Not All Elect Will Repent, Will they?
- Thread starter Samie
- Start date
So what prevents you from believing Paul when he said he preached the gospel of Christ? Is Paul, to you, not telling the truth?
:yawn: :yawn: Ad hominem Eph 4:14
GM can't stand the heat of truth, he ran away.
ttruscott
Well-known member
There is an earthly kingdom that contains Cain, false believers, condemned already. They are doomed.
The sinful elect are the people of the eternal heavenly kingdom sown (not created) into the world by the Son of Man. Everyone of them will repent and be saved. That is what elect means...they are under the promise of salvation. And you do not have to be a sinner to "become" elect for the holy angels are elect also.
In Matt 8:11-12, Jesus was referring to the kingdom of heaven, from which some of the children of that same kingdom will be thrown out. This simply proves some of the elect will perish, won't they?
To the Colossians whom he called the elect of God (Col 3:12), Paul wrote:
Colossians 1:21-23 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight: If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister
Notice his words of warning: "IF ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard". If they continue, but if not, then they no longer are holy, unblameable and unreproveable in His sight, but instead the apostle tells the Colossians:
Colossians 3:25 ... he that doeth wrong shall receive for the wrong which he hath done: and there is no respect of persons.
Seems clear to me that Paul is in harmony with what Christ said in Matt 8:11-12. Sadly, the "P" in Calvinism's TULIP is not.
But I don't blame John Calvin for teaching what he knew as truth. I don't think he is accountable. Who are to be held accountable are those who had known better but instead continue to defend and teach what they already know is NOT in accord with what the Lord said.
Colossians 1:21-23 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight: If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister
Notice his words of warning: "IF ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard". If they continue, but if not, then they no longer are holy, unblameable and unreproveable in His sight, but instead the apostle tells the Colossians:
Colossians 3:25 ... he that doeth wrong shall receive for the wrong which he hath done: and there is no respect of persons.
Seems clear to me that Paul is in harmony with what Christ said in Matt 8:11-12. Sadly, the "P" in Calvinism's TULIP is not.
But I don't blame John Calvin for teaching what he knew as truth. I don't think he is accountable. Who are to be held accountable are those who had known better but instead continue to defend and teach what they already know is NOT in accord with what the Lord said.
:chuckle:
Good. He's back.
beameup
New member
You have yet to understand the difference between "carnal" Christians and "spiritual" Christians. That is the "point" Paul is making.
The "carnal" Christian lives according to his EGO and does not walk in the Spirit. Walking according to the EGO leads to "wood, hay, and stubble" at the Judgment Seat of Christ.
beameup
New member
You have to compare all the scriptures on this subject in order to resolve any perceived "conflicts".
You have, so far, just "plucked" one verse, out of context, to illustrate a "doctrine". :nono:
You were saying to compare all the scriptures, so what verses have you offered that speak of "If they continue" or something to that effect? None so far, brother.
Here are some:
Ezekiel 18:20-24 20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him. 21 But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die. 22 All his transgressions that he hath committed, they shall not be mentioned unto him: in his righteousness that he hath done he shall live. 23 Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live? 24 But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die.
Jeremiah 15:19-20 19 Therefore thus saith the LORD, If thou return, then will I bring thee again, and thou shalt stand before me: and if thou take forth the precious from the vile, thou shalt be as my mouth: let them return unto thee; but return not thou unto them. 20 And I will make thee unto this people a fenced brasen wall: and they shall fight against thee, but they shall not prevail against thee: for I am with thee to save thee and to deliver thee, saith the LORD.
Matthew 24:13 13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Romans 2:5-10 5 But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God; 6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds: 7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life: 8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, 9 Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile; {Gentile: Gr. Greek} 10 But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile: {Gentile: Gr. Greek}
Romans 12:21 21 Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.
Titus 3:8 8 This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.
Hebrews 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
2 Peter 2:20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
Did you notice from the verses quoted that people need to continue overcoming evil with good?
Now, your turn to offer verses. There are lots of them in Scriptures. I'll wait.
beameup
New member
It's blatantly obvious that you have no clue concerning the Body of Christ
and the scriptures related to that unique category of "the elect".
So, continue to "pluck verses", here, there, and everywhere to support your "doctrine".
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Expected response from one who PRETENDS to know Scriptures but could not provide any when asked.
Let's reverse the situation. Ask me about what you call my doctrine. I'll answer with Scriptures, NOT just with a mouthful of ad hominems just like what you're doing.
If they believe that they are elect, why should they.
Well, the more they are obligated as Scriptures indicate. Writing to the elect (see 1 Pet 1:1, 2), Peter said:
1 Peter 3:15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear
Many of the elect will burn in hell :chuckle: