin. That's not your job.

You think you're bringing people to Christ by putting them down? Please. You are confirming the stereotype that these non-Chrisitians have: Christians are right-wing extreme fanatics who are self-righteous and are always pointing their fingers and looking down their noses at us.

What is the fruit of the harsh words you have spoken at TOL? Is anyone repenting? Is anyone getting saved? Your heart is not right, sir. You do not have God's interests in mind. You - and a bunch of other people at this forum, both Christian and non-Christian - are chiefly concerned with exhibiting your own intelligence and moral superiority and making others feel bad - NOT so that they will be granted godly sorrow unto repentance, but because it makes YOU feel better about yourself.

This is obvious to anyone who reads your posts.

Jesus ministered to the physical needs of the people. No - he did not pull any punches when it came to telling people about sin and hell, and neither do I. But he also exhibited his compassion to people.

IT IS GOD'S KINDNESS THAT LEADS PEOPLE TO REPENTANCE!!!

Is that kindness evidenced in your words, your actions?

I listened to the Australian guy. I agree with everything he said and the way he said it. I DON"T agree with you or Bob that homosexuals deserve the death penalty just for having gay sex. Yeah - it's disgusting, but so are my sins and yours, sir. Thank God for his mercy!

I'm not worried about the people you offend, Jefferson. God is not going to let you interfere with His plan of salvation for their lives. But keep treating those who Christ died for on the cross with contempt, and maybe one day you'll find yourself being "beaten with many blows" in the next life.

 

[Jefferson]

Please - You are NOT the Holy Spirit - it is not your job to convict people of sins. The Father sent the Holy Ghost into the world to convict the world of sin. That's not your job.

But the Holy Spirit uses our words to convict people of sin.

You think you're bringing people to Christ by putting them down? Please. You are confirming the stereotype that these non-Chrisitians have: Christians are right-wing extreme fanatics who are self-righteous and are always pointing their fingers and looking down their noses at us.

Which is supposedly a bad reflection on you. And that's your main concern isn't it? Public acceptance.

IT IS GOD'S KINDNESS THAT LEADS PEOPLE TO REPENTANCE!!!

GAL. 3:24 says, "Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ." The law convicts people of sin. It is a central part of gospel preaching to show people they have broken God's law.

I listened to the Australian guy. I agree with everything he said and the way he said it.

Then you agree with me because that guy's style is the model I use when I talk to people about Christ.

I DON"T agree with you or Bob that homosexuals deserve the death penalty just for having gay sex.

Was God immoral for commanding homosexuals be put to death in the Old Testament? If not, why not? If you think God was moral for commanding that, please explain why you think it was so moral.

 

[allsmiles]

quick question: if homosexuals are hellbound unless they repent, why don't you sit back and let them gain their just reward? why wouldn't you let your god administer the punishment? why are you trying to fight his battles for him?

 

[kmoney]

quick question: if homosexuals are hellbound unless they repent, why don't you sit back and let them gain their just reward? why wouldn't you let your god administer the punishment? why are you trying to fight his battles for him?

Because we are called to go to sinners. We aren't trying to "fight his battles", it is an attempt to save them. It goes anyone, not just homosexuals.

 

[allsmiles]

Because we are called to go to sinners. We aren't trying to "fight his battles", it is an attempt to save them. It goes anyone, not just homosexuals.

i understand K$, but i'm more talking about pro-actively seeking their destruction.

seems like that's God's department, not theirs.

 

[kmoney]

i understand K$, but i'm more talking about pro-actively seeking their destruction.

seems like that's God's department, not theirs.

Well I don't want to speak for them but....

I don't think it is "seeking their destruction" as much as it is attempting to deter people from that lifestyle and show that it isn't natural. Obviously homosexuals are executed in their plan, but I honestly don't believe it is simply because they want to see their destruction. It is to save people from going down the same path.

 

[allsmiles]

fair enough.

 

[kmoney]

fair enough.

Would you apply the same logic to other capital crimes? In other words, do you think Christians should be completely against all capital punishment, because it is doing God's work for Him? Or are you limiting it to homosexuals.....

 

[allsmiles]

Would you apply the same logic to other capital crimes? In other words, do you think Christians should be completely against all capital punishment, because it is doing God's work for Him? Or are you limiting it to homosexuals.....

i don't have a problem with capital punishment being used to deter damaging crimes, but i've never been able to understand how homosexuality is on the same level as murder. seems to be taking things too far.

 

[kmoney]

i don't have a problem with capital punishment being used to deter damaging crimes, but i've never been able to understand how homosexuality is on the same level as murder. seems to be taking things too far.

They are just following what God commanded of the Israelites.....

 

[kmoney]

But the Holy Spirit uses our words to convict people of sin.

Which is supposedly a bad reflection on you. And that's your main concern isn't it? Public acceptance.

GAL. 3:24 says, "Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ." The law convicts people of sin. It is a central part of gospel preaching to show people they have broken God's law.

Then you agree with me because that guy's style is the model I use when I talk to people about Christ.

Was God immoral for commanding homosexuals be put to death in the Old Testament? If not, why not? If you think God was moral for commanding that, please explain why you think it was so moral.

hey Jefferson,

Just wanted to post this verse because I think this is where pentatonic145 was getting the kindness and repentance connection:

Rom 2:4 Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?​

 

[allsmiles]

They are just following what God commanded of the Israelites.....

ah yes... you know, i'm looking at a map and Israel is a hell of a distance from here... and those commands were written when? :think:

can you blame me for thinking that perhaps that wasn't written for 21st century Americans?

 

[kmoney]

ah yes... you know, i'm looking at a map and Israel is a hell of a distance from here... and those commands were written when? :think:

can you blame me for thinking that perhaps that wasn't written for 21st century Americans?

I can blame you for whatever I want! :nananana:

So, are you suggesting that it may be an outdated law?? :think:

 

[allsmiles]

I can blame you for whatever I want! :nananana:

So, are you suggesting that it may be an outdated law?? :think:

uh... what do you think? how old is it? who wrote it? who was it written for?

 

[pentatonic145]

And here's a few more for you Jeff:

Psalm 103:8-11
The LORD is compassionate and gracious, slow to anger, abounding in love.
He will not always accuse, nor will he harbor his anger forever;
he does not treat us as our sins deserve or repay us according to our iniquities.

Isaiah 42:3
A bruised reed he will not break, and a smoldering wick he will not snuff out. In faithfulness he will bring forth justice;

What's that scripture all about? Any "bruised reeds" or "smoldering wicks" ever visit this forum? When they do, how do you treat them?

You can take your "public acceptance" and cram it. I want all to be saved and come to repentance. Y'know, kind of like God does? Try thinking about God's will - does he want Jefferson to look like a really righteous and super-spiritual guy, or does he want people to see the love of Christ at work in those who claim him, that perhaps they might be saved?

Let the Holy Ghost do his own job. You are miserable at it. God forbid anyone mistake you for a true believer in Christ - you drag His name through the mud with your bullcrap attitude.

 

[Jefferson]

And here's a few more for you Jeff:

I will gladly respond to any and all verses you can throw at me. But first I need you to stop cowardly running from 7 of my questions and points to you. Below are the 7 I am still waiting for you to respond to. Most of them are from my post # 80 which was almost entirely ignored by you:

1.) You said:

I didn't say I think homosexual behavior should be legal - it should be illegal.

My unanswered question: Based on what verse?

2.) You said:

But I don't condone giving the death penalty to people caught in homosexual sin, or other sexual sins

My unanswered question: Based on what verse?

3.) You said:

(except maybe pedophelia or rape).

My unanswered question: Based on what verse?

4.) You said:

I'll tell you something about homosexuals: Their sins are no worse than my own sins

My unanswered response: The Bible says not all sins are equal: Matthew 11:21-22 says, "Woe unto thee, Chorazin! woe unto thee, Bethsaida! for if the mighty works, which were done in you, had been done in Tyre and Sidon, they would have repented long ago in sackcloth and ashes. But I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for Tyre and Sidon at the day of judgment, than for you.

Luke 12:47,48 says, "And that servant who knew his lord's will and did not prepare, nor did according to His will, shall be beaten with many stripes. But he not knowing, and doing things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes."

And . . .

John 19:11 says, "Jesus answered, You could have no authority against Me unless it were given to you from above. Therefore he who delivered Me to you has the greater sin."

5.) This is also how God looks at sinners: Psalm 5:5 The foolish shall not stand in Your sight. You hate all doers of iniquity.

Psalm 5:6 Thou shalt destroy them that speak leasing: the LORD will abhor the bloody and deceitful man.

Psalm 11:5 Jehovah tries the righteous; but His soul hates the wicked and the one who loves violence.

Hosea 9:15 All their wickedness is in Gilgal, for there I hated them. I will drive them out of My house for the wickedness of their doings. I will love them no more; all their rulers are revolters.

Zechariah 11:8 I also cut off three shepherds in one month. And My soul loathed them, and their soul also detested Me.

Leviticus 20:23 And you shall not walk in the ways of the nation which I cast out before you. For they committed all these things, and therefore I loathed them.

Proverbs 16-19 These six things the LORD hates, yes, seven are an abomination to Him: a proud look, a lying tongue, hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked plans, feet that are swift in running to evil, a false witness who speaks lies, and one who sows discord among the brethren.

6.) What does it mean to let our conversation be seasoned with salt?
The verse says, "Let your speech always be with grace, seasoned with salt" In other words grace and salt are 2 very different things. The verse should not be interpreted as "let your speech be with grace, seasoned with even more grace." Hardly. Salt stings when it is put on an open wound. It also spices up things.

7.) Was God immoral for commanding homosexuals be put to death in the Old Testament? If not, why not? If you think God was moral for commanding that, please explain why you think it was so moral.