RELIGION: An Indication of the Absence of Faith

[Robert Pate]

There are more unsaved people in the organized church than there is outside of it. The reason being is that they can't live by faith because they don't have faith. Paul said that, "The Just Shall Live By Faith" Romans 1:17. Living by a religion or by laws, rules and commandments is NOT living by faith. It is just the opposite of living by faith. If you have to go to church every Sunday in order to maintain your salvation, you are not living by faith.

Paul said to the Galatians, "You observe days, and months, and times, and years. I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labor in vain" Galatians 4:10,11.

The Gospel gives us freedom from religion. Jesus said, "If the Son has made you free, you shall be free indeed" John 8:36. Christianity is not a religion of laws and rules. Christianity is about being free "In Christ" and having freedom from religion. The purpose of religion is to bring you into subjection of the law and to squash the Spirit. There is no freedom in religion. You must, you must, you must, or you are anathema.

Every church or religion has its by laws, if you don't follow those laws you are out. Some churches or religions demand that you tithe. If you don't tithe your out. The whole idea is to keep you under the law so that they can control you. This is the exact thing that Paul taught against.

The Gospel and justification by faith makes us free from the law and religion. If we are justified by faith that means that we have been justified by Christ.

Paul wrote, "Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ" Romans 5:1.

The reason that we have peace with God is because this is God's way of us being saved and justified. It is not the way of religion. Religion's way of being justified is the way of religion, which means that you must do something or become something in order to be justified. In the Gospel Jesus is the justifier, Romans 3:26. Jesus justifies us by doing for us that which we cannot do for ourselves. Jesus in our name and on our behalf fulfills God's holy law and atones for our sins. Because of the doing and the dying of Jesus we stand before God's holy court as complete "In Christ" Colossians 2:10. No religion needed.

 

[genuineoriginal]

Living by a religion or by laws, rules and commandments is NOT living by faith. It is just the opposite of living by faith.

How many of the ten commandments do you have to violate in order to prove to yourself that you are living by faith and not by rules?

 

[glorydaz]

How many of the ten commandments do you have to violate in order to prove to yourself that you are living by faith and not by rules?

The commandments have nothing to do with living by faith.

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.​

 

[Nihilo]

There are more unsaved people in the organized church than there is outside of it. The reason being is that they can't live by faith because they don't have faith. Paul said that, "The Just Shall Live By Faith" Romans 1:17. Living by a religion or by laws, rules and commandments is NOT living by faith. It is just the opposite of living by faith. If you have to go to church every Sunday in order to maintain your salvation, you are not living by faith.

Paul said to the Galatians, "You observe days, and months, and times, and years. I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labor in vain" Galatians 4:10,11.

The Gospel gives us freedom from religion. Jesus said, "If the Son has made you free, you shall be free indeed" John 8:36. Christianity is not a religion of laws and rules. Christianity is about being free "In Christ" and having freedom from religion. The purpose of religion is to bring you into subjection of the law and to squash the Spirit. There is no freedom in religion. You must, you must, you must, or you are anathema.

Every church or religion has its by laws, if you don't follow those laws you are out. Some churches or religions demand that you tithe. If you don't tithe your out. The whole idea is to keep you under the law so that they can control you. This is the exact thing that Paul taught against.

The Gospel and justification by faith makes us free from the law and religion. If we are justified by faith that means that we have been justified by Christ.

Paul wrote, "Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ" Romans 5:1.

The reason that we have peace with God is because this is God's way of us being saved and justified. It is not the way of religion. Religion's way of being justified is the way of religion, which means that you must do something or become something in order to be justified. In the Gospel Jesus is the justifier, Romans 3:26. Jesus justifies us by doing for us that which we cannot do for ourselves. Jesus in our name and on our behalf fulfills God's holy law and atones for our sins. Because of the doing and the dying of Jesus we stand before God's holy court as complete "In Christ" Colossians 2:10. No religion needed.

Christian communion is important, and it's important that Christians keep grave sinning separate from the Lord's Supper.

 

[Robert Pate]

How many of the ten commandments do you have to violate in order to prove to yourself that you are living by faith and not by rules?

I probably violate all of them everyday because I am... "The chief of Sinners" 1 Timothy 1:15. Just like Paul.

 

[Robert Pate]

Christian communion is important, and it's important that Christians keep grave sinning separate from the Lord's Supper.

That's for you because you are in bondage to your religion and the law. I am not under any law or religion. I am God's free man in Jesus Christ.

 

[Nihilo]

That's for you because you are in bondage to your religion and the law. I am not under any law or religion. I am God's free man in Jesus Christ.

So you eat the Lord's Supper, with grave sinners, and you don't care? Or are you saying that you never ever celebrate Christian communion? Which one of those?

 

[Ask Mr. Religion]

Robert Pate Affirming His Lone Ranger Status

Robert Pate Affirming His Lone Ranger Status

It is not the way of religion.

Robert is counting on some reader, who has a negative attitude toward something Robert has defined as "religion" gaining some appreciation for what Robert (teaching religion, don't let him kid you) has to say.

Religion is a descriptive adjective, and not simply a label. There is true and false religion, see James1:27, Our religious teacher, here, Robert, isn't using the Bible's own terms in ways that are faithful to its own authoritative representation. Naturally, given his refusal to covenant with a local church, Robert must find a way out of his dilemma by deciding religion is bad, just bad. His own lexicon at work here, of course. :AMR:

Then again, Robert has problems keeping track of his own rhetoric, so is regularly contradicting himself:

Christianity is a faith religion. We are called to believe things thatcannot be believed by unbelievers. They are things of the Spirit thatunbelievers do not have access to, 1 Corinthians 2:14. We spend a lot of timeon the forum trying to convince these people that are void of the Spirit thingsof the Spirit.

When anyone can define their own terms, rejecting commonly understood means of effective communication, all manner of foolishness ensues.

AMR

 

[daqq]

I probably violate all of them everyday because I am... "The chief of Sinners" 1 Timothy 1:15. Just like Paul.

It has already been explained several times that Paul said those words because he formerly persecuted the congregation of Elohim. It is right there in the surrounding text from which you excised your clip so as to apply the catch-phrase to yourself. Paul is not saying he stayed "chief of sinners" by continuing to live his former lifestyle in the same way that you appear to be applying it to yourself, no, once a sinner always a sinner, but that does not mean we are never transformed out of the old man lifestyle: we are transformed through walking with and in the Messiah, (especially through immersing into his Testimony found in the Gospel accounts). Paul was utterly and completely transformed; he only calls himself chief of sinners because of the things he had already done before his conversion commenced on the way to Damascus, (yes, commenced, it is a walk, not just an initial confession). You can call yourself whatever you wish but the way in which you are teaching and using-abusing this passage you are at the same time denigrating the character of Paul: have you no fear that you are wresting his teachings and words to your own detriment, and eventually destruction, even as Peter warns?

1 Timothy 1:12-16 KJV
12 And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry;
13 Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief.
14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.
15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.
16 Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.

Paul calls himself chief of sinners for the things he says he did before, and for the things he says he did ignorantly, and for the things he says he did in unbelief: not for what he did after his conversion and walk commenced on the way to Damascus. You are ignoring the pattern which Paul lays forth in this very passage. You are clipping out the little catch-phrase portion which you like just because it sounds good for your own private usage and purposes. However, in so doing, you are wresting and twisting the writings and teachings of Paul: and even worse, you are teaching that Paul was like you rather than forcing yourself to adhere to the pattern which Paul lays out for his readers. And by continuing in this error, even after it has been shown to you before, you are essentially stealing from the writings of Paul to fabricate your own anti-religion religion.

 

[Robert Pate]

Robert is counting on some reader, who has a negative attitude toward something Robert has defined as "religion" gaining some appreciation for what Robert (teaching religion, don't let him kid you) has to say.

Religion is a descriptive adjective, and not simply a label. There is true and false religion, see James1:27, Our religious teacher, here, Robert, isn't using the Bible's own terms in ways that are faithful to its own authoritative representation. Naturally, given his refusal to covenant with a local church, Robert must find a way out of his dilemma by deciding religion is bad, just bad. His own lexicon at work here, of course. :AMR:

Then again, Robert has problems keeping track of his own rhetoric, so is regularly contradicting himself:



When anyone can define their own terms, rejecting commonly understood means of effective communication, all manner of foolishness ensues.

AMR

I knew that you had a problem when I saw all of those men at the bottom of your page. And then on top of that you name yourself "Mr. Religion". For someone that is highly educated like yourself you have 0 comprehension of spiritual things. This is not uncommon with the well educated. Many of the Pharisees were well educated men, but they could not comprehend who Jesus was.

Your local organized church is as anti-Gospel as it can get. I have been in many organized churches and have communicated the Gospel to many pastors, like yourself. They just don't get it. Just like you don't get it. I think it is because they love their religion so much that they cannot give it up. The Gospel is a religion killer. It will wreck your religion. The reason being is because Jesus has done it all and he did it perfectly. In Jesus Christ we have been justified, sanctified and redeemed, 1 Corinthians 1:30. Because of Jesus Christ God sees us as perfect and complete "In Christ". Its over, its finished, we have been reconciled to God by the doing and the dying of Jesus, 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19. This means that your religion is absolutely worthless.

 

[Robert Pate]

It has already been explained several times that Paul said those words because he formerly persecuted the congregation of Elohim. It is right there in the surrounding text from which you excised your clip so as to apply the catch-phrase to yourself. Paul is not saying he stayed "chief of sinners" by continuing to live his former lifestyle in the same way that you appear to be applying it to yourself, no, once a sinner always a sinner, but that does not mean we are never transformed out of the old man lifestyle: we are transformed through walking with and in the Messiah, (especially through immersing into his Testimony found in the Gospel accounts). Paul was utterly and completely transformed; he only calls himself chief of sinners because of the things he had already done before his conversion commenced on the way to Damascus, (yes, commenced, it is a walk, not just an initial confession). You can call yourself whatever you wish but the way in which you are teaching and using-abusing this passage you are at the same time denigrating the character of Paul: have you no fear that you are wresting his teachings and words to your own detriment, and eventually destruction, even as Peter warns?

1 Timothy 1:12-16 KJV
12 And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry;
13 Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief.
14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.
15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.
16 Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.

Paul calls himself chief of sinners for the things he says he did before, and for the things he says he did ignorantly, and for the things he says he did in unbelief: not for what he did after his conversion and walk commenced on the way to Damascus. You are ignoring the pattern which Paul lays forth in this very passage. You are clipping out the little catch-phrase portion which you like just because it sounds good for your own private usage and purposes. However, in so doing, you are wresting and twisting the writings and teachings of Paul: and even worse, you are teaching that Paul was like you rather than forcing yourself to adhere to the pattern which Paul lays out for his readers. And by continuing in this error, even after it has been shown to you before, you are essentially stealing from the writings of Paul to fabricate your own anti-religion religion.

What about Paul's struggle with sin in Romans Chapter 7? And then in Romans 7:7-12 Paul said that the law made him sin. Paul's Gospel is a religion wrecker. In the Gospel Jesus atones for the sins of the whole world, 1 John 2:2. In the Gospel Jesus has reconciled us to God, 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19. We are complete "In Christ". Jesus has done it all and it did it perfectly. This means that your religion is worthless.

 

[genuineoriginal]

The commandments have nothing to do with living by faith.

Revelation 14:12 12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.​

 

[genuineoriginal]

I probably violate all of them everyday because I am... "The chief of Sinners" 1 Timothy 1:15. Just like Paul.

Let me clarify.

How many of the ten commandments do you have to deliberately violate in order to prove to yourself that you are living by faith and not by rules?

 

[Robert Pate]

Let me clarify.

How many of the ten commandments do you have to deliberately violate in order to prove to yourself that you are living by faith and not by rules?

There are two great pillars of the law.

1. Love God with all of your heart.

2. Love your neighbor as yourself.

If I told you that I obey these laws I would be a lying hypocrite. It is easy to say that you love God with all of your heart, anyone can say that.

If you loved your neighbor as yourself you would sell all that you have and give it to the poor. That is what the law requires.

We don't love God with all of our heart, nor do we love our neighbor as our self. You need to accept the fact that your righteousness falls short of the glory of God, Romans 3:23.

 

[beloved57]

There are more unsaved people in the organized church than there is outside of it. The reason being is that they can't live by faith because they don't have faith. Paul said that, "The Just Shall Live By Faith" Romans 1:17. Living by a religion or by laws, rules and commandments is NOT living by faith. It is just the opposite of living by faith. If you have to go to church every Sunday in order to maintain your salvation, you are not living by faith.

Paul said to the Galatians, "You observe days, and months, and times, and years. I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labor in vain" Galatians 4:10,11.

The Gospel gives us freedom from religion. Jesus said, "If the Son has made you free, you shall be free indeed" John 8:36. Christianity is not a religion of laws and rules. Christianity is about being free "In Christ" and having freedom from religion. The purpose of religion is to bring you into subjection of the law and to squash the Spirit. There is no freedom in religion. You must, you must, you must, or you are anathema.

Every church or religion has its by laws, if you don't follow those laws you are out. Some churches or religions demand that you tithe. If you don't tithe your out. The whole idea is to keep you under the law so that they can control you. This is the exact thing that Paul taught against.

The Gospel and justification by faith makes us free from the law and religion. If we are justified by faith that means that we have been justified by Christ.

Paul wrote, "Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ" Romans 5:1.

The reason that we have peace with God is because this is God's way of us being saved and justified. It is not the way of religion. Religion's way of being justified is the way of religion, which means that you must do something or become something in order to be justified. In the Gospel Jesus is the justifier, Romans 3:26. Jesus justifies us by doing for us that which we cannot do for ourselves. Jesus in our name and on our behalf fulfills God's holy law and atones for our sins. Because of the doing and the dying of Jesus we stand before God's holy court as complete "In Christ" Colossians 2:10. No religion needed.

You teach that sinners Christ died for are still lost and condemned. That contradicts " tbe just shall live by faith".

 

[Robert Pate]

You teach that sinners Christ died for are still lost and condemned. That contradicts " tbe just shall live by faith".

You have a perverted faith. You have faith in a God that condemns people to hell. Not possible to have faith in that kind of a God.

 

[genuineoriginal]

There are two great pillars of the law.

1. Love God with all of your heart.

2. Love your neighbor as yourself.

If I told you that I obey these laws I would be a lying hypocrite.

God judges the heart.
Do you hate those laws in your heart and try to break them?

It is easy to say that you love God with all of your heart, anyone can say that.

You can say that, but do you actually show you love God by doing what He commands?

1 John 5:2-3 2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.​

If you loved your neighbor as yourself you would sell all that you have and give it to the poor. That is what the law requires.

The law does not require that you sell all you have and give it to the poor in order to love your neighbor as yourself.
The law does require that you rebuke your neighbor when you seen your neighbor sinning.

Leviticus 19:17-18 17 Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him. 18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the Lord.​

 

[clefty]

Revelation 14:12 12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.​

Can’t be said enough.

And notice it is the “faith OF Jesus”...which is His religion the one He made for His bride...the church in the wilderness as poor Stephen called it

Right before he was killed by the same who killed Him...they hated His attempts to try and restore His Father’s Way to what it was supposed to be...hated that He exemplified how it was to be lived...and that He reminded them it was supposed to be for everyone...

House of prayer for all nations...

 

[Robert Pate]

God judges the heart.
Do you hate those laws in your heart and try to break them?


You can say that, but do you actually show you love God by doing what He commands?

1 John 5:2-3 2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.​

The law does not require that you sell all you have and give it to the poor in order to love your neighbor as yourself.
The law does require that you rebuke your neighbor when you seen your neighbor sinning.

Leviticus 19:17-18 17 Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart: thou shalt in any wise rebuke thy neighbour, and not suffer sin upon him. 18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the Lord.​

Boy are you screwed up. There is no judgment or condemnation for those that are "In Christ" Romans 8:1.

 

[clefty]

Boy are you screwed up. There is no judgment or condemnation for those that are "In Christ" Romans 8:1.

STOP IT. Seriously your use of the sword will get you killed.

Read it slowly ok?


“There is therefore now no CONDEMNATION to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.”

In order to get to the condemnation part ya gotz to get through da whole trial...and then the ruling...that is the judgement...

Which of these is not included on Judgement Day?