Shooting at SC Church During Bible Study - Suspect still at large

rainee

New member
You can try to justify treason all you like. Doesn't change the facts.
G, sigh
Are you not a horses patootie that probably enjoys getting a rise out of overly emotional people like me with the simplest rudest one line sentences of all history?

And I think you should invest more than one line and say something you believe...
Instead of just knocking around other people's sharing.
 

bybee

New member
G, sigh
Are you not a horses patootie that probably enjoys getting a rise out of overly emotional people like me with the simplest rudest one line sentences of all history?

I'd call him a misogynistic pain in the "horse's patootie".
He is master of one-liners! Grand exalted Poohbah of putdowns!
Most High Defender of Liberal Self-defined Righteousness!
Awarded a medal of honor for defending the Self-defined Rightness of Political Correctness!
I mean, how can we begin to show our appreciation for such a celebrity in our midst?
I must stifle myself!
 

TomO

Get used to it.
Hall of Fame
May I ask how you look at this?

I don't mean to be obtuse, but what exactly? It's just that the sentence structure makes it hard for me to zero in and I don't want to write a paragraph about something when you were asking about something else. :eek:
 

Granite

New member
Hall of Fame
G, sigh
Are you not a horses patootie that probably enjoys getting a rise out of overly emotional people like me with the simplest rudest one line sentences of all history?

And I think you should invest more than one line and say something you believe...
Instead of just knocking around other people's sharing.

Would you like a side of hyperbole with your drama queen?:think::eek:
 

rainee

New member
I'd call him a misogynistic pain in the "horse's patootie".
He is master of one-liners! Grand exalted Poohbah of putdowns!
Most High Defender of Liberal Self-defined Righteousness!
Awarded a medal of honor for defending the Self-defined Rightness of Political Correctness!
I mean, how can we begin to show our appreciation for such a celebrity in our midst?
I must stifle myself!

Wow Bybee!
Love that descriptive verbal paintbrush you pulled out! Way to go Lady
 

rainee

New member
I don't mean to be obtuse, but what exactly? It's just that the sentence structure makes it hard for me to zero in and I don't want to write a paragraph about something when you were asking about something else. :eek:

Yes, ahem, well, I started off asking you about the subject of the true cause(s)of the Civil War...and liberals of today being cheesy....but these apparently bloomed into what was going to happen during World War II to Jews, Gypsies, and many others I can't name ...
And somewhere in there the guilt of the popular science of evolution stepped in...

So Tomo just anything you may want to say is going to be great! :embarrassed: :eek:
 

TomO

Get used to it.
Hall of Fame
Yes, ahem, well, I started off asking you about the subject of the true cause(s)of the Civil War...and liberals of today being cheesy....but these apparently bloomed into what was going to happen during World War II to Jews, Gypsies, and many others I can't name ...
And somewhere in there the guilt of the popular science of evolution stepped in...

So Tomo just anything you may want to say is going to be great! :embarrassed: :eek:

Cause?.....Well I suppose you could trace things back to the founders not sufficiently defining their intentions when they jettisoned the Articles of Confederation. Patrick Henry recognized this and it really should have been settled once and for all during the Nullification Crisis but it was just argued about, as usual. :p....Same as it ever was.

Central to the argument of "who started it" is who had the more legitimate claim to Fort Sumter.

The fact remains that for all intents and purposes the Federalists have won the argument. What remains is the legacy of the fight itself...Was it worthwhile?
There is an old standby which I rely on when considering what actions to take on any given circumstance. It's not only the principle which is important but the actual hill you die on is just as important. The secessionists climbed up on a seriously foolish hill. There were more than enough tariff issues (particularly with S. Carolina involved) to make a fight of this but instead they chose to base their new Confederacy on the perceived necessity of slavery.
This could have been lived down since the vast majority of Confederate combatants were merely fighting to protect their homes not the institution of slavery but something else happened. The segregationists chose to use the Battle Flag of the Army Of Northern Virginia as their symbol....Nobody protested this use at the time so I find it kind of disingenuous to deny it now.

The blacks have reason to be offended....I don't blame them at all.


Of course the evils that men do still exist.....A scrap of cloth will not change that no matter what you do with it. However, the sacrifices which the rank and file Confederate soldier suffered to protect their families/land and their independence from a overbearing Federalist philosophy were tarnished and dragged through the mud by their own leaders, and to a lesser extent, by their own decedents.

You cannot champion the cause of liberty by fighting for the right to make men slaves or keep them in subordination.....No matter what your view of eugenics :eek: may be.

I'm not sure I really answered anything here. :plain:
 

IMJerusha

New member
Here I thought the ignominy of slavery was the issue? Flags as symbols are another issue.

Then, respectfully, you thought wrong. The attitude toward the Confederate flag has been all about what it stood/stands for, incorrectly that it stands for black enslavement.

The very idea that one person believes it is right to own another person must be fought with every breath.

No argument there but that's not what the Confederate flag symbolizes. It serves the Liberal agenda to push that, though.
 

bybee

New member
Then, respectfully, you thought wrong. The attitude toward the Confederate flag has been all about what it stood/stands for, incorrectly that it stands for black enslavement.



No argument there but that's not what the Confederate flag symbolizes. It serves the Liberal agenda to push that, though.

When feelings are running high, the bigger person will stand down a bit. I do not rub salt in another's wounds. Wait til things calm down, as they always do, then go about your business.
In other words, out of respect, put the flag away for a time.
At least that is what I would do.
 

Town Heretic

Out of Order
Hall of Fame
No genocidal plan, eh? Wounded Knee?
Acts of atrocity aren't a genocidal plan. There wasn't a "final solution" proposed for Native Americans. Doesn't excuse the numerous atrocities, but it does distinguish them and their motivation from what the Nazis were about.

Do you know who John Chivington was, Town? He was a Union officer, an abolitionist and a Methodist minister and under the American flag of 1864, at Sand Creek, he turned your statement that there was no genocidal plan into utter falsehood and ignorance.
In order, I do and no, he didn't. Which is why you won't show me the documentation and agreement among the heads of government to eradicate the Native American. But enough of this side bar nonsense.

Anyone who calls for and approves the digging up of Forrest and his wife as well as the removal and banning of the Confederate flag
No one has banned a Confederate flag. It's simply and appropriately being removed from seats of government and I've already answered on the remarkable difference between a flag conceived to forward an evil proposition and one that flew over evil acts and the corrections to them.
 

Town Heretic

Out of Order
Hall of Fame
"Understanding" is not a defense.
Right. Not understanding, however, is.

We are talking about a murderer who killed nine unarmed people in a church. Quit muddying the waters.
The process you use for one is the process you use for all. I'm not muddying anything by teaching you something, whether you take the lesson or not.


Circumstances change the judgement, not how we judge.
Does anyone else realize he's just determined to say no? Because what he just wrote was really funny if you do.

We don't change how we judge. We change the outcome...the outcome of what? Our judgment. Or maybe he just doesn't undertand what the word mitigate means. Either way, it's funny.

It's either murder or it's not.
That's right.

Again with the lies? It's not a rush to judgement.
Not event the first lie, but moving beyond your usual, what you either can't or won't get is that rush is a subjective. The problem with you is that you seem more concerned for a quick time line than getting it right. Or you simply don't understand that your sense of it invites mistakes that can't be undone.

Because you say so? Justice says we are not to show mercy.
Because it's rationally inescapable and that's the tradition of justice, the law. It's found in distinguishing between a child and an adult, the insane and the sane.

Justice. We know you do not care.
I don't care about your willful and proud ignorance where the law that controls here is concerned, but I do care about justice...and mercy.
 

Town Heretic

Out of Order
Hall of Fame
In spite of the American flag and a white flag flying over
You're going to have to find some new smoke. As with your "slavery was in the Union too" attempt it fails to account for any other history, meaning as I've noted that same flag that ended slavery and sought justice for the Native American flies over our nation today. We're a work in progress. We failed blacks and minorities in general and women and we've redressed most of that. Because that's how it goes, with men and nations worth keeping around.

This situation with the Confederate flag is a ploy for the purpose of implementing a Liberal agenda.
Not in my house or any number. But if the liberal agenda is to remove a symbol of that South from seats of government then good on them. They're right and those of us outside that camp have been wrong on the point by allowing it and confusing that issue with some vague notion of honoring history and tradition. If you're of the mind there's a larger attempt under way it will depend on a case by case.

On some of those matters, like Memphis and unlike those of my right wing friends who strongly opposed federal intervention in states matters, I don't mean to interfere with local governments reflecting the will of their constituents on what should or shouldn't be the face of their community, though I'd offer an opinion if asked.

And when that Liberal agenda turns against Christians in America
And that's the irrational nature of conspiracist thinking in a nutshell. It spills over into larger and darker conspiracies at the drop of a hat and gets soup all over everything.

what will you have to say about our nation's great principle while you're turning your back on Yeshua much the same way as you've turned your back on Southerners who consider themselves sons and daughters of the Confederacy as well as the Native American?
I don't give a twisted fig about turning my back on people so either willfully ignorant of history that they advance an evil in the name of virtue or so indifferent to the truth in the service of their agenda that they'd cloud the issue willfully. The South I care about is a different one and most of the people in it, good, decent people, aren't the sort of yahoos who I have issue with. Either we live and grow and learn or we mistake every tradition with an unmeasured nobility that roots us in error and evil.

And you can stuff your sanctimonious "while you're turning your back on [Jesus]" comment in the piety hole you're running off at. But I thank you for providing a clear point to stop wasting time on a Yankee trying to tell me my culture or state my indifference to issues no one who wasn't in the throes of lunacy, essentially dishonest, or at least crippled by a deeply held confusion would have the audacity to advance.
 
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rainee

New member
Wow Tomo
I hope I'm using this figure of speech correctly when I exclaim "aren't you the dark horse here!"
My oh me. I'll have to get serious indeed.

I do not have much time at all and your post demands a good job in my opinion but let me say the heart breaking but good part that you are somewhat forcing me to say...and then I hope to come back later for the rest.

When you say it was a seriously foolish hill when they had so many other issues they could have championed as a justification for secession I have to nod my head and add this is the one point that makes me acknowledge The Lord was probably involved.
As great and possible as secession may have seemed it was not to be.
It would have been wrong and I base this solely on the issue of slavery.
If the black Americans could only see God wanted the slavery to come to an end I would feel better about all the heart break. But instead of contemplating that I see liberals, yanks, and angry blacks all reminiscing on slavery, lynchings, you name it. The fact that the poor economy NOW has driven northern communities to be even more distressed than ever may seem to justify all this going back to get mad all over again but that is pathetic hogwash - and I will fight it if I can.

I hope to be back later. But I mean it when I say I think The Lord was for them not against them. I don't know, maybe Christianity should be telling them about that.




Cause?.....Well I suppose you could trace things back to the founders not sufficiently defining their intentions when they jettisoned the Articles of Confederation. Patrick Henry recognized this and it really should have been settled once and for all during the Nullification Crisis but it was just argued about, as usual. :p....Same as it ever was.

Central to the argument of "who started it" is who had the more legitimate claim to Fort Sumter.

The fact remains that for all intents and purposes the Federalists have won the argument. What remains is the legacy of the fight itself...Was it worthwhile?
There is an old standby which I rely on when considering what actions to take on any given circumstance. It's not only the principle which is important but the actual hill you die on is just as important. The secessionists climbed up on a seriously foolish hill. There were more than enough tariff issues (particularly with S. Carolina involved) to make a fight of this but instead they chose to base their new Confederacy on the perceived necessity of slavery.
This could have been lived down since the vast majority of Confederate combatants were merely fighting to protect their homes not the institution of slavery but something else happened. The segregationists chose to use the Battle Flag of the Army Of Northern Virginia as their symbol....Nobody protested this use at the time so I find it kind of disingenuous to deny it now.

The blacks have reason to be offended....I don't blame them at all.


Of course the evils that men do still exist.....A scrap of cloth will not change that no matter what you do with it. However, the sacrifices which the rank and file Confederate soldier suffered to protect their families/land and their independence from a overbearing Federalist philosophy were tarnished and dragged through the mud by their own leaders, and to a lesser extent, by their own decedents.

You cannot champion the cause of liberty by fighting for the right to make men slaves or keep them in subordination.....No matter what your view of eugenics :eek: may be.

I'm not sure I really answered anything here. :plain:
 

Granite

New member
Hall of Fame
What manner of "heritage" were the folks in Oklahoma trying to evoke when they greeted Obama with this flag?
 

fzappa13

Well-known member
Cause?.....Well I suppose you could trace things back to the founders not sufficiently defining their intentions when they jettisoned the Articles of Confederation. Patrick Henry recognized this and it really should have been settled once and for all during the Nullification Crisis but it was just argued about, as usual. :p....Same as it ever was.

Central to the argument of "who started it" is who had the more legitimate claim to Fort Sumter.

The fact remains that for all intents and purposes the Federalists have won the argument. What remains is the legacy of the fight itself...Was it worthwhile?
There is an old standby which I rely on when considering what actions to take on any given circumstance. It's not only the principle which is important but the actual hill you die on is just as important. The secessionists climbed up on a seriously foolish hill. There were more than enough tariff issues (particularly with S. Carolina involved) to make a fight of this but instead they chose to base their new Confederacy on the perceived necessity of slavery.
This could have been lived down since the vast majority of Confederate combatants were merely fighting to protect their homes not the institution of slavery but something else happened. The segregationists chose to use the Battle Flag of the Army Of Northern Virginia as their symbol....Nobody protested this use at the time so I find it kind of disingenuous to deny it now.

The blacks have reason to be offended....I don't blame them at all.


Of course the evils that men do still exist.....A scrap of cloth will not change that no matter what you do with it. However, the sacrifices which the rank and file Confederate soldier suffered to protect their families/land and their independence from a overbearing Federalist philosophy were tarnished and dragged through the mud by their own leaders, and to a lesser extent, by their own decedents.

You cannot champion the cause of liberty by fighting for the right to make men slaves or keep them in subordination.....No matter what your view of eugenics :eek: may be.

I'm not sure I really answered anything here. :plain:

... mmmm ... what he said. :first:
 

Town Heretic

Out of Order
Hall of Fame
First, thanks to rainee for quoting TomO's post, which I missed the first time and is one of my favorites in this thread.

Terrific job, TomO. :first:


Now then...
...When you say it was a seriously foolish hill when they had so many other issues they could have championed as a justification for secession I have to nod my head and add this is the one point that makes me acknowledge The Lord was probably involved.
Which would put him squarely opposed to that flag we've been discussing.

If the black Americans could only see God wanted the slavery to come to an end I would feel better about all the heart break.
Oh, I'd bet most Christians who are also black are pretty sure God wasn't on the side of slave holders in that war.

The fact that the poor economy NOW has driven northern communities to be even more distressed than ever may seem to justify all this going back to get mad all over again but that is pathetic hogwash - and I will fight it if I can.
No, what's pathetic is defending the flying of that flag and what it symbolizes to most Americans over anything but a grave.

But I mean it when I say I think The Lord was for them not against them.
Then He was against that flag and you might want to consider why you aren't.
 

Stripe

Teenage Adaptive Ninja Turtle
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
The process you use for one is the process you use for all.
No, it's not.

I'm not muddying anything by teaching you something, whether you take the lesson or not.
Pretending I might have gotten self defense confused with murder doesn't make you a teacher.

Does anyone else realize he's just determined to say no? Because what he just wrote was really funny if you do. We don't change how we judge. We change the outcome...the outcome of what? Our judgment. Or maybe he just doesn't undertand what the word mitigate means. Either way, it's funny.
The circumstances should change the outcome, not how we judge. We should always judge according to God's standards. That should never change.

Pretending you can determine that a guy did not understand he was shooting up a church is no excuse for murder.

Not event the first lie, but moving beyond your usual, what you either can't or won't get is that rush is a subjective. The problem with you is that you seem more concerned for a quick time line than getting it right. Or you simply don't understand that your sense of it invites mistakes that can't be undone.
You need to respond to what I say, not what you feel.

Because it's rationally inescapable.
No, it's not. You think "crazy" people are not guilty of murder when they shoot up a church. Why? Because you say so? God says to "show no mercy."

and that's the tradition of justice, the law.
It's the tradition of your compact. Your compact perverts God's standards, therefore it is no law.

I don't care about your willful and proud ignorance of the law that applies to the situation, but I do care about justice. And mercy is forbidden in this case.
 

Town Heretic

Out of Order
Hall of Fame
No, it's not.
It is.

Pretending I might have gotten self defense confused with murder doesn't make you a teacher.
I didn't and I am.

The circumstances should change the outcome, not how we judge. We should always judge according to God's standards. That should never change.
You still literally don't seem to know what you're actually saying there.

Pretending you can determine that a guy did not understand he was shooting up a church is no excuse for murder.
I'm not pretending and wouldn't make the determination. Like you, I'm unqualified.

You need to respond to what I say, not what you feel.
If you think that's an accurate assessment it explains a lot.

No, it's not. You think "crazy" people are not guilty of murder when they shoot up a church. Why? Because you say so? God says to "show no mercy."
That's not the example of Christ. God help you. If you think God would find a child or the insane guilty of murder it also explains a lot about what's going on in your noggin.

It's the tradition of your compact...
I'm discussing the case here and the law that controls it.

I don't care about your willful and proud ignorance of the law
You're confused. Or you're sitting too close to your monitor.

I do care about justice. And mercy is forbidden in this case.
It may be necessary to shoot a mad dog. It isn't justice. In this case, if those qualified can determine his mental competence to stand trial he will. If he isn't competent he won't.
 
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Stripe

Teenage Adaptive Ninja Turtle
LIFETIME MEMBER
Hall of Fame
I'm going to try to match that for effort and examination. Here goes...You're wrong. :e4e:

Nope. I've laid out clearly that your position is anti-justice, which you have chosen to defend through misrepresentation, appeals to tradition and ignorance over the nature of justice.

Justice is not defined by what your regulations say and what you think the process should be. Your practices need to adhere to God's standards for them to be called justice.

If you think your nonsense response answers this, then I guess you could get away with murder in your system.
 
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