"OSAS" people are not answering this question.

[Danoh]

Could someone who supports OSAS please explain this to me? When I try to make sense of OSAS I can’t understand how this fits into the logic.

In 1 Cor. 6 there is a list of sinners that Paul says will not inherit the kingdom of God. What I don’t understand is, if what determines if we are saved or not is if we’re a believer, then why does Paul ask believers “do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of Heaven"? Why does he tell them, Do not be deceived and then give them this list of sinners if sin has nothing to do with salvation because Jesus’s work took care of that?

What does this mean to you?

1 Corinthians 5:

5. To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

While you are at it, study out also, where else Paul uses the phrase "be not deceived."

Often several uses, when placed side by side, will either show a contrast between them, or show that they are talking about the same thing. And this helps shed further light on what the one passage is talking about.

 

[Danoh]

there are tons of verses claim that you cannot inherit God's kingdom if you don't produce good fruit.


why do you think there are so many warning about not producing fruit?

Jesus says to be faithful until the end. He also says we will be judged according to what we have done.

It is just boastful to claim to be saved because Jesus does not judge anyone yet.

OSAS is false doctrine.

BTW, OSAS believers are actually following Calvin's teaching. Those saved ones are the elect, according to this doctrine.

Calvinism sees election as the issue of those elected to be saved.

Many MADists do not - rather the issue of election is understood to be the issue of service.

Isaiah 42:

1. Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.

Isaiah 43.

10. Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither
shall there be after me.

Acts 13:

46. Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you: but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles.
47. For so hath the Lord commanded us, saying, I have set thee to be a light of the Gentiles, that thou shouldest be for salvation unto the ends of the earth.

Romans 11:

30. For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
31. Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.
32. For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

Romans 12:

1. I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.

All that is the issue of the service that God sets one apart unto, on their belief of the gospel by which He calls the lost.

 

[turbosixx]

What does this mean to you?

1 Corinthians 5:

5. To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

This is how I understand it.
I have decided to deliver such a one to Satan
Kick him out of the assembly and back into the world so he will have to decide if he wants to serve the flesh or the spirit. They should have already done so without Paul having to tell them.
2 You have become arrogant and have not mourned instead, so that the one who had done this deed would be removed from your midst.




so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

James 5: 19 My brethren, if any among you strays from the truth and one turns him back, 20 let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins.

From an OSAS standpoint, I don’t understand why Paul is telling them to get this man out if sin has nothing to do with salvation?

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

You don't realize they are dismissing many of those inconvenient verses?

You mean like you dismiss ALL of the Bible except, Matthew, Mark,
and Luke? You also claim Paul is an anti-Christ. You despise those
that believe in the Trinity, as well.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Are you Jerry's brother?

I already told you very clearly and even supported what I said with scripture. The works of the flesh....which Paul lists in that portion of scripture....are performed by those in the flesh (the unrighteous....the unsaved.....the unjustified.) Believers are not in the flesh.

What I will not agree with you on is your definition of what it means to be in the flesh and who can do those works of the flesh. That's what you want from me and you won't get it. BECAUSE you are wrong....simple enough.

elo, oct23, gt, lazy and meshak are poor lost souls.

 

[meshak]

Calvinism sees election as the issue of those elected to be saved.

Many MADists do not - rather the issue of election is understood to be the issue of service.

Isaiah 42:

1. Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.

Isaiah 43.

10. Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither
shall there be after me.

Acts 13:

46. Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you: but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles.
47. For so hath the Lord commanded us, saying, I have set thee to be a light of the Gentiles, that thou shouldest be for salvation unto the ends of the earth.

Romans 11:

30. For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
31. Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.
32. For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

Romans 12:

1. I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.

All that is the issue of the service that God sets one apart unto, on their belief of the gospel by which He calls the lost.

Why do you people hung up on elect and saved?

Why do you make such an issue with semantics? It seems that you guys don't have confidence about your faith.

Jesus' salvation is simple and clear.

It is all about being true to Him by striving to follow all His teachings.

It is not about boasting your knowledge of doctrines.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

Are you Jerry's brother?

I already told you very clearly and even supported what I said with scripture. The works of the flesh....which Paul lists in that portion of scripture....are performed by those in the flesh (the unrighteous....the unsaved.....the unjustified.) Believers are not in the flesh.

What I will not agree with you on is your definition of what it means to be in the flesh and who can do those works of the flesh. That's what you want from me and you won't get it. BECAUSE you are wrong....simple enough.

So far you have given no answer to any believer who is struggling with sin.

The remedy is found in confessing (to Christ)and forsaking ones sinning and being filled with the Holy Spirit (from Christ)

The remedy is not that one became a Christian years ago, and that if anyone sins then they are not saved, as you preach.

LA

 

[genuineoriginal]

Neither of those verses state that Jesus knew them or that they knew Jesus. The Lord will say, "I never knew..." somebody. You ought to figure out who never knew Jesus and why. See 1 John 3:6-10.

In Revelation 2-3 Jesus is speaking to believers that He knows.
He reminds each group of believers that He knows them and that He knows what they are doing.

If you are familiar with the parable of the sower, you would recognize that Jesus is warning them against becoming like the people that received the seed in stony places and among thorns.

These are not people that never knew Jesus.
These are not people that Jesus never knew.
These are people that know Jesus and that Jesus knows, but He is still warning them that they are not going to make it into the kingdom if they don't change what they are doing.

 

[genuineoriginal]

Shasta's "strength" to sin or not sin allegedly comes from God, yet he still sins occasionally. You don't see a problem with that?

I see a problem in demanding that God is to blame for your choices.

The children of Israel were commanded by God to keep the commandments.

God did not make it so they could not break the commandments (sin), but He did ensure that every morning and evening they would have the choice of whether to keep following Him or not.

In the same manner, God will not make it so a believing Christian cannot sin against Him, but will expect a believing Christian to make the choice to follow Him every morning and evening.

 

[genuineoriginal]

Faith is also a gift from God, all we do is extend it. You didnt even do that.

Romans 12:3 For through the grace given to me I say to everyone among you not to think more highly of himself than he ought to think; but to think so as to have sound judgment, as God has allotted to each a measure of faith.

Matthew 25:14-30 speaks of three servants that were each given a measure of faith, but the third one was cast into outer darkness because he did not do anything with his faith except hide it.

 

[genuineoriginal]

What is translated there as "perfect" means complete, we are complete in Him.

There is a difference between not lacking anything needed and not lacking anything at all.

That is why the modern American English definition of "perfect" creates a false doctrine when used in that verse, but the definition of "mature" does not create a false doctrine.

So, "grow up" is the essence of the verse that says to be "perfect".

 

[genuineoriginal]

Cant answer the questions i asked can you.

You need to get out of the mindset of the Pharisees before you will be open to the answers.

I ask simply because something so important that you can lose what you didnt earn, is important to know, yet is suspiciously missing from the workers claims.

What you are asking for is not going to help you because you are asking the wrong question.

Here is an example from the Bible.
King David did two things that are listed in the Law as being offenses that he was to be put to death for committing.
So, we know that the offenses were "mortal sins".

Why didn't King David's actions result in a loss of salvation?

It was not because there were only one or two "lapses" but it was because King David had a record of pleasing God through his faith.

Hebrews 11:32-33 32 And what shall I more say? for the time would fail me to tell of Gedeon, and of Barak, and of Samson, and of Jephthae; of David also, and Samuel, and of the prophets: 33 Who through faith subdued kingdoms, wrought righteousness, obtained promises, stopped the mouths of lions.​

So, the answer to your question has not changed.
The answer is to stop thinking like a Pharisee about what you must do and what you can get away with not doing.
The answer is to think like the people listed in Hebrews 11 and make sure you are pleasing God through your faith.

 

[genuineoriginal]

I don't believe God abolished His law, so don't spread lies about me. He abolished certain laws

Can you see what you just did?

 

[genuineoriginal]

Because I'm talking to you who are in the flesh. I'm trying to tell you about how you can graduate from school. You don't need to remain under the schoolmaster. You should thank me.

Some people drop out of school without learning a thing from the schoolmaster.
Other people master the lessons, graduate, and are able to apply those lessons to the rest of their life.

Neither of those two groups is under the schoolmaster.

 

[God's Truth]

So, you're both wrong on that "important point". The important point being Sin requires there be a LAW that can be violated.

Romans 4:15
Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.​

Romans 5:14 Nevertheless, death reigned from the time of Adam to the time of Moses, even over those who did not sin by breaking a command, as did Adam, who is a pattern of the one to come.


Did you read that? ARE YOU GOING TO STOP PREACHING FALSENESS NOW?

People SINNED, even those who NEVER HAD A COMMAND FROM GOD.

 

[God's Truth]

Guess you don't get the verse I gave you....where there is no law there is no transgression. It just went right over your head....thus you missed the only important point.

Acts 17:30 In the past God overlooked such ignorance, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent.

 

[God's Truth]

Are you Jerry's brother?

I already told you very clearly and even supported what I said with scripture. The works of the flesh....which Paul lists in that portion of scripture....are performed by those in the flesh (the unrighteous....the unsaved.....the unjustified.) Believers are not in the flesh.

A believer is IN THE FLESH if they are STILL SINNING.

It is NOT a work of flesh to obey Jesus!

 

[God's Truth]

And you're lying. Shame on you. I didn't "dodge" any of your questions. You just don't like the answer. Clearly, you'll get answers you like from God's UNtruth. I suggest you two go talk among yourselves.

It is never ever of the flesh to obey Jesus! Jesus' words are SPIRIT AND LIFE. John 6:63.

It is not of the flesh to obey Jesus. It is NOT a sin to obey Jesus.

 

[God's Truth]

there are tons of verses claim that you cannot inherit God's kingdom if you don't produce good fruit.


why do you think there are so many warning about not producing fruit?

Jesus says to be faithful until the end. He also says we will be judged according to what we have done.

It is just boastful to claim to be saved because Jesus does not judge anyone yet.

OSAS is false doctrine.

BTW, OSAS believers are actually following Calvin's teaching. Those saved ones are the elect, according to this doctrine.

They listen to Paul and they listen to what they misunderstand Paul as saying.

You hate Paul and misunderstand what he says.

You both are in grave error.

 

[God's Truth]

What does this mean to you?

1 Corinthians 5:

5. To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

While you are at it, study out also, where else Paul uses the phrase "be not deceived."

Often several uses, when placed side by side, will either show a contrast between them, or show that they are talking about the same thing. And this helps shed further light on what the one passage is talking about.

If someone is delivered unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh---it is in hopes that they will REPENT OF THEIR SINS!