My Ignored List

[intojoy]

Now THAT I'll take as a compliment!

While it is true that only those who love The Lord actually follow the leading of the Spirit of God, it is a false assumption that those not following have no relationship to God if those who are in Christ choose to serve themselves rather than being bond slaves to Him. They are still in Him if they place their faith in He that as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness was Himself lifted up as their propitiation my friend.

 

[genuineoriginal]

Do we keep them by our own efforts or by being created IN Christ as new creatures?

Both.

James 1:22-24 22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves. 23 For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass: 24 For he beholdeth himself, and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was.​

Are we our own workmanship or God's?

We are the workmanship of God, created in Christ Jesus, to do good works, not wicked works.

Ephesians 2:10 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.​

To do the good works we were created to do, we need to be good workmen that study the Word and depart from iniquity.

2 Timothy 2:15,19 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. 19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.​

 

[IMJerusha]

Are you related to God's unTruth? You certainly sound like her. Here again you are trying to tell me all about me and my problems, and you are flaunting your little self upon your catwalk. :chuckle:


I will never play the fakey "holier than thou" role you insist on playing. It isn't an "essential" of salvation. In fact, it's the sign of a hypocrite....as I"ve told you before. You would rather we all simper like Jason, wouldn't you? Alas, not all of us will join you in your white wash party.

"I may be able to speak the languages of human beings and even of angels, but if I have no love, my speech is no more than a noisy gong or a clanging bell. I may have the gift of inspired preaching; I may have all knowledge and understand all secrets; I may have all the faith needed to move mountains—but if I have no love, I am nothing. I may give away everything I have, and even give up my body to be burned—but if I have no love, this does me no good. Love is patient and kind; it is not jealous or conceited or proud; love is not ill-mannered or selfish or irritable; love does not keep a record of wrongs; love is not happy with evil, but is happy with the truth. Love never gives up; and its faith, hope, and patience never fail. Love is eternal. There are inspired messages, but they are temporary; there are gifts of speaking in strange tongues, but they will cease; there is knowledge, but it will pass. For our gifts of knowledge and of inspired messages are only partial; but when what is perfect comes, then what is partial will disappear. When I was a child, my speech, feelings, and thinking were all those of a child; now that I am an adult, I have no more use for childish ways. What we see now is like a dim image in a mirror; then we shall see face-to-face. What I know now is only partial; then it will be complete—as complete as God's knowledge of me. Meanwhile these three remain: faith, hope, and love; and the greatest of these is love." 1 Corinthians 13:1-13

All that belittling...does it serve God?...No.

Not a one of them preaches we step in and out of Christ like He's a revolving door. You do. That's because you try to follow the law for righteousness....in spite of all your denials to the contrary.

Putting a nasty face on Truth doesn't make Truth nasty.

“I am the real vine, and my Father is the gardener. He breaks off every branch in me that does not bear fruit, and he prunes every branch that does bear fruit, so that it will be clean and bear more fruit. You have been made clean already by the teaching I have given you. Remain united to me, and I will remain united to you. A branch cannot bear fruit by itself; it can do so only if it remains in the vine. In the same way you cannot bear fruit unless you remain in me.
I am the vine, and you are the branches. Those who remain in me, and I in them, will bear much fruit; for you can do nothing without me. Those who do not remain in me are thrown out like a branch and dry up; such branches are gathered up and thrown into the fire, where they are burned. If you remain in me and my words remain in you, then you will ask for anything you wish, and you shall have it. My Father's glory is shown by your bearing much fruit; and in this way you become my disciples. I love you just as the Father loves me; remain in my love. If you obey my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have obeyed my Father's commands and remain in his love." John 15:1-10

So much for what Yeshua doesn't say.

"If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and there is no truth in us. But if we confess our sins to God, he will keep his promise and do what is right: he will forgive us our sins and purify us from all our wrongdoing." John 1:8-9

So much for what John doesn't say.

"So then, confess your sins to one another and pray for one another, so that you will be healed. The prayer of a good person has a powerful effect." James 5:16

So much for what James doesn't say.

No one can take us from Yeshua but we can be tempted away (Hebrews 6:1-10, so much for what Paul doesn't say), we can sin, we can confess and repent and in His forgiveness, we find our way back to Him; we are purified. Yeshua doesn't live in sin so when we sin, we are not in Him but rather listening to and responding to HaSatan. If you want to liken that to a revolving door, you go right ahead. I don't. It's just God's Word and I believe it.

 

[Nang]

It doesn't make any difference to you what someone preaches God's Law for. You read the word "Law" and come unglued in condemnation. I have never put forth God's Law for salvation but rather for the same reason Yeshua, Paul, James, John, Matthew, Peter, Mark, Luke, and Jude have. Get over it.

Reformers teach ^this^ as the "Third Use of the Law."

Have you and I ever discussed this?

 

[IMJerusha]

Reformers teach ^this^ as the "Third Use of the Law."

Have you and I ever discussed this?

I don't think so. I've never heard of it.

 

[Nang]

I don't think so. I've never heard of it.

It is a term used by Reformers to explain the place of the Law of God in the lives of believers; considering the first two purposes of the Law:

1. To reveal sinfulness to all men, in order . . .

2. To draw men of their need of the righteousness of Jesus Christ.

But after men are drawn and imputed with the righteousness of Christ, and freed from obligation under the letter of the Law, there is a third use and purpose of the Holy Law in the believers life.

The Westminster Confession of Faith reads thusly:

"Although true believers be not under the Law as a Covenant of Works, to be thereby justified, or condemned; yet is it of great use to them, as well as to others; in that, as a rule of life informing them of the will of God, and their duty, it directs and binds them to walk accordingly; discovering also the sinful pollutions of their nature, hearts, and lives; so as, examining themselves thereby, they may come to further conviction of, humiliation for, and hatred against sin, together with a clearer sight of the need they have of Christ, and the perfection of His obedience. It is likewise of use to the regenerate, to restrain their corruptions, in that it forbids sin: and the threatenings of it serve to show hat even their sins deserve; and what afflictions, in this life, they may expect for them, although freed from the curse thereof threatened in the Law. The promises of it, in like manner, show them God's approbation of obedience, and what blessings they may expect upon the performance thereof: although not as due to them by the Law as a Covenant of Works. So as, a man's doing good, and refraining from evil, because the Law encourageth to the one, and deterreth from the other, is not evidence of his being under the Law; and not under grace.

Neither are the forementioned uses of the Law contrary to the grace of the Gospel, but do sweetly comply with it; the Spirit of Christ subduing and enabling the will of man to do that freely, and cheerfully, which the will of God, revealed in the Law, requireth to be done."

Westminster Confession of Faith, Chapter XIX:VI & VII.

This Third Use of the Law is the guide to the Christian life of morality and holiness (the spirit of the Law) which prohibits the practice of lawlessness (Antinomianism).

As I understand your reasoning, it is the same as what you have testified.

Nang

 

[IMJerusha]

It is a term used by Reformers to explain the place of the Law of God in the lives of believers; considering the first two purposes of the Law:

1. To reveal sinfulness to all men, in order . . .

2. To draw men of their need of the righteousness of Jesus Christ.

But after men are drawn and imputed with the righteousness of Christ, and freed from obligation under the letter of the Law, there is a third use and purpose of the Holy Law in the believers life.

The Westminster Confession of Faith reads thusly:

"Although true believers be not under the Law as a Covenant of Works, to be thereby justified, or condemned; yet is it of great use to them, as well as to others; in that, as a rule of life informing them of the will of God, and their duty, it directs and binds them to walk accordingly; discovering also the sinful pollutions of their nature, hearts, and lives; so as, examining themselves thereby, they may come to further conviction of, humiliation for, and hatred against sin, together with a clearer sight of the need they have of Christ, and the perfection of His obedience. It is likewise of use to the regenerate, to restrain their corruptions, in that it forbids sin: and the threatenings of it serve to show hat even their sins deserve; and what afflictions, in this life, they may expect for them, although freed from the curse thereof threatened in the Law. The promises of it, in like manner, show them God's approbation of obedience, and what blessings they may expect upon the performance thereof: although not as due to them by the Law as a Covenant of Works. So as, a man's doing good, and refraining from evil, because the Law encourageth to the one, and deterreth from the other, is not evidence of his being under the Law; and not under grace.

Neither are the forementioned uses of the Law contrary to the grace of the Gospel, but do sweetly comply with it; the Spirit of Christ subduing and enabling the will of man to do that freely, and cheerfully, which the will of God, revealed in the Law, requireth to be done."

Westminster Confession of Faith, Chapter XIX:VI & VII.

This Third Use of the Law is the guide to the Christian life of morality and holiness (the spirit of the Law) which prohibits the practice of lawlessness (Antinomianism).

As I understand your reasoning, it is the same as what you have testified.

Nang

Interesting. My understanding came solely from Scripture. Thank you for this info.

"subduing and enabling the will of man to do that freely..."

I'm thinking that the word "subduing" is an incorrect interpretation. Compelling is more in line with Scripture. It's an important difference especially for the Presbyterians who now accept homosexuality and other avant garde lifestyles contrary to God's Word.

 

[Nang]

=IMJerusha;3716171 My understanding came solely from Scripture.

Indeed!

Scriptural references upon which the WCF are ALSO based, can be posted upon request.

 

[glorydaz]

Both.

James 1:22-24 22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves. 23 For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass: 24 For he beholdeth himself, and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was.​

We are the workmanship of God, created in Christ Jesus, to do good works, not wicked works.

Ephesians 2:10 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.​

To do the good works we were created to do, we need to be good workmen that study the Word and depart from iniquity.

2 Timothy 2:15,19 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. 19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.​

What we do by our own efforts will be counted as stubble. It is God who works in us both to will and do His good pleasure. As I said, we are His workmanship. He gives us the desire to please Him in all we do. Those who are the Lord's depart from iniquity when they are born of the Spirit...all things are new. Those who aren't, remain in iniquity.

Philippians 2:13
For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.​

 

[genuineoriginal]

What we do by our own efforts will be counted as stubble. It is God who works in us both to will and do His good pleasure. As I said, we are His workmanship. He gives us the desire to please Him in all we do. Those who are the Lord's depart from iniquity when they are born of the Spirit...all things are new. Those who aren't, remain in iniquity.

Philippians 2:13
For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.​

Looks like you missed the real message.

Philippians 2:12-15 12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. 13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure. 14 Do all things without murmurings and disputings: 15 That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;​

 

[glorydaz]

Neither are the forementioned uses of the Law contrary to the grace of the Gospel, but do sweetly comply with it; the Spirit of Christ subduing and enabling the will of man to do that freely, and cheerfully, which the will of God, revealed in the Law, requireth to be done."

Since it's the Spirit subduing and enabling the will of man...which I agree with, there is no possibility a believer would ever "step out" of Christ while he is practicing iniquity.

 

[glorydaz]

Looks like you missed the real message.

Philippians 2:12-15 12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. 13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure. 14 Do all things without murmurings and disputings: 15 That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;​

I'm thinking you missed the real message. Looks like you are changing the word "out" to "for". Work it out...let your salvation come out where it can be seen. Don't hide the light that is in you under a barrel...."among whom ye shine as lights in the world." God is doing His work in you, and while you are in the midst of a crooked and perverse people, you are, indeed, separate from them.

 

[IMJerusha]

What we do by our own efforts will be counted as stubble.

Philippians 2:13
For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.​

Reading the entirety of Chapter 2, especially verses 1-12, it's clear that verse 13 does not mean that God is responsible to do the work in us but rather the responsibility of obedience to His call falls to us or Paul would not request obedience in the matter of selfish ambition, boasting, looking out for one another, etc. God does compel us through the Ruach in the same manner as Paul is compelling the Philippians. We have to be willing. We can choose to disobey. Recurrent sin is proof of this though some want to state that recurrent sin is proof that one was not saved in the first place. The problem is if one states this, one had best understand that they are refuting their original understanding of verse 13 not to mention Romans 10:9.

 

[genuineoriginal]

I'm thinking you missed the real message. Looks like you are changing the word "out" to "for". Work it out...let your salvation come out where it can be seen. Don't hide the light that is in you under a barrel...."among whom ye shine as lights in the world." God is doing His work in you, and while you are in the midst of a crooked and perverse people, you are, indeed, separate from them.

It is amazing what you find out when you look at the words used in Scripture without them being clouded by a man-made doctrine.

work out your own salvation
κατεργάζομαι katergazomai

1. to perform, accomplish, achieve
   
2. to work out i.e. to do that from which something results
   
   • of things: bring about, result in
3. to fashion i.e. render one fit for a thing

So, if you are trying to stop me from doing those things that result in salvation, you are working for the wrong side.

 

[resurrected]

work out your own salvation

i make my salvation do windsprints three times a week :thumb:

 

[freelight]

rejecting knowledge...

rejecting knowledge...

~*~*~

The only few who are on my 'ignore' list are those who have proved their 'ignorance', or have been disrespectful, vile, idiotic or insane in their approach and demeanor. No one needs to contend with such mentalities, who are a bane to existence and a displeasure to humanity.




pj​

 

[resurrected]

~*~*~

The only few who are on my 'ignore' list are those who have proved their 'ignorance', or have been disrespectful, vile, idiotic or insane in their approach and demeanor. No one needs to contend with such mentalities, who are a bane to existence and a displeasure to humanity.




pj​

:think:


ignorant?

me

disrespectful?

me

vile?

me

idiotic?

me

insane in their approach and demeanor?

me

a bane to existence?

me

and a displeasure to humanity?

me again :banana:

 

[glorydaz]

It is amazing what you find out when you look at the words used in Scripture without them being clouded by a man-made doctrine.

work out your own salvation
κατεργάζομαι katergazomai

1. to perform, accomplish, achieve
   
2. to work out i.e. to do that from which something results
   • of things: bring about, result in
3. to fashion i.e. render one fit for a thing

So, if you are trying to stop me from doing those things that result in salvation, you are working for the wrong side.

You "doing" those things that result in salvation? :nono:


Salvation is a gift...."not of ourselves". Thus your boasting of the "things" you do is but human pride.....attempting to take glory that belongs to Jesus Christ alone.

Let's use this one....to do that from which something results. When we allow that which has been done in us to come out where others can see, we are letting the light that is in us shine in the midst of a wicked and perverse nation. Which is exactly what I said.

Phil. 2:12
Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure. Do all things without murmurings and disputings: That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;​

This "treasure" should not be kept hidden...He who saved us dwells in us. We manifest the results of our salvation to all the world...the Fruit of the Spirit is what men can see.

2 Cor. 4:7-10
But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us. We are troubled on every side, yet not distressed; we are perplexed, but not in despair; Persecuted, but not forsaken; cast down, but not destroyed; Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body.​

 

[IMJerusha]

You "doing" those things that result in salvation? :nono:


Salvation is a gift...."not of ourselves". Thus your boasting of the "things" you do is but human pride.....attempting to take glory that belongs to Jesus Christ alone.

Let's use this one....to do that from which something results. When we allow that which has been done in us to come out where others can see, we are letting the light that is in us shine in the midst of a wicked and perverse nation. Which is exactly what I said.

Phil. 2:12
Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure. Do all things without murmurings and disputings: That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;​

This "treasure" should not be kept hidden...He who saved us dwells in us. We manifest the results of our salvation to all the world...the Fruit of the Spirit is what men can see.

2 Cor. 4:7-10
But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us. We are troubled on every side, yet not distressed; we are perplexed, but not in despair; Persecuted, but not forsaken; cast down, but not destroyed; Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body.​

Pay attention, not once has Genuine stated that salvation is of himself or that his "doing" is not by the leading of the Ruach. What good is criticizing the work of the Ruach in people?

 

[glorydaz]

Pay attention, not once has Genuine stated that salvation is of himself or that his "doing" is not by the leading of the Ruach. What is criticizing the work of the Ruach in people?

Okay, Miss Buttinsky. You probably don't see since you preach the same thing. "Me doing those things which result in salvation." Do I really need to spell it out for you?

So, if you are trying to stop me from doing those things that result in salvation, you are working for the wrong side.