Reconciled by the cross on this day, Thursday.

[JudgeRightly]

From the 1st calendar you used, it looks as though we are speaking of the same thing...View attachment 14197.Jesus died on Wednesday evening and arose on Sunday....The Thursday scenario simply will not work.

Did you say Jesus was risen on Saturday? No, not that I read....Do I believe you believe Jesus rose on Saturday. I said "Surely you do not" meaning "I hope not" meaning "NO", I do not believe you believe Jesus arose on Saturday.

Then you need to reread what I said.

Because nowhere in my post did I say or indicate that Christ rose on a Saturday.

Attachment 14197 is me showing you that the WEDNESDAY view requires Jesus to have risen on the FOURTH DAY, not on the third day, in contradiction to scripture.

I then showed you that the Thursday crucifixion not only has Jesus rising on Sunday, but it's also the third day after His death.

So quit straw-manning my position.

Jesus rode in on a Sunday. Your view has Him riding in on a sabbath day.



So you claim!

But in reality, YOU'RE NOT!

You can claim that's what you're doing until you're blue in the face or until the cows come home, whichever comes first, but it doesn't mean you actually are!



Thanks for that, that makes this easier to demonstrate why you're wrong.

Observe:

View attachment 14197

You have four days and three nights instead of three days and three nights, not to mention the fact that Jesus ROSE on the THIRD DAY, NOT the fourth!! Your view has Jesus rising on the fourth day!



EASY!!! Observe!

View attachment 14198



Yes. There was, in fact, two sabbath days the year Christ was crucified. And no, AD 32 doesn't have this.

Leviticus 23 tells us exactly why:

There was a High Sabbath, the Feast of Unleavened Bread, on Friday, 14 Nisan, AD 30.

And the Sunday IMMEDIATELY FOLLOWING IT was the feast of Firstfruits. (Ignore the date numbers in the following image, I forgot to cross them out. As they're incorrect.

View attachment 14199



On normal sabbath days, yes, they would have had to have food for only one day.

But there is a second calendar in play (Leviticus 23) that you are completely ignoring.

The dates on this second calendar are not tied to days of the week, but rather dates in the year, meaning regardless of what day of the week it is, certain things were to be observed. The Feast of Unleavened bread was to be a day of rest, regardless of what day of the week it fell on.

The Jews would have been well aware of this second calendar, and knew when they would need to prepare an extra day of food for whenever the high sabbath and regular weekly sabbath would be back to back.



What about them?



Saying it doesn't make it so, Blade.

Assertion without evidence will be dismissed without evidence.

Present your evidence. Point out the problems.



Friday (14 Nisan) was a high sabbath (see Leviticus 23). The 8 Nisan is 6 days before the high sabbath.



Go read Exodus 12. Compare it to sequence of events surrounding the crucifixion.

Jesus entered Jerusalem on Sunday. (selection of the lamb)

Jesus was in Jerusalem for four days BEFORE Passover. (inspection of the lamb by the people.

Jesus was turned over to the High Priests Thursday evening (what we today call Wednesday night would be the start of Thursday, since the days were counted "evening then morning, not day then night) after the last supper. (inspection of the lamb by the chief priests of Israel)

Jesus was crucified at 9 am, and died around 3 pm. (the lamb was killed at the same time)

He was then taken down, because the sabbathS were approaching, and they couldn't do any work after twilight ended. (which signaled the start of Unleavened bread.

He was then in the tomb until sometime before Sunday morning, having risen ON the third day.



OHH NOOO! You were doing so well up until you said "Friday."

No, the 17th was NOT a Friday.

The problem is that you're begging the question that it was in AD 32.

The problem with that is that it doesn't fit the narrative!

Christ was crucified on Passover, was in the grave for three days and three nights, and rose ON THE THIRD DAY, a Sunday. AD 32 has the amount of time between 3pm on Passover and before 6am on Sunday as FOUR days and three nights, with Jesus rising on the fourth day, and not the third, in direct contradiction to the narrative!

Therefore, as Paul says in Romans 3:4: "Let God be true, and every man a liar," and concede that an AD 32 crucifixion does not fit the narrative.



The dates you are giving match.

The days you are giving do not.

Jesus did not rise on a Saturday. He rose on a Sunday, SPECIFICALLY on the day of the Feast of Firstfruits, because the Feast of Firstfruits is ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS on the day AFTER the sabbath (Leviticus 23:11).

It is NEVER on a sabbath day, BECAUSE THEY CAN'T DO WHAT GOD REQUIRED OF THEM TO BECAUSE IT'S A DAY OF REST!

 

[Bladerunner]

Then you need to reread what I said.

Because nowhere in my post did I say or indicate that Christ rose on a Saturday.

Attachment 14197 is me showing you that the WEDNESDAY view requires Jesus to have risen on the FOURTH DAY, not on the third day, in contradiction to scripture.

I then showed you that the Thursday crucifixion not only has Jesus rising on Sunday, but it's also the third day after His death.

So quit straw-manning my position.

you said:"Jesus rode in on a Sunday. Your view has Him riding in on a sabbath day."

YES and it was not the Sabbath or was it according to you..The Sabbath was Friday eve 6pm until Sat eve 6pm.

Your hung up on the 4th day. Yet, since the sabbath did not end until 6pm Sat and Sunday (the fourth day) began...the only way you have of explaining the third day verses is to throw out those verses that proclaim He arose on the day after, the Next day and so forth and proclaim that He was crucified on Thursday.

How can one get using the calendar (View attachment 14199) have a crucifixion on Thursday and still get three FULL days and nights before the resurrection on the following Sunday. You cannot...You wrote on the calendar "before 6 AM" ,yet morning did not start until 6 am. Thus, according to the Calendar, one could not have three FULL Nights with a Thursday Crucifixion.

There is no use to continue, we can agree to disagree. You have your opinion and I have mine. We can agree to disagree.

Thank you for the conversation....

 

[Bladerunner]

That is not the substitution. The festivals all point to the salvation of Israel as a nation. Their day of atonement is in the future. I sort of think it wasn't all revealed to them, but much of it is, because they must endure to the end to receive their earthly inheritance.



To repent is go and sin no more. Remission is not dead to sin. See Acts 5. Or see Peter say Paul's letters are hard to understand. In Acts 2 Peter states repent and be baptized for the remission of sin, so the times of refreshing can come (future). And maybe they did understand some. But they still had to keep the law of Moses.

and a large part of the Nation Israel still do today, at least 2/3 of them.

 

[JudgeRightly]

you said:"Jesus rode in on a Sunday. Your view has Him riding in on a sabbath day."

YES

The Jews were not allowed to travel on the Sabbath.

Jesus was a law-keeping Jew. He would not have gone ANYWHERE on the Sabbath.

and it was not the Sabbath or was it according to you..

Jesus arrived in Bethany on Friday. He arrived in Jerusalem on Sunday, because he could not travel on Saturday, as Saturday is a day of rest.

The Sabbath was Friday eve 6pm until Sat eve 6pm.

Yes, thus, He could not have traveled from Bethany to Jerusalem on that day.

Your hung up on the 4th day.

Because it contradicts SCRIPTURE, you numbskull!

Yet, since the sabbath did not end until 6pm Sat and Sunday (the fourth day) began...

Then it could not have been that year.

Period.

End of story.

Reason #1: Jesus did not rise on the fourth day. He rose on the third day, after three days and three nights.
Reason #2: Jesus DID rise on a Sunday. Therefore Sunday could not have been the fourth day, because it had to have been the third day.

This isn't hard to understand, Blade.

Why are you being so belligerent on this?

the only way you have of explaining the third day verses

Is that He wasn't crucified in AD 32, but rather in AD 30.

He was crucified on Thursday, at roughly 9 am. He hung on the cross until 3 pm, when He died. He was in the grave by 6 pm. He remained in the grave for the next two and a half days, until just before dawn on Sunday morning. Thus, He rose ON THE THIRD DAY, just like Scripture says He did.

is to throw out those verses that proclaim He arose on the day after, the Next day and so forth and proclaim that He was crucified on Thursday.

Unless I missed it, I don't remember seeing where you posted the verse that says that "He arose on the day after," or, "the next day."

Yet I gave you at least 10 verses that said that Christ rose "on the third day."

How can one get using the calendar (View attachment 14199) have a crucifixion on Thursday and still get three FULL days and nights

There is ZERO requirement for a FULL three days and nights.

The Bible does not require a full three days and nights.

NOWHERE IN SCRIPTURE IS THERE A REQUIREMENT FOR JESUS TO HAVE BEEN IN THE GRAVE FOR A FULL THREE DAYS AND NIGHTS!!!!!

HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO SAY THIS?!

You get "three days and three nights" by starting ON THURSDAY, at the moment Christ died. That's THE FIRST DAY. Friday evening (after 6 pm on THURSDAY) starts the FIRST NIGHT. Friday 6 am starts the SECOND DAY. Saturday evening (after 6 pm on FRIDAY) starts the SECOND NIGHT. Saturday 6 am starts the THIRD DAY. Sunday evening (after 6 pm on SATURDAY) starts the THIRD NIGHT, and then Jesus rose before dawn.

He was IN THE GRAVE for 2.5 days. He rose ON THE THIRD DAY.

ONCE AGAIN:

THERE.
IS.
NO.
REQUIREMENT.
FOR.
A.
FULL.
THREE.
DAYS.
AND.
NIGHTS.

before the resurrection on the following Sunday. You cannot...

I just showed you, for the umpteenth time, how you do.

You wrote on the calendar "before 6 AM", yet morning did not start until 6 am.

Yes, because if He rose AFTER 6 am, then it would have been the START OF THE FOURTH DAY!!!!

Thus, according to the Calendar, one could not have three FULL Nights with a Thursday Crucifixion.

ONCE AGAIN:

THERE.
IS.
NO.
REQUIREMENT.
FOR.
A.
FULL.
THREE.
DAYS.
AND.
NIGHTS.

He ONLY has to be dead for longer than 2 days, and less than three days, according to the narrative.

And again, it's NOT just the fact that SCRIPTURE says "He rose on the third day."

He arrived in Bethany on 8 Nisan, 6 days before the Passover, and He arrived in Jerusalem on 10 Nisan, the day the Jews were to select a lamb to sacrifice for the Passover (Exodus 12).

This places His arrival in Bethany on a FRIDAY and His arrival in Jerusalem on a SUNDAY, because if it were shifted one day in either direction, one of those two arrivals would be ON A SABBATH DAY, on which NO TRAVEL WAS ALLOWED. This means that a Wednesday crucifixion is out, because it puts His arrival in Jerusalem on a no travel day. And it means a Friday crucifixion is out, because it puts his arrival in Bethany on a no travel day (not to mention it doesn't leave enough time for Jesus to be in the grave for three days and three nights.

And then there's the literal succession of events on the Jewish religious festival calendar, where Passover is the day when the lamb is slain, the feast of unleavened bread, and the feast of firstfruits, all three of which were implemented TO POINT TO CHRIST!!!!

JESUS is the Passover Lamb.
Jesus' body lay in the tomb for three days and nights WITHOUT DECAYING, which is what the unleavened bread represents.
Jesus is the firstborn of the dead, His resurrection also caused many others to be raised from the dead, the firstfruits of His act on the Cross.

THE ENTIRE WEEK was about HIM and HIM ALONE!

Thus, He HAD to rise on Sunday, and He HAD to die on Passover, and He HAD to arrive in Jerusalem on Sunday 10 Nisan. The only day that works therefore IS THURSDAY, because that's how math works!

There is no use to continue, we can agree to disagree. You have your opinion and I have mine. We can agree to disagree.

Thank you for the conversation....

This has nothing to do with opinions, Blade.

This isn't a matter of opinion.

This is a matter of facts. FACT: Jesus could not have been crucified on a Friday or a Wednesday, because the corresponding timeline DOES NOT MATCH THE NARRATIVE PRESENTED BY SCRIPTURE!!!

 

[Nick M]

and a large part of the Nation Israel still do today, at least 2/3 of them.

I am going to copy and paste a previous work from here from someone else. Tom from Maybank. Everlasting means everlasting.

Paulos,



While there are many reasons for circumcision other than as a religious ritual, God gave a Covenant of Circumcision to Abraham. Circumcision (a synonym for law) is a huge key to unlocking the mysteries of Scripture. When a Jew was circumcised on the eighth day, he automaticall came under the Covenant of Circumcision or the law. Jesus was a Jew born into the House of Israel and was circmcised on the eighth day. He voluntarily put Himself under this covnant to fulfill it--something that we were not able to do. Fulfillment of the Covenant of Circumcision was keeping the law perfectly without sinning. Jesus made a contract with Abraham and then came around the other side of the table so to speak and fulfill Abraham's obligation. I wish I could get a car salesman to do that.



First, let’s examine law in Scripture. There were three tiers of the law: The first tier governed our relationship with God. “I am the Lord your God. You shall have no other gods before Me….” The second tier governed our relationship with each other. “Thou shall not steal, commit adultery, kidnap, et.al.” The third tier brings confusion to the average Bible student. This tier is symbolic law. The Jews received the symbolic laws. Symbolic law is neither moral nor immoral. Thus, any negative law could be overridden by a law that was a positive command. The command to not work on the Sabbath took a back seat to circumcise on the eighth day (if it fell on the Sabbath).



Symbolic laws simply pointed to Jesus Christ. The laws of clothing, diet, feasts, etc. pointed to Jesus. For example, a high priest could not be lame, for “in Jesus the lame walk.” The high priest could not be blind, for “in Jesus the blind see.” The Jews’ clothing had to be of one pure cloth, as Jesus is our pure covering. The Sabbath law was for Israel only, and was a perpetual covenant.



The first covenant that God made with Abraham was the Covenant of Grace: “[Abraham] believed in the Lord, and He [God] accounted it to him for righteousness” (Gen. 15:6). Paul used this centuries later as his argument for grace: “For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something of which to boast…. For what does the Scripture say” ‘Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness’” (Rom. 4:2-3). This covenant was the first covenant that God made with Abraham. NO WORK WAS REQUIRED BY ABRAHAM! In fact, God put Abraham to sleep.



The second covenant was the covenant of Circumcision (or works or the law). Years later, God insisted that Abraham circumcise himself. Why? Circumcision was a sign of the agreement between God and Abraham’s descendants who would become known as people of the Circumcision (Jews): “and you shall be circumcised in the flesh of your foreskins, and it shall be a sign of the covenant between Me [God] and you [Abraham and your descendants]” (Gen. 17:11).



Circumcision, although symbolic, was not optional for the Jews. God almost killed Moses because he did not circumcise his son born to Midionite wife Zipporah: “And it came to pass on the way, at the encampment that the Lord met him [Moses] and sought to kill him. Then Zipporah [Moses wife] took a sharp stone and cut off the foreskin of her son and cast it at Moses’ feet, and said, ‘Surely you are a husband of blood to me!’ So He let him [Moses] go. Then she said, ‘You are a husband of blood!’ because of the circumcision” (Ex. 4:24-26)



Now having said all this, why this unusual circumcision ritual? Recall that these laws were symbolic, neither moral nor immoral, were for the Jews only, and pointed to Jesus. Circumcision is the cutting off of the flesh. Jesus Christ (God the Son) became flesh, and was cut off. God told Abraham: “He who is born in your house and he who is bought with your money must be circumcised, and My covenant shall be in your flesh for an everlasting covenant” (Gen. 17:13). God had also said to Abraham, “in you all” nations will be blessed (Gen. 12:3), and in Abraham, because Jesus came from Abraham’s loins, and from David’s body (2 Sam. 7:12). Thus, the Covenant of Circumcision pointed to Jesus Christ, who “became flesh” (John 1:14) and then the “Messiah” was “cut off” (Dan. 9:26; Mat. 27:46, 50). The Jews, called the Circumcision, the people of the Covenant of Circumcision, were themselves cut off (Rom. 11:20, 22). So, too, Christ, the King of the Jews (Mat. 2:2; 27:11), became flesh and was cut off. Thus the circumcision of Jesus Christ according to the Law on the eighth day (Luke 2:21) foreshadowed the very purpose of His coming. Consider also that God used the Hebrew word silver when He said to Abraham, “he who is bought with your money [silver].” Then recall two things: that the High Priest bought Christ with “thirty pieces of silver” from Judas (Mat. 26:15); and also that Jesus was born a Jew. Thus, throughout all history, He was the One both “born in your house [Israel] and… bought with your silver.” Thus the Covenant of Circumcision uniquely pointed to Christ.



Also understand that for Israel, many symbolic laws such as circumcision, feasts, Sabbath law, are perpetual statutes for Israel. When Jesus comes back to Israel, Israel will be required to keep these symbolic laws during their Thousand Year Kingdom and in the New Heaven and the New Earth. For Israel, these laws are not optional.

I pray that this sheds some light on the subject.