Pearl Harbor and FDR?

[PureX]

The sympathy factor of the American people was needed.

No it wasn't. All it takes is an actual attack, and we're more than ready to fight. We don't even care if we're actually fighting the attackers. (Iraq, for example.)

 

[drbrumley]

No it wasn't. All it takes is an actual attack, and we're more than ready to fight. We don't even care if we're actually fighting the attackers. (Iraq, for example.)

Sure that would have enlisted some sympathy. But the point is that there was a 100 times more sympathy after getting whooped like that. I mean men were coming in off the streets in greater numbers because the news was really bad coming out of Pearl. If Pearl was actually repelled then you wouldn't have seen the numbers we did. And that's a fact.

 

[Brother Vinny]

Sure that would have enlisted some sympathy. But the point is that there was a 100 times more sympathy after getting whooped like that. I mean men were coming in off the streets in greater numbers because the news was really bad coming out of Pearl. If Pearl was actually repelled then you wouldn't have seen the numbers we did. And that's a fact.

He's got a point. Before Pearl, there was a strong dissenting voice in America against getting involved in the war. It was nigh impossible to not get involved after Pearl. If we'd displayed more readiness at the outset, we might've entered the war with a divided America backing the effort.

 

[PureX]

Sure that would have enlisted some sympathy. But the point is that there was a 100 times more sympathy after getting whooped like that. I mean men were coming in off the streets in greater numbers because the news was really bad coming out of Pearl. If Pearl was actually repelled then you wouldn't have seen the numbers we did. And that's a fact.

If you really believe that a U.S. president deliberately allowed thousands of American soldiers to be killed, and hundreds of millions of dollars worth of necessary equipment to be destroyed immediately before he intended to enter a global war, just so that he could enter the war with lots of public support, then nothing I or anyone else can say will dissuade you from such lunacy. You will have long since chosen to leave reason far behind.

 

[One Ugly Christian]

If you really believe that a U.S. president deliberately allowed thousands of American soldiers to be killed, and hundreds of millions of dollars worth of necessary equipment to be destroyed immediately before he intended to enter a global war, just so that he could enter the war with lots of public support, then nothing I or anyone else can say will dissuade you from such lunacy. You will have long since chosen to leave reason far behind.

All great points you make above PX. I'd point out that the sinking on only one ship and the deaths of, what was it, about 150 Americans got us into WW 1. It wasn't an American ship and it was warned to stay out of British waters. Then evidence that this was a deliberate ploy by Wilson, the British high command and some in the Royal Family is much, much stronger than the FDR conspiracy story.

 

[PureX]

All great points you make above PX. I'd point out that the sinking on only one ship and the deaths of, what was it, about 150 Americans got us into WW 1. It wasn't an American ship and it was warned to stay out of British waters. Then evidence that this was a deliberate ploy by Wilson, the British high command and some in the Royal Family is much, much stronger than the FDR conspiracy story.

And "Remember the Main!", the cry used to cause the Spanish-American war. Though that was actually very likely an accident that was deliberately played up to be an attack.

I'm not saying that artifice and politics are never involved. I'm just saying that they're not the sole instigation for these events.

 

[drbrumley]

If you really believe that a U.S. president deliberately allowed thousands of American soldiers to be killed, and hundreds of millions of dollars worth of necessary equipment to be destroyed immediately before he intended to enter a global war, just so that he could enter the war with lots of public support, then nothing I or anyone else can say will dissuade you from such lunacy. You will have long since chosen to leave reason far behind.

You really are something else.

Your the one who left reason behind. One of your problems is you won't look at facts and secondly, that your trust in government has clouded your judgements.

 

[bybee]

You really are something else.

Your the one who left reason behind. One of your problems is you won't look at facts and secondly, that your trust in government has clouded your judgements.

He only trusts when the power in office is liberal!

 

[One Ugly Christian]

You really are something else.

Your the one who left reason behind. One of your problems is you won't look at facts and secondly, that your trust in government has clouded your judgements.

That's exactly what evolutionists say when you don't agree with their version of "the facts."

And you prove your bias by not being able to clearly see that P clearly stated several instances where the government lied and/or plotted to get us into a war. Saying that his "trust in the government has clouded [his] judgement" is pathetic.

 

[resurrected]

Read:

THOSE ANGRY DAYS
Roosevelt, Lindbergh, And America’s Fight Over World War II, 1939-1941

“With this stirring book, Lynne Olson confirms her status as our era’s foremost chronicler of World War II politics and diplomacy. Those Angry Days tells the extraordinary tale of America’s internal debate about whether and how to stop Hitler. Filled with fascinating anecdotes and surprising twists, the text raises moral and practical questions that we still struggle with today.” –Former U.S. Secretary of State Madeleine K. Albright

Set in the years 1939 to 1941, Those Angry Days tells the story of the no-holds-barred debate that raged in America over what its role should be in World War II. Should the country forsake its traditional isolationism and come to the aid of Britain, then on the brink of defeat by Hitler — or go even further and enter the war? The stakes could not have been higher: Britain’s survival, certainly, but also the very shape and future of America.

then we'll talk

 

[drbrumley]

That's exactly what evolutionists say when you don't agree with their version of "the facts."

Um, that's basically what everyone says. Even Christians.

And you prove your bias by not being able to clearly see that P clearly stated several instances where the government lied and/or plotted to get us into a war. Saying that his "trust in the government has clouded [his] judgement" is pathetic.

I saw clearly what he said and he decided to run away from that. He agrees this happens, but when it's FDR and Pearl Harbor, well, we didn't know beforehand when clearly we did. And didn't bother to tell anyone. Keep on runnin...

 

[Totton Linnet]

FDR stunned the members of his first cabinet meeting, he banged on the table and said "I want to be a war President"

.....high level Mason Roosevelt.....grabbed everybody's gold for the Federal Reserve Roosevelt.