Questions Calvinists Can't Answer....

[Clete]

This thread is intended to collect various questions that Calvinists cannot answer without contradicting their own doctrine. I'll update the list below as new questions are posed.

1. If God is immutable, how did He become a man? (John 1:1 & 14)
2. If a child of innocent age, but not one of the elect dies. Is that child still damned/go to hell? (Post #2)

 

[Bradley D]

2. If a child of innocent age, but not one of the elect dies. Is that child still damned/go to hell?

 

[Clete]

2. If a child of innocent age, but not one of the elect dies. Is that child still damned/go to hell?

That's interesting. It never occurred to me to ask a Calvinist about the age of accountability.

Do you have any experience with how they respond to such a question?

 

[Right Divider]

That's interesting. It never occurred to me to ask a Calvinist about the age of accountability.

Do you have any experience with how they respond to such a question?

Since Calvinists claim that salvation is chosen for someone before their creation/birth, what would be their view of the age of accountability? Seems like the very idea would go against their entire view.

 

[Clete]

Since Calvinists claim that salvation is chosen for someone before their creation/birth, what would be their view of the age of accountability? Seems like the very idea would go against their entire view.

I agree. I can't imagine how it would fit but how much would you bet that they don't believe in an age of accountability anyway?

I wouldn't bet a single cent!

In fact, I'd be surprised if they didn't believe in an age of accountability.

Predestination doesn't prevent them believing in the existence of a will so why would it keep them from believe anything else they wanted to believe in?

 

[Right Divider]

I agree. I can't imagine how it would fit but how much would you bet that they don't believe in an age of accountability anyway?

I wouldn't bet a single cent!

In fact, I'd be surprised if they didn't believe in an age of accountability.

Predestination doesn't prevent them believing in the existence of a will so why would it keep them from believe anything else they wanted to believe in?

Age of accountability makes no sense in their paradigm, but tons of stuff make no sense in their paradigm.

There is no accountability of any kind in their view. God already chose their eternal destiny before anyone could be accountable for anything.

 

[Bradley D]

2. If a child of innocent age, but not one of the elect dies. Is that child still damned/go to hell?

I asked one calvinist if the child would go to hell and he told me yes. I used a verse in Deuteronomy about the age of innocence. "And the little ones that you said would be taken captive, your children who do not yet know good from bad..." (Deut. 1:39)

 

[Idolater]

I asked one calvinist if the child would go to hell and he told me yes. I used a verse in Deuteronomy about the age of innocence. "And the little ones that you said would be taken captive, your children who do not yet know good from bad..." (Deut. 1:39)

It's not monolithic. I know many Calvinists believe every child who dies gets saved. It's like predestination doesn't apply to children. I can't say I find it consistent with the rest of Calvinist theology, but I don't find Calvinist theology self-consistent for other reasons anyway.

 

[Clete]

It's not monolithic. I know many Calvinists believe every child who dies gets saved. It's like predestination doesn't apply to children. I can't say I find it consistent with the rest of Calvinist theology, but I don't find Calvinist theology self-consistent for other reasons anyway.

I'm sure you're right about it not being monolithic. Those that do believe in an age of accountability, it seems to me, would likely argue something like, "We can know that children who die before reaching the age of accountability were predestined to be saved by virtue of the fact that God predestined them to die at that age."

The first thought that strikes my mind after such a thought is that I wonder what keeps them from being pro-aborts and child killers? Abortion mills are veritable factories where they save baby's souls forever by chopping their bodies to bits.

There is no smoother road to the deepest depravity than that laid by poor doctrine.

 

[Idolater]

I'm sure you're right about it not being monolithic. Those that do believe in an age of accountability, it seems to me, would likely argue something like, "We can know that children who die before reaching the age of accountability were predestined to be saved by virtue of the fact that God predestined them to die at that age."

It's as simple as acknowledging the rest of the doctrine. Everybody's a baby at some point, and every baby is predestined or reprobate. The age at which the baby dies, whether it's one month or one hundred years, doesn't enter into the doctrine of unconditional election at all.

The first thought that strikes my mind after such a thought is that I wonder what keeps them from being pro-aborts and child killers?

Correct, my thought too, when I was a Calvinist.

Abortion mills are veritable factories where they save baby's souls forever by chopping their bodies to bits.

Correct.

There is no smoother road to the deepest depravity than that laid by poor doctrine.

I guess. Although falling into any pit, whether theoretical or practical, seems perilous.

 

[Clete]

It's as simple as acknowledging the rest of the doctrine. Everybody's a baby at some point, and every baby is predestined or reprobate. The age at which the baby dies, whether it's one month or one hundred years, doesn't enter into the doctrine of unconditional election at all.

Of course, but whether it's one month or one hundred years certainly does enter into the age of accountability doctrine.

Correct, my thought too, when I was a Calvinist.

I still clearly remember when I first started posting on TOL, there was some lunatic woman who had murdered her own children in order to guarantee their entry into Heaven. It was in the news and I remember being astonished that there were some here who refused to say she was wrong. Simply mind blowing.

Correct.

Well, not correct but consistent with the Calvinist premise.

I guess. Although falling into any pit, whether theoretical or practical, seems perilous.

The point is that the pits dug by shovels in the hands of believers do the worst damage.