themuzicman
Well-known member
You're confusing "is" with "ought". She is a believer, and thus justified (and saved.) She ought to live like she believes, and the process of moving this way is called sanctification.
ECT Pregnant unmarried pastor refuses to step down from pulpit
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You're confusing "is" with "ought". She is a believer, and thus justified (and saved.) She ought to live like she believes, and the process of moving this way is called sanctification.
themuzicman
Well-known member
No, there are different standards for church leaders. See 1 Tim 3.
turbosixx
New member
Why should she care about sanctification if she's saved? Isn't that all that really matters?
themuzicman
Well-known member
See James 2.
turbosixx
New member
I'm familiar with James 2 and agree with it but I don't believe you do.
22 You see that faith was active along with his works, and faith was completed by his works; 23 and the Scripture was fulfilled that says, "Abraham believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness"—and he was called a friend of God. 24 You see that a person is justified by works and not by faith alone.
Do you believe we are justified by faith alone or NOT by faith alone?
Thanks for the verse. Does God not expect that of all His followers?
Hey, maybe if she had an abortion she could go ahead and preach. Since she would no longer be pregnant that should solve it, right?
Another option is she doesn't have the Spirit of Christ so she is not his. Christ does not remain in fornicators and sexually immoral people.
If she was ever a part of the body of Christ she would be cut-off. Bye, bye.
Another option is she doesn't have the Spirit of Christ so she is not his. Christ does not remain in fornicators and sexually immoral people.
If she was ever a part of the body of Christ she would be cut-off. Bye, bye.
themuzicman
Well-known member
As usual, proof texting produces bad exegesis. James has been making the case that mere intellectual assent to Jesus being the Christ isn't the kind of faith that saves. We are to believe in Him, trust in him. The kind of trust that acts like we believe.
Thus, James isn't saying that acts are what justify us, but rather that Abraham had the kind of faith that justified because he acted when God called him to do so.
If you read the whole chapter without your bias, it will be clearer.
themuzicman
Well-known member
To be a man of one wife? No. Men are often single.
For that matter "able to teach"? No, not all are teachers.
'Faith and Works' and 'Faith Alone' are not really so different. The implications of each are rooted in deeper theology and do not dictate one's self-evident duty to righteousness or obedience.
The 'faith vs works' debate is best left to those 'easy believists' who think salvation is as unwrapping a gift under the tree next to their vanities.
The 'faith vs works' debate is best left to those 'easy believists' who think salvation is as unwrapping a gift under the tree next to their vanities.
turbosixx
New member
Here's my problem. When I read about those who will be separated at judgment, it's always based on deeds. I see it as final judgment because of where they are sent when separated. Here is one and all the others I see are no different. It's those who act that are saved.
Matt. 25:31 "When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit on his glorious throne. 32 Before him will be gathered all the nations, and he will separate people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 And he will place the sheep on his right, but the goats on the left. 34 Then the King will say to those on his right, 'Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world... 40 And the King will answer them, 'Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.'
41 "Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels....45 Then he will answer them, saying, 'Truly, I say to you, as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.' 46 And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."
I agree, it's the kind of trust that acts. I also agree that we cannot be justified by acts alone. I don't believe it's faith alone or acts alone but faith that works.
7 Little children, let no one deceive you. Whoever practices righteousness is righteous, as he is righteous.
themuzicman
Well-known member
Have you read 1 Corinthians 13?
turbosixx
New member
themuzicman
Well-known member
Thank you for proving my point. Belief in Christ, the love of God, results in keeping commandments. Notice that keeping commandments aren't the requirement, but rather the end result.
And I've noticed that you ignored the chapter I pointed to. Care to quote the first few verses?
turbosixx
New member
This supports my point. It's not faith alone but faith that works.
themuzicman
Well-known member
But it is faith alone that justifies. It is the nature of that faith that results in works.
turbosixx
New member
That is not faith alone. The bible never says faith alone, man has added that.
Do you know of an example of judgment that isn't based on works? Here's another.
Why was the one talent man cast into outer darkness?
themuzicman
Well-known member
No, it's just that when salvation/eternal life is mentioned, its condition is faith, not works.
If we were judged on works, we'd all be hell bound.
Because the Jewish individual standing in front of Jesus at that time refused to embrace the Messiah, the "I am" sent to him.
turbosixx
New member
That's because those of faith will have works and that's not faith alone.
No one can earn salvation by works that's why it's a gift. The question is who is worthy of the gift.
2 Thes. 1:5 This is a plain indication of God's righteous judgment so that you will be considered worthy of the kingdom of God, for which indeed you are suffering.
Next few verses tell us who God will judge?
8 dealing out retribution to those who do not know God and to those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus.
So the one talent man was sent to hell because of the man Jesus was talking to?